attempt at changing your (asian american) consumption

[VV o n g B a]

there's been a few threads recently that have aluded to asian american consumption habits mirroring white consumption. banana has said that we basically ignore asian faces in ads when consuming products and buy from diverse brands. i gotta say that bugs me.

i can't say that i've paid much attention to advertising that includes asian faces. the only ones that comes to mind i list now. a mcdonald's flyer mentioned that they supported certain asian american causes or hired them equally or respected the culture or something. i remember thinking that if i liked mcdonald's food, then i'd eat more there, but i didn't so it didn't affect me. i also think i remember seeing parry shen in a dell commercial once. if i didn't build my own desktops, i might have taken that into consideration when buying my computer. but i also disliked dell b/c their comps were so boring. and was it pepsi that used jackie chan in some commercials? i can't say i remember if it was them or coke.

i have changed consumption habits based on reports of racism at denny's. i also prefer to shop at lowe's whenever i remember that home depot didn't say they'd pull their ads when that radioshow host said racist things (can't remember specifically which incident it was... there's so many). i've also purchased dvds and cds b/c the actors/artists were asian american.

but on the whole, i can't really say i've paid so much attention to brands that use asians in advertising. i wonder if we can affect that, even if it's only at the forum level. i'm not optimistic enuf to think that we could get even our closest asian american non-forum friends to buy into this.

there's some obvious reasons why this might fail. as in the cases i mentioned above, even if i were inclined to support the brand, other factors got in the way. but surely there's enuf brands out there that have used positive asian american representations in ads that we can compile some sort of list. and surely on that list will be something that we'd consume b/c there aren't other factors in the way including price/quality or whatever.

if pepsi was confirmed for using jackie chan, i'll consciously buy pepsi cans at target instead of coke next time b/c i have no particular preference either way. the ad will be the scale tipper.

support:
mcdonalds - support asian american causes
dell - parry shen commercial
pepsi? - jackie chan commercial even tho it might have been a bit stereotypical
lost - positive representation
heroes - same as above
survivor - positive representation even if in questionable setting
houston rockets - yao
us sports teams w/ asian players? - maybe too many of these in sports we don't care about
mtvchi/k/desi - too bad u need to have mutually exclusive directtv packages. too bad they didn't combine into one channel
azn channel? - dunno much about this channel. more info needed
hyphen - magazine

avoid:
denny's - racist incidents (although if they've apologized or otherwise made up for it, that should change)
abercrombie and fitch - racist shirts and weak apology
home depot - weak response to racist incident on radio show that they ran ads on
rosie o' donnel - ching chong ur fucking fat ass

what do u guys think, is this worth attempting? and who else should be on these lists?

[sandra]

for clothing:

shop -

united colors of benneton (diversity)
american apparel (sweatshop-free clothes)
s.f. chronicle
ny times
GAP
macy's, nordstrom, jc penney's



avoid -

american eagle (same t-shirts as a & f)
walmart
stuff magazine (kelly hu and small chinese men)
kelly hu's t.v. show (same reason as above)
forever 21 (el monte case where thai workers were pretty much enslaved)
los angeles times
toys r' us (for not giving the first baby of the year prize to an "immigrant family")
hollister (is a & f)

and for t.v., when i do have it, i keep imaginasian on even if there are other better programs on air just to support the channel so it can grow. ER for ming-na.

[returntosender]

The biggest consumers are teenagers and most aa teens know diddly squat about discrimination etc. I've been on forums where aa girls would actually defend A&F saying 'oh they apologized so it's ok' or 'but I like their clothing!'.

Personally I like to shop at smaller retail stores.

[VV o n g B a]

hollister (is a & f)
doh! didn't know that. i just got a dress shirt from there a few weeks ago.

[Yeahman]

Also, it would only make a difference if the company knew that they were being boycotted or supported as a result of their pro-AA campaign.
If you're not a Nelson household, what's the point of sitting through Lost unless you genuinely enjoy it?

I don't shop at A&F because I don't want to give them a single dollar but I don't pretend that that is going to affect their policies.

Anyway...
Support:
Forever 21 (hires lots of Asians)
Wal-Mart (funds lots of scholarships for Asian-Americans)
Computer Associates (funded huge Asian Studies center)
Nike (provides jobs for lots of Asians)
Gap (see above)
Intel (see above)
This list: http://www.diversityinc.com/public/216print.cfm

Boycott:
A&F
Rosie

[sandra]

Also, it would only make a difference if the company knew that they were being boycotted or supported as a result of their pro-AA campaign.
If you're not a Nelson household, what's the point of sitting through Lost unless you genuinely enjoy it?

I don't shop at A&F because I don't want to give them a single dollar but I don't pretend that that is going to affect their policies.

Anyway...
Support:
Forever 21 (hires lots of Asians)
Wal-Mart (funds lots of scholarships for Asian-Americans)
Computer Associates (funded huge Asian Studies center)
Nike (provides jobs for lots of Asians)
Gap (see above)
Intel (see above)
This list: http://www.diversityinc.com/public/216print.cfm

Boycott:
A&F
Rosie


some companies like walmart spend a lot of money on good publicity yet still uphold internal policies that negatively affect their workers - many of which are minorities.

[snailpoo]

toys r' us (for not giving the first baby of the year prize to an "immigrant family")

I thought they gave it to the family two days later.




Hrm.

Positives: Treo/Verizon?

http://www.visuallease.com/ebay/treo650/images/IMAGE_00008.jpg

[sandra]

I thought they gave it to the family two days later.




they did. but the fact that they even attempted to withhold the prize on that basis.

[Yeahman]

some companies like walmart spend a lot of money on good publicity yet still uphold internal policies that negatively affect their workers - many of which are minorities.
Wal-Mart's a mixed bag. I remember a news report about a possible Wal-Mart in NYC. The Korean business owners were against it. Blacks were for it.

[Paradox]

For news and other media:
I personally don't support MTV at all because I feel they have a pretty significant anti-asian bias in their programming and their attitude towards pop culture. MTV Asia in Thailand was a huge flop and was recently cut from the major satellite provider here because they played mostly American/British pop/rock and neglected music from asia. The Thais all watch their own domestic Music channels. This is just an example of how detached MTV is from the Asian part of the world.

For news.. I avoid Fox and CNN because I feel they are heavily biased. Anything sponsored or affiliated with Rupert Murdoch is generally a no no. I generally watch BBC, Al Jazeera (for the middle east) or news bits from the AP which I later confirm with other sources. I also don't watch mainstream U.S. channels if I want to watch shows or sitcoms i download them directly with commercials cut.

For products:

I avoid anything that can be traced back to the white american right wing evangelical movement. Anything that has a discriminatory past or has aired asians in a stereotypical fashion.

[lethal]

Wal-Mart's a mixed bag. I remember a news report about a possible Wal-Mart in NYC. The Korean business owners were against it. Blacks were for it.

Wamart's a huge sponsor of NAPABA and hires a ton of Asian American attorneys, FWIW.

[haplesshobo]

support:

lost - positive representation
heroes - same as above
survivor - positive representation even if in questionable setting


I rememeber when those shows first aired or before they even aired, they were heavily criticized by this forum as well as other asian activists. It was a similar reaction towards the reality TV show, welcome to the neignborhood where this white neighborhood would decide who would win a free house and live next door- an asian couple or a goth couple or a gay couple. Yet, it was taken off the air, before it even aired, because of such activism. Yet, wow do we know if that show wouldn't have also changed our minds by the end?

avoid -
walmart


Why Walmart other than its the whipping boy for progressives? I'm not really sure what Walmart has harmed asian american interests. You mention its policies but how are they really any different from its rivals in the retail industry?

I never understood why its acceptable to shop at Targets and IKEAs, but not the Walmarts.

[Napoleon Chynamite]

I don't even really understand how you can say someone consumes like a white person as opposed to an asian person. What, is consuming like a white person like going to Starbucks and shopping at Hollister? Should I go shop at Fubu now, start eating at Ethiopian and Malaysian restaurants, and start racking up the pirated DVDs in Chinatown so I won't be as white? In terms of consumerism all I see is one big fat mainstream culture and nobody is immune, so I don't know where this whole Asians consume like whites is coming from.

[VV o n g B a]

I don't even really understand how you can say someone consumes like a white person as opposed to an asian person. What, is consuming like a white person like going to Starbucks and shopping at Hollister? Should I go shop at Fubu now, start eating at Ethiopian and Malaysian restaurants, and start racking up the pirated DVDs in Chinatown so I won't be as white? In terms of consumerism all I see is one big fat mainstream culture and nobody is immune, so I don't know where this whole Asians consume like whites is coming from.banana's consumer habit post (http://forums.yellowworld.org/showpost.php?p=503213&postcount=30)
it seems pretty easy to me. if a company uses aa's in ads, we seem to be impervious to it whereas blacks and latinos take notice. whites are also unmoved when seeing other whites featured in ads.

[pikachupacabra]

I don't even really understand how you can say someone consumes like a white person as opposed to an asian person. What, is consuming like a white person like going to Starbucks and shopping at Hollister? Should I go shop at Fubu now, start eating at Ethiopian and Malaysian restaurants, and start racking up the pirated DVDs in Chinatown so I won't be as white? In terms of consumerism all I see is one big fat mainstream culture and nobody is immune, so I don't know where this whole Asians consume like whites is coming from.


In essence, marketing teams for many corporations DO use racial demographics to determine who to aim their products towards.


For example, have you noticed the "blackification" of a lot of recent Mcdonalds ads? Who do you think that's aimed towards?




For me, I try to only watch TV shows with at least SOME asian representation...right now I'm into Lost and Heroes, though Lost has sort of..."misplaced" me this season.

[VV o n g B a]

For me, I try to only watch TV shows with at least SOME asian representation...right now I'm into Lost and Heroes, though Lost has sort of..."misplaced" me this season.u know, come to think of it, every tv show i watch has some asian representation. in addition to lost and heroes i watch smallville and galactica.

smallville - kristin kreuk
battlestar galactica - grace park

the roles for these characters aren't identifiably asian which is definitely a plus in some respects, but there also aren't any asian males so all their love interests are of course white males. mixed bag, but the stories are good enuf that i keep watching.

[AliBabaIncorporated]

In general, I have never bought a product because of the commercial. I have chosen not to buy plenty of products because their commercials were offensive, or just plain old annoying.

I think the problem is that every time a company does use an Asian in an ad, it's something stupid, so it doesn't actually influence Asian to buy their product. And the US ad agencies, instead of realising that people are repelled by their dumbass commercials, assume it's because Asians don't care about having Asians in commercials. I've also noticed this is a much bigger problem in Australia.

The other problem, of course, is that the segment of the population who prefer to consume English-language media (and thus are more likely to be influenced by ads there) is a lot smaller than everyone likes to assume. Asians in the US may have a lot of purchasing power, but a huge proportion of that is controlled by immigrants, not by their 2nd-gen kids, many of whom are either students or still early career ...
I watch Lost and Battlestar Galactica, but not Heroes or Smallville (the 100th episode was pretty much a sign to me that the shit was getting old and repetitive; never really thought Kristen Kreuk was that pretty anyway).

[returntosender]

Not to hijack this topic, but what happened on the 100th episode?

[haplesshobo]

smallville - kristin kreuk
battlestar galactica - grace park


I would watch paint dry if Mariana Renata was involved in that show.

[tripostrophe]

Hm one thing I've noticed recently is that Jones Soda seems to feature very few non-whites. I dunno, it's just weird because aside from one Asian female I've seen, all the other people featured seem to be white. Not sure why that is, but not necessarily going to call it racism. *shrugs*

[tripostrophe]

Also...I support Puma over Nike and Adidas. Nike for the sweatshops, Adidas for that yellowface screwup a while back.

[VV o n g B a]

Also...I support Puma over Nike and Adidas. Nike for the sweatshops, Adidas for that yellowface screwup a while back.ah yes, forgot about that yellowface deal. but why the support for puma? i actually have a pair but haven't really seen their ads.

[AliBabaIncorporated]

I've never even heard of Jones Soda. I guess their ads aren't working.

[tripostrophe]

ah yes, forgot about that yellowface deal. but why the support for puma? i actually have a pair but haven't really seen their ads.

Oh, I guess because they haven't really done anything majorly offensive or exploitative. As far as I know?

[eos]

who do you think is making pumas? well-paid adults in well-lit, ventilated, safe factories?

and i don't drink jones soda cuz they make weird flavors...like turkey, mashed potatoes, etc. you just don't DO that.

[tripostrophe]

who do you think is making pumas? well-paid adults in well-lit, ventilated, safe factories?

and i don't drink jones soda cuz they make weird flavors...like turkey, mashed potatoes, etc. you just don't DO that.

Ahh. I guess not. And I dunno, apparently they sold kinda well. I'm guessing for the novelty, but..haha.

[VV o n g B a]

avoid: details magazine
reason: gay or asian article and this new article (http://forums.yellowworld.org/showthread.php?t=32524). they've got such a great track record.

[deez nuts]

i shop according to price, quality or my favorite brand or designer. don't really care about anything else.

[VV o n g B a]

i shop according to price, quality or my favorite brand or designer. don't really care about anything else.u wouldn't by chance wear prada would u? b/c i hear it's pretty popular w/ that guy w/ 2 horns and i know u guys are pals.

[AngryABCGirl]

Just on Asian American consumption in general, what is it exactly measured by in terms of marketing and what aspects do we actually make a dent in?

With such a small and diverse population, it's really hard to see how we can actually change our consumption patterns since we don't have a solid one to begin with, other than the idea that we consume like Whites, which I don't think is true. I think a significant proportion of the purchasing power in Asian American goes on goods unreported in terms of marketing research, such as toward products from Asia or targeted toward people from their specific ethnic countries in general that shouldn't be ignored that are advertised in Asia-language media. Again, there's a reason why banks and insurance companies go at huge lengths to advertise in the ethnic media.

But there's also the fact that there is very few English language media targeting Asian Americans, and the fact is even if you put an Asian person on TV, because it's such a diverse population, not every single Asian, maybe not even that many will go, oh snap! I'm not saying this that it doesn't matter that Asians are in media, it's relating this to consumption patterns. I think the only American product actively marketed towards an Asian woman like me, specifically, are high-end designer purses.

[kimpossible]

To all: do you base your boycott mainly on representation in the ads and is it a lack of representation or an offensive representation?

And if not just the ads, what else would provoke a boycott of the product or service?

[VV o n g B a]

if u reference my opening post, my point wasn't primarily to boycott but to support in regards to ads. the companies i mentioned to avoid have mostly earned their spot w/ offensive products (except home depot which basically just told me they didn't care about my complaint). the companies i mentioned to support had positive ads or products w/ asians, i.e. parry shen in dell commercial.

u'll notice i didn't say to avoid hp, emachines, apple or whatever. i'd still buy from them if they offered a product that dell didn't. they just haven't showed me they care about my demographic. nothing more, nothing less. a boycott is definitely not being called for here for any company except those that have actually done something offensive. not featuring asians in an ad doesn't count as offensive for me.

[kimpossible]

Ah, I should reveal more of my cards. This topic is chock full of useful info and could potentially be part of a real life study. The more info the better.

[VV o n g B a]

new addition:
avoid hotpockets (perpetuation of stereotypes in commercial)

[deez nuts]

u wouldn't by chance wear prada would u? b/c i hear it's pretty popular w/ that guy w/ 2 horns and i know u guys are pals.

yes, you would be correct in your assumption. prada is one of the designers i wear. my biggest prada purchase was a $1600 prada two button suit.

[Paradox]

But there's also the fact that there is very few English language media targeting Asian Americans, and the fact is even if you put an Asian person on TV, because it's such a diverse population, not every single Asian, maybe not even that many will go, oh snap! I'm not saying this that it doesn't matter that Asians are in media, it's relating this to consumption patterns. I think the only American product actively marketed towards an Asian woman like me, specifically, are high-end designer purses.

The demographic studies i've seen have shown that by and large asians have the same "tastes" as the white mainstream. So anything that sells for whites tends to sell for asians even if the advertising is very anglocentric. This isn't surprising to me either. I've decided awhile back that asian-americans as a whole are a hopeless basket case minority. That may seem harsh but the last few years living abroad has convinced me of such. I've seen way too many asian-americans with issues.

[AngryABCGirl]

The demographic studies i've seen have shown that by and large asians have the same "tastes" as the white mainstream. So anything that sells for whites tends to sell for asians even if the advertising is very anglocentric. This isn't surprising to me either. I've decided awhile back that asian-americans as a whole are a hopeless basket case minority. That may seem harsh but the last few years living abroad has convinced me of such. I've seen way too many asian-americans with issues.

I have to say I agree with you on this one, especially living abroad now kind of confirmed it. In fact I've known people's heads to have exploded when they see Asian men featured on giant ads in Asia. If anything that Asians buy demographically different from Whites, it's on Asian products and brands specifically- food items, certain Asian brands, etc. rather than anything the American mainstream market is trying to sell, so they can just market their products to us like White people.

Coincidentally though, I've seen a lot of target advertising of "urban" brand wear toward Asians in Asia, such as 張震嶽, MC Hot Dog, and the Free 9 crew in Zoo York ads in Taipei and in Hong Kong, and Edison Chen's Clot clothing line.

I think the demographic group that has the strongest propensity to be catered to is Latinos, because of sheer numbers and a more uniform population because the majority are of Mexican descent and can easily be advertise to. That and they care, for any brand to lose a market share to such a huge percent of the population, who actually care, is huge.

Asians make up a 4%, and despite an unusually large buying power, don't care.

[j&j2]

The demographic studies i've seen have shown that by and large asians have the same "tastes" as the white mainstream. So anything that sells for whites tends to sell for asians even if the advertising is very anglocentric. This isn't surprising to me either. I've decided awhile back that asian-americans as a whole are a hopeless basket case minority. That may seem harsh but the last few years living abroad has convinced me of such. I've seen way too many asian-americans with issues.

The DIFFERENCE being - advertisers for products geared to women are much more inclusive about including Asian women (and other minorities) in their commercials/ads (clothing, cosmetics, shampoo, feminine hygiene products, women's healthclubs, etc.).

However, when it comes to male-oriented products - razors, deoderant, athletic gear, beer, etc. - AMs are pretty much absent.

The same applies to advertising for higher education, healthcare, business services, etc. - AFs are very prevalents while AMs are not (but then again - this is for advertising appealing to a mostly white audience).

[Dimeron]

The DIFFERENCE being - advertisers for products geared to women are much more inclusive about including Asian women (and other minorities) in their commercials/ads (clothing, cosmetics, shampoo, feminine hygiene products, women's healthclubs, etc.).

However, when it comes to male-oriented products - razors, deoderant, athletic gear, beer, etc. - AMs are pretty much absent.

The same applies to advertising for higher education, healthcare, business services, etc. - AFs are very prevalents while AMs are not (but then again - this is for advertising appealing to a mostly white audience).

The audience definitely makes the difference. For example, I work in the IT industry (stereotypical I know). And sometimes I pick up IT related magazines and catalogs. Every one of those would have at least 3 or 4 AM faces in there, the AM faces almost outnumber of the AF seen in those magazines.

So again, it’s the market. And it makes sense. If I was in charge of purchasing large database solutions or internet servers, as AM, the advertisement with the Asian face would grab my attention first. I imagine it is the same with many other Asians.

[BigLew]

Ah he'd be less apt to cry if it were an asian guy in a gatorade commercial or something. It's typical for the whiny asian boy group, they all have caved in chests and never work out but cry that they are not seen as sexy. There's so many of these keyboard warriors on the internet they have created a new stereotype for asian males, so it's no wonder computer mags use asian male faces.

[j&j2]

Ah he'd be less apt to cry if it were an asian guy in a gatorade commercial or something. It's typical for the whiny asian boy group, they all have caved in chests and never work out but cry that they are not seen as sexy. There's so many of these keyboard warriors on the internet they have created a new stereotype for asian males, so it's no wonder computer mags use asian male faces.

So only "whiny asian boys w/ caved in chests" like to see positive portrayals of AMs?

As an ex-jock/frat-boy (and knowing a good no. of others who share the same sentiment) - I would like to see some portrayals more representative of myself (as evidentally, as do Yul from "Survivor" and DDK from "Lost" in interviews) instead of the usual stereotypical portrayals.

Besides - these "keyboard warriors" don't nearly do as much damage as what the mainstream media does (most people don't go on Asian-oriented sites).

So are AFs who complain about the sexualization/objectification of Asian females in the media (not to mention getting hit upon or harrassed by asiaphiles) "whiny b!tches"?

And what about all the blacks who started the campaign against Imus on the net - I guess they are whiny, keyboard warriors as well.

[deez nuts]

i won't buy anything from nintendo cuz of that stupid commercial of two scrawny japanese guys in suits riding around in their small little car (i guess they both fit in their small automobile cuz they're so short) knocking on doors kowtowing to whitey and blacky and telling them "we would like to play" in their japanese accent and all throughout the commercial oriental music is playing in the background. disgraceful.

i also won't watch japanese porn anymore cuz i have watched japanese porn, korean porn and chinese porn. i have never seen a japanese guy with a big dick in a japanese porno ever. the chick holds the japanese guy's cock like a tea cup (just with her thumb and index finger rather than with her whole hand) when she gives him head cuz his dick is so small hence why me and my friends nicknamed jap porn actors: teacup dicks. i beg the japanese porn industry: FOR FUCK'S SAKE PLEASE STOP MAKING PORN., you're making the rest of us asian men look bad with your small dick porn actors. watching you hump that bitch like a jack rabbit because of your small dick and the woman squealing as if she's in pain like that 3-4" penis is actually splitting her in half is not fucking hot, you're not fooling anybody.

[BigLew]

And what about all the blacks who started the campaign against Imus on the net - I guess they are whiny, keyboard warriors as well.

So go start a campaign then. What, do you think you are new or something? This is the same shit we've been reading on these forums for YEARS. I agree that portrayals are fucked up but your not telling anyone here anything that is new news. And bitching about it online like the crybabies that have been doing it for years has accomplished nothing. You just promote the shit people bitch about making it more famous.

It'd be far more constructive to supoort and bring light to projects that get so little press such as 32nd street and the like. But projects such as these often get overshadowed by, "damn it Lucy Liu fucked another white guy on screen!"

Me I'm more worried about shit like AA's facing actual physical violence and VT shootings being used as a scape goat.

[VV o n g B a]

i said in the beginning of the thread that i was skeptical that this would work. i doubt these companies will note our presence or absence either way. but as a matter of principle, i was suggesting we try if only to appease our own (or at least my own) conscience that we're not part of the statistic that consumes like whites and contributes to low or unfavorable media representation.

i had considered my posts relatively low in the bitching area and relatively high in the supporting area, at least until the last couple posts. bitching isn't so much my primary goal as supporting. do you have a problem w/ asian-americans supporting positive aa media representation? if not then shut the fuck up.

stop bringing up whiny asian guys. stop talking about asian girls fucking whoever the hell they fuck. stop talking about school violence, and stop talking about whatever the hell else u wanna talk about b/c in this thread, i don't give a shit. if u don't think attempting to change ur consumption habits is worth it, say ur peace and leave the topic alone. don't bring in a bunch of garbage that has nothing to do w/ this.

[eos]

^excuse this interruption, but i was about to bitch YOU out for not bitching biglew out cuz he picked on a newbie. you know, cuz you bitched me out for bitching out a newbie. but i see you took care of that here.

oh and about this thread: i still don't buy from aberslutty, will NEVER buy from american apparel, will not eat hotpockets(but they're so good..*sniffs*), and whatever i listed before in this thread. so that's what i'm doing.

[BigLew]

i said in the beginning of the thread that i was skeptical that this would work. i doubt these companies will note our presence or absence either way. but as a matter of principle, i was suggesting we try if only to appease our own (or at least my own) conscience that we're not part of the statistic that consumes like whites and contributes to low or unfavorable media representation.

i had considered my posts relatively low in the bitching area and relatively high in the supporting area, at least until the last couple posts. bitching isn't so much my primary goal as supporting. do you have a problem w/ asian-americans supporting positive aa media representation? if not then shut the fuck up.

stop bringing up whiny asian guys. stop talking about asian girls fucking whoever the hell they fuck. stop talking about school violence, and stop talking about whatever the hell else u wanna talk about b/c in this thread, i don't give a shit. if u don't think attempting to change ur consumption habits is worth it, say ur peace and leave the topic alone. don't bring in a bunch of garbage that has nothing to do w/ this.
Noted.

Sorry bout the hijacking bro.

On topic, in the area I live I do not believe asians consume like white people at all, there are tons of small asian businesses all over that thrive and I see mainstream, major chain places that do not fair so well. But that might just be due to the fact that the population is probably high in immigants that do not really consider themselves "American" as much as just being in America.

[shane]

What should be done about the ad agencies that actually create the brand image and almost all the advertising for these large companies? You guys who work in design, marketing, advertising, etc. would probably know better than me, but don't most corporations just outsource the brand management to these ad agencies? Let's say Crispin Porter & Bogusky, while managing the Burger King brand, comes up with a commercial that we deem racist/offensive/whatever. Does this boycott strategy only target Burger King, or do we target the guys who made the ad, too? And if so, how?

I mean, while reading this thread I was just thinking in the back of my mind that retail is only one of many sectors in the economy. I mean, there are companies like 3M and Applied Materials and Computer Associates and Sysco and Cisco whose products/services dominate the economy, but we don't even notice. If Sysco were to be revealed to have intentional systemic discrimination against minorities reaching to the highest levels of its organization, could we as restaurant customers even know when we're buying their product or not? Even companies like Dell make most of their money on corporate/government sales.

I mean, I think the whole strategy is well intentioned, and that it's good we're talking it out. I also think it's still likely to work against specifically targeted companies - companies highly dependent on public image and retail sales in highly competitive markets. I think Abercrombie is a good fit, but I can't think of any other company that would be highly vulnerable to something like this.

Just my $.02

[kimpossible]

Campaigns are the domain of ad agencies but companies are responsible for their own brands. It's the ad agency's job to craft a message that theoretically finds the target market outlined by the company. Ultimately the company yays or nays the campaign.

The mechanics and relationship you laid out are about right but the ownership of branding is definitely the company rather than the ad agencies. They're there to meet the needs and wants of the company. Even if they come up with a dippy, ineffective or offensive campaign, the company okays and signs onto it. They purchase a service.

Good call on thinking of biz-to-biz and not just consumer end.

[j&j2]

So go start a campaign then. What, do you think you are new or something? This is the same shit we've been reading on these forums for YEARS. I agree that portrayals are fucked up but your not telling anyone here anything that is new news. And bitching about it online like the crybabies that have been doing it for years has accomplished nothing. You just promote the shit people bitch about making it more famous.

Who says I haven't? And besides, there are people who may not be aware of these issues (and how such things affect them), and if it bothers YOU so much - simply don't read it (no need to act like a total pissant).

And since when is talking about this in an academic sense a negative (I'm not talking about the "ooh, she's dating a white guy" thing; besides, where can one talk about these issues, if not an Asian-oriented site)?

It'd be far more constructive to supoort and bring light to projects that get so little press such as 32nd street and the like. But projects such as these often get overshadowed by, "damn it Lucy Liu fucked another white guy on screen!"

Me I'm more worried about shit like AA's facing actual physical violence and VT shootings being used as a scape goat.

You're wrong - negative media portrayals of Asians has done more to wreak havoc with the pysche of young, impressionable Asian-Americans than anything else (not to mention such media portrayals, particularly of AMs as the "perpetual, sneaky foreigner", has played a role in contributing to physical violence against Asians or action by the state).

The African-American, Hispanic, gay/lesbian and Muslim/Arab communities have all vocally fought to change how the media has represented them (with varying success) - and there have been changes for the better (it seems to me you are holding Asians to a different standard).

Do you think the candidacy of Barack Obama (and the near-candidacy of Colin Powell) would be possible if the media representation of BMs had been stuck to that of the late 70s/early 80s (jive-talking, inner city menial workers) instead of today where BM are portrayed as lawyers, doctors, judges, scientists, military officers and other positions of leadership/professionalism (including that of President of the US)?

The same thing has happened with regard to gay/lesbian portrayals and how they are increasingly being viewed by society in general.

No one is saying that supporting Asian-oriented projects isn't impt. - but all too often, they have a very limited audience (positive portrayals on widely seen commercials or a hit TV show or "general-audience" film would have a significantly greater impact).

[Dimeron]

Ah he'd be less apt to cry if it were an asian guy in a gatorade commercial or something. It's typical for the whiny asian boy group, they all have caved in chests and never work out but cry that they are not seen as sexy. There's so many of these keyboard warriors on the internet they have created a new stereotype for asian males, so it's no wonder computer mags use asian male faces.

Yes, because as we all know, those whinny Asian boys are all actually IT cooperate officers who has the power to buy hundreds of thousands dollars worth of software and hardware.

[VV o n g B a]

http://www.angryasianman.com/images/angry/ddk-hollywood.jpg

ddk @ hollywood and highland. courtesy angryasianman.com.

add gap to the support column. i haven't seen much i've liked from gap recently, but i do need socks and boxers...

[lethal]

if u reference my opening post, my point wasn't primarily to boycott but to support in regards to ads. the companies i mentioned to avoid have mostly earned their spot w/ offensive products (except home depot which basically just told me they didn't care about my complaint). the companies i mentioned to support had positive ads or products w/ asians, i.e. parry shen in dell commercial.

Would the Home Depot commercial depicting an Asian American family described as follows (http://www.racialicious.com/2007/05/02/asian-family-in-cute-baskin-robbins-commercial/) change your opinion?

Long story short, you had a cute young girl looking around the kitchen and proclaiming to her father that there’s something wrong with the floor and cabinets.

The father, a hip looking young guy who was eating a bowl of cereal looks up and asks: “The floor and cabinets? What’s wrong with them?”

“I don’t know. They just look kinda old.”

The little girl walks out past her mother who gives her some cash as she bribed her daughter to say that to her father so they could go to Home Depot for home improvement.

I'll see if I can find it on youtube.

[j&j2]

There was an interesting article in the NYTimes last week which was about how advertising agencies and a no. of corporations are seeking to appeal to Muslim/Arab-American consumers in their advertising and in their stores.

And I'm sure the answer to reaching the Muslim/Arab-American audience is not mostly portraying Muslim/Arab-American women/girls or predominantly coupling them w/ WMs.

[lethal]

I'll see if I can find it on youtube.

Home Depot Asian American Family commercial.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QGMmA47TZCM

[yoMAMA]

DDK is sexy in an unique way.

[tripostrophe]

In accordance with the recent trend of unearthing old posts...

APIAs on TV!! APIAs on TV!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QGMmA47TZCM

(Home Depot commercial showing an Asian American family as...a completely normal family! Who speak English! Waaah?)

But to contrast, VVongBa, would you mind elaborating on what Home Depot did (or failed to do)?

[VV o n g B a]

i couldn't find my own post about it, but i did find the specific grievance.

http://forums.yellowworld.org/showthread.php?t=22180&highlight=tsunami+depot

yes, i have seen that home depot commercial. it was certainly refreshing to see an asian american family on a commercial. so they refused to pull ads from a highly offensive radio show but produce their own ad w/ asian americans. i dunno what the calculus to that is... i really don't.

[MD2020]

There was also an Asian-American couple (with perfect English) with Yao Ming (with horrible English) in a commercial for "Garmin" -some GPS thing. I agree that the whole Yao Ming thing kinda cheapens it, but at least they weren't pulling a rickshaw or something.

http://www.nelsonguirado.com/index.php/asymmetric/2007/06/03/commercial_with_yao_ming_and_asian_coupl

[tripostrophe]

i couldn't find my own post about it, but i did find the specific grievance.

http://forums.yellowworld.org/showthread.php?t=22180&highlight=tsunami+depot

yes, i have seen that home depot commercial. it was certainly refreshing to see an asian american family on a commercial. so they refused to pull ads from a highly offensive radio show but produce their own ad w/ asian americans. i dunno what the calculus to that is... i really don't.

Hm...okay. I dunno what to do now. Damage control? @.@

[Napoleon Chynamite]

^ Acts promoting socio-political awareness with regard to race-related issues don't cancel out racist actions and vice versa. I highly doubt that most sources of racist or ignorant propaganda have a planned and detailed agenda to dish out offensive and insensitive media. Most of it is just the product of ignorance, selfishness, and desire to make a buck. It's not surprising to me at all that a company or show can do or say something completely racist toward Asians one day and then host or give a tribute to certain Asian individuals on another.

[urbia]

I shop 'Asian' to the extent I'll withhold my dollars until I go on vacation to either Asia or a bigger city with Asian businesses that sell clothes imported from Asia. A great deal of it has to do with the fact I'm built so petite. I'm also not a fan of paying Canadian goods and services taxes.

As far as media products go, my travels have hooked me on Asian films to the extent that boycotting Hollywood, with the exception of the odd decent movie, is not only easy but bullshit-free. I simply don't have the patience to watch tons of movies, especially bad ones, so slots in my schedule I do reserve for movies are filled by watching good quality DVDs from Chinatown. :biggrin: Otherwise, I get access to the odd Anime series I find interesting. I've also managed to forget the existence of the television. To sate my gaming urges, I visit Pacific Mall in Toronto for good deals on used consoles. The Wii is tempting me out of this habit, though, as I can't wait to try it.

My reading material is more diversified. I read everything from business magazines to cultural studies books. But since it's so easy to walk in and out of bookstores with a head full of knowledge, I wouldn't exactly call it an example of participating in the economy. Yeah, I'm such a cheapskate.

What else is left? Food. Mixed diet. But I rarely eat out now because I've been spoiled by so much good food in Asia. What can I say? I guess I really vote with my dollars, and it's not exactly a test of wills since I'm not drawn to a wide spectrum of consumer products in the first place. For entertainment, I don't have to spend very much. I've gained a new appreciation for clean air since coming back to Canada, so I spend a lot of my time outside being active.

[huangalex]

Companies are trying to sell stuff and will have their ad campaign managers scribble a note about casting if it means getting money. How about instead of ads let's take a look at which companies have served the community or have donated to APIA charities.

[Paradox]

I shop 'Asian' to the extent I'll withhold my dollars until I go on vacation to either Asia or a bigger city with Asian businesses that sell clothes imported from Asia. A great deal of it has to do with the fact I'm built so petite. I'm also not a fan of paying Canadian goods and services taxes.

As far as media products go, my travels have hooked me on Asian films to the extent that boycotting Hollywood, with the exception of the odd decent movie, is not only easy but bullshit-free.

I go one step further I take money from the U.S. and I put it in Asian business and investments. There are quite a few ways to secure low interest loans in the U.S. and roll them over into an overseas account or fund. I have started a small export business here in Thailand just from this. I could probably grow it but the limitations would be on the Thai side of things (legality, ownership rules) but the capital is all there.

I started boycotting Hollywood a long time ago. I watch all my shit for free and I don't feel bad about pirating at all. I go see asian movies in the theater or buy the dvd.

[MD2020]

I started boycotting Hollywood a long time ago. I watch all my shit for free and I don't feel bad about pirating at all. I go see asian movies in the theater or buy the dvd.

Haha, that's how I justified buying all the pirated movies I got while I was in Thailand and Malaysia - send a message to Hollywood: buy Asian, buy pirate! arrrrrr....

[urbia]

I go one step further I take money from the U.S. and I put it in Asian business and investments. There are quite a few ways to secure low interest loans in the U.S. and roll them over into an overseas account or fund. I have started a small export business here in Thailand just from this. I could probably grow it but the limitations would be on the Thai side of things (legality, ownership rules) but the capital is all there.

I started boycotting Hollywood a long time ago. I watch all my shit for free and I don't feel bad about pirating at all. I go see asian movies in the theater or buy the dvd.

That's awesome. I actually bounced Asia business ideas off other travelers on the road but nothing really materialized. The main reason was because I missed my parents and went home. My desire to do something like that in the future is still there, though. In the meantime I'm building my career so I have something to fall back on, and I'm trying to learn about how others are starting overseas businesses at the same time.

I'd appreciate it if you PMed me a few tips or directions for research. Having no experience in running a business, I need to develop a sense of what's sound advice and what's bad gimicky get-rich-quick advice. To contribute to Asia's development is exciting. But naturally, I don't want to get ripped off in the process, or at the very least waste time reading material written by scam artists.

[urbia]

Haha, that's how I justified buying all the pirated movies I got while I was in Thailand and Malaysia - send a message to Hollywood: buy Asian, buy pirate! arrrrrr....

LOL. Oh Hollywood, you make things so simple. I'd rather wade through the steamy chaos of hawker markets in downtown Kuala Lumpur dripping with sweat than set foot in your surround-sound air conditioned cinemas only to lose two hours of my life.