Relations between Black women and Asian women

[lena99]

I hear a lot about Black woman/White woman and the whole racial politics, history, etc. and I just wanted to ask some of the Asian women on the board their perception of things.

Do you think the whole 'women of color' label makes Asian Women and Black Women a group with common interests or do you think it's just made up jargon?

Do you think Black women and Asian women get along well? poorly? Do you think it's not even as issue-Black women and Asian women rarely associate?

I would appreciate any responses.

Lena99

[yoMAMA]

IMO "women of color", or "men of color", or "this of color, that of color".......[or of non-color ] is more of a function of "identity politics" than anything else.

[Hiroshi2]

Good topic.



The only examples I can cite are through personal experience. My mother is japanese and has many black friends who I know she is very close to.


The Asian girls at our school don't get any backlash from the black girls at our school (something like 70 or 75% of my HS is black and female). There is one girl who is foreign, just moved here from Japan like a year ago. And she's on the cheerleading squad and everything and most people up here love her, though they did talk about her a lot behind her back when she first got here.


So as far as I can tell, it's all good. Though there are negative stories as well, I'm sure. I really don't have a clue how asian women view black women though.

[lena99]

Thanks for your responses.
They are appreciated.

[sandra]

my mother works at uc berkeley, and from the time that i was young, the co-worker that she was closest to was black. it's strange b/c my mother isn't the most open-minded person when it comes to race, but she has her fair share of black and white friends. she's chinese.

i don't know if, by being an asian woman, it would allow me to better relate to a black woman simply because we are 'women of color'. i believe that we are both double minorities. however, i feel that the prejudices we face are so different and unique to our respective races that they serve more to divide us than bring us together.

for example, i have learned that a lot of asian women - whether consciously or not - buy into the concept of karma. in the context of victims of domestic violence, they either consciously or subconsciously believe that the abuse is somehow payback or a consequence of some selfish action that took before. sounds whack, but you'd be surprised how many asian women possess this mentality.

black women, in my experience, have a more, 'oh, hell no!' attitude, as in, 'oh, hell no, he did not just do that to me. i'm going to get a restraining order on his ass.' it doesn't make them any less of victims. obviously, like asian women, they are still in a subordinate position when it comes to men. however, they are more likely to speak out against the wrong against them and fight for what's right. also, they have less of concern of saving face for the man - especially if they have no intention of getting back together with him. asian women seem to care about the man's 'face' - regardless of whether they intend on reconciliation.

these are gross generalizations, of course. but i am making these observations after two months of dealing with approximately 80 clients a week - the vast of them indigent, inner-city residents who are victims of domestic violence.

[lena99]

Kasia
Thank you for your response.

Do you think the differences in behavior, though generalizations, are real and do you think this has any effect on how women behave towards other women?

I can' t say I have ever had a great deal of Asian female friends...I had a hard time when I first got married because I was always with my husbands family, friends, community etc and I felt like the women were kind of cold compared to what I was used to. It's a generalization, but black people when someone is new to the neighborhood seem to be more open to talk or hug you or something, especially if you're a woman, even if you're not black. But I can't say any of the Asian women really spoke to me at all...I don't know if it was race or how people socialize or what, but it was hard not having women to associate with. Also, I have rarely even seen a book or TV show or movie or anything where Black and Asian people associate at all. There is something a bit screwed up about that, I think, but I am having a hard time defining what it is.

[>:^|]

Often it seems as if Blacks and Asians are pitted against each other within the majority culture. The "model minority" myth is used to divide our communities. It serves two functions: To chastise Blacks for not working harder and to allow Asians to deny or disavow racism.

[kimpossible]

Originally Posted by lena99

I felt like the women were kind of cold compared to what I was used to. It's a generalization, but black people when someone is new to the neighborhood seem to be more open to talk or hug you or something, especially if you're a woman, even if you're not black. But I can't say any of the Asian women really spoke to me at all...I don't know if it was race or how people socialize or what, but it was hard not having women to associate with.

I don't think it was necessarily race that dictated how warm or cold the women were towards you but hugging and touchy-feelyness really isn't a Japanese cultural trait. And if I remember correctly your husband is Japanese?

Originally Posted by lena99

Also, I have rarely even seen a book or TV show or movie or anything where Black and Asian people associate at all. There is something a bit screwed up about that, I think, but I am having a hard time defining what it is.

Well there's usually something screwed up in books, TV shows and movies where Asian and non-Asians (usually white) do associate. It's interesting that you'd be interested in something like that to me because one, I tend to cringe when I see or read anything purposefully non-Asian&Asian focused. Two, I see my in-laws as family... it's just how we function as a unit rather than a matter of race or cross-cultural relations. I don't seek out what could be deemed others like me as a model for interaction with my husband and our family. That's not meant in a bad way, I just don't lament a lack of interracial modeling specific to my relationship. Put another way, I don't need or desire to see my circumstances externalized for internalized comfort.

I have a bunch of questions but I'm trying not to be really nosy.

[lena99]

Originally Posted by kimpossible

I don't think it was necessarily race that dictated how warm or cold the women were towards you but hugging and touchy-feelyness really isn't a Japanese cultural trait. And if I remember correctly your husband is Japanese?



Well there's usually something screwed up in books, TV shows and movies where Asian and non-Asians (usually white) do associate. It's interesting that you'd be interested in something like that to me because one, I tend to cringe when I see or read anything purposefully non-Asian&Asian focused. Two, I see my in-laws as family... it's just how we function as a unit rather than a matter of race or cross-cultural relations. I don't seek out what could be deemed others like me as a model for interaction with my husband and our family. That's not meant in a bad way, I just don't lament a lack of interracial modeling specific to my relationship. Put another way, I don't need or desire to see my circumstances externalized for internalized comfort.

I have a bunch of questions but I'm trying not to be really nosy.

I am aware that the Japanese are not real touchy, feely. So, it still gets to me, but I learned to live with it. And my family-in-law members are nice to me, so can't complain...It's just different than what I am used to and I wonder if that cultural difference is what keeps Blacks or Asians from associating. I think you should she your relatives as just relatives, and I do find it tiresome when other people try to make everything into and interracial couple issue but...sometimes you have to be sensitive to the fact that everyone was not raised in the same culture as you and maybe they just express things is a different way.

Also, as per media, to clarify, I would like to see minority images in a positive way. ie. no more angry Korean grocer stories, B-grade rap videos pretending to be movies, racist Japanse tourist etc. I expect it to be rare, but its toooo rare.

Originally Posted by >:^|

Often it seems as if Blacks and Asians are pitted against each other within the majority culture. The "model minority" myth is used to divide our communities. It serves two functions: To chastise Blacks for not working harder and to allow Asians to deny or disavow racism.

You're probably right. Sadly.

[nonamerasian]

Originally Posted by kasia

black women, in my experience, have a more, 'oh, hell no!' attitude, as in, 'oh, hell no, he did not just do that to me. i'm going to get a restraining order on his ass.' it doesn't make them any less of victims. obviously, like asian women, they are still in a subordinate position when it comes to men. however, they are more likely to speak out against the wrong against them and fight for what's right. also, they have less of concern of saving face for the man - especially if they have no intention of getting back together with him. asian women seem to care about the man's 'face' - regardless of whether they intend on reconciliation.

these are gross generalizations, of course. but i am making these observations after two months of dealing with approximately 80 clients a week - the vast of them indigent, inner-city residents who are victims of domestic violence.

I remember when I was really really little, I was listening to a converstation of a bunch of Black women joking about supposed cultural differences between Blacks and Whites. When the topic came to spousal abuse, a woman's take was *smack*, a White woman will hold her face and cry while thinking, "why me." She won't be too loud because she doesn't want to embarrass the family. Then she said *smack*, a Black woman will hold her face and snarl while thinking of a way to get back at his ass. She will scream because she wants the whole neighborhood AND her family to fuck him up. She added that at the end, both the White and Black woman will stay with that guy because both will hang around until they either get some sense smacked into them or die.

They didn't mention Asian women.

[LCY]

Originally Posted by lena99

I hear a lot about Black woman/White woman and the whole racial politics, history, etc. and I just wanted to ask some of the Asian women on the board their perception of things.

Do you think the whole 'women of color' label makes Asian Women and Black Women a group with common interests or do you think it's just made up jargon?

Do you think Black women and Asian women get along well? poorly? Do you think it's not even as issue-Black women and Asian women rarely associate?

I would appreciate any responses.

Lena99

I have more in common with my black women friends than my white women friends. We can talk and support each other about being minorities in this country and victims of racism/discrimination. Of course, black and asian women experience racism in different ways, but at least we acknowledge that it's a big problem and that it affects our lives. So, I think "women of color" is a valid term to use.

I grew up in a predominantly asian pacific islander community so I didn't have much significant associations with other races/ethnicities until I moved.

Very interesting questions. I'd like to see more positive images of black/asian women relations as well.

[damashii]

I think its that whole refugee/immigrant diachotomy. Black people were brought to this country against their will, and have had to overcome many hardships. I think black women have developed a tougher more confrontational approach to things. While Chinese and Japanese (if those are the asians you are comparing to) came to the US on there own free will, with their cultural ideals still intact (which in some cases is not a good thing). Asian culture is somewhat shame based, so in essence they place a big deal on appearances, such as status and power.

All people have something in common, if we express ourselves sincerely and from the heart, instead of from greed and jealousy.

[moser]

^ What the?

Back on topic: I guess it depends on the black or Asian women's attitudes towards one another and how much exposure they have had with each other.

[nonamerasian]

Come on, Mojo. You know you're intimidated by all 5'4'' of me.

[moJo]

Originally Posted by nonamerasian

Come on, Mojo. You know you're intimidated by all 5'4'' of me.

*runs and hides*