Asian Kids with White Parents [Archive]

hooligan

07-24-2003, 10:05 AM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (BeTheReds @ Jul 24 2003, 09:03 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> The first and last time i noticed that was some kind of cold medicine commercial where the Asian kid and His white dad are both sick at home from school and work. They take the cough medicine and spend the whole day playing with each other. At the end it is obvious that they are not sick anymore and the white mom comes home, so they both cough and pretend they are sick again so they can do it again tomorrow.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that it is common, but I've seen it too. [/b][/quote]
i can't say i've watched a lot of tv in the last 5 weeks, i'll keep my head up for them though.  what we need? black parents, asian children.  asian parents, white children.  latino famillies, black children. w00t.

BeTheReds

07-24-2003, 10:17 AM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (hooligan @ Jul 25 2003, 02:05 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (BeTheReds @ Jul 24 2003, 09:03 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> The first and last time i noticed that was some kind of cold medicine commercial where the Asian kid and His white dad are both sick at home from school and work. They take the cough medicine and spend the whole day playing with each other. At the end it is obvious that they are not sick anymore and the white mom comes home, so they both cough and pretend they are sick again so they can do it again tomorrow.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that it is common, but I've seen it too. [/b][/quote]
i can't say i've watched a lot of tv in the last 5 weeks, i'll keep my head up for them though. what we need? black parents, asian children. asian parents, white children. latino famillies, black children. w00t. [/b][/quote]
The ad i am talking about was on the air like 4 years ago I think.

deez nuts

07-24-2003, 10:19 AM

angelina jolie can adopt me anyday.

kimpossible

07-24-2003, 10:24 AM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Chasiubao_Boy @ Jul 24 2003, 09:19 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> angelina jolie can adopt me anyday. [/b][/quote]
She likes them Cambodian boys. Not naughty Fukinese. But hey, Billy Bob got the boot. Looks like that henhouse needs a rooster. Little Maddox needs a daddy.

tapestrybabe

07-24-2003, 12:46 PM

i know this scenerio is prolly more prevelant in real life... seeing white parents adopting asian kids... and the media may just be reflecting that... but i can not be helped be disturbed with this typical image time and time again... i mean, i think someone mentioned something in another thread... about this commercial about american expess credit card or something... and how a white couple used it in order to adopt this chinese girl... it was something to that effect...

and i'm just curious... would it be really that difficult... to actually advertise... an asian couple adopting an asian kid instead... or show an asian family with an asian child... for its commercial... or whateverz...

RasFarengi

07-24-2003, 12:50 PM

It's sad because so many black and Latino kids are caught in the system in and out of foster homes their entire lives, especially boys.  I know it is easier to adopt foreign children, from countries like China, at one time my wife and I thought we might have to adopt in the future, and were considering a Blasian kid from Okinawa (there are more than a few) but also a American kid as well, thankfully we found out we are all good to go in the baby making department. 

I just think if you have to adopt or want to adopt you should be open to all children.  I don't know people having some fetish for kids really disturbs me.  Makes me think they want to do some Woody Allen mess when the girl gets grown. (j/k) in all seriousness it is disturbing though...in any case I believe in taking care of "home" first.

kimpossible

07-24-2003, 01:02 PM

Makes sense (everyone's points) but I find it hard to believe that the amount of Asian adoptions by white people in reality matches the same amount I've seen in ads. I guess what I'm trying to say is that it seems to be in vogue or something. Like a good marketing tool, something that appeals to the average consumer who I guess is white?

It just seems off kilter, the media representation seems to overrepresent the occurence in real life. That it's being used as kind of a mainstream marketing tool has me scratchin my head.

VV o n g B a

07-24-2003, 01:03 PM

i agree that it's a strange phenomenon, but what's the realistic alternative?  if these white couples (or whoever) don't adopt chinese girls, then those girls are likely to stay in orphanages.  given a choice of growing up in an orphanage vs. growing up in the US, which would u like most?  or, chinese women find that their girls aren't being adopted and just go straight for an abortion b/c it would be more humane than letting a kid grow up in an orphanage.  so which matters more,  our concerns over stereotypes or a child's welfare?

kimpossible

07-24-2003, 01:05 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (VV o n g B a @ Jul 24 2003, 12:03 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> our concerns over stereotypes or a child's welfare? [/b][/quote]
why can't we be concerned about both? I'm not against that type of adoption, I'm surprised by how it seems to be romanticized and used as a marketing tool. We're not holding a protest, we're just talking about it.

AngryABCGirl

07-24-2003, 01:06 PM

They're gonna be a lot of angry AAs who hate their parents in the not-too-distant-future for "robbing" them.

achtungbaby

07-24-2003, 01:10 PM

Interesting...I personally haven't seen this too much but it wouldn't surprise me in the least.

Eros

07-24-2003, 01:23 PM

Odd... I haven't noticed a lot of white parents/asian child commercials.  Since I watch way too much tv, I'll have to watch the commcercials closer.  I have noticed that there are a lot of asian kids (especially girls) in commercials in general, though.  Maybe we're the new token ethnicities.

Faithless

07-24-2003, 01:35 PM

Tao

07-24-2003, 01:37 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (ChottoMatte @ Jul 24 2003, 04:35 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> And why is always Asian girls? [/b][/quote]
cause people want boys more than girls

lethal

07-24-2003, 01:40 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Hello_Hapa @ Jul 24 2003, 04:02 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Makes sense (everyone's points) but I find it hard to believe that the amount of Asian adoptions by white people in reality matches the same amount I've seen in ads. I guess what I'm trying to say is that it seems to be in vogue or something. Like a good marketing tool, something that appeals to the average consumer who I guess is white?

It just seems off kilter, the media representation seems to overrepresent the occurence in real life. That it's being used as kind of a mainstream marketing tool has me scratchin my head. [/b][/quote]
It might be to appease the Asian audience.  Look, there's Asians on TV!  (no mastter that they're babies or kids who have white parents).

Faithless

07-24-2003, 01:41 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Hello_Hapa @ Jul 24 2003, 12:05 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> why can't we be concerned about both? I'm not against that type of adoption, I'm surprised by how it seems to be romanticized and used as a marketing tool. We're not holding a protest, we're just talking about it. [/b][/quote]
Marketing tool? Is there a special running on little Asian girls at Target right now?

I'm hoping that it is the media reflecting a trend.

Faithless

07-24-2003, 01:42 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Tao @ Jul 24 2003, 12:37 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> cause people want boys more than girls [/b][/quote]
Yeah, I have heard that about China.

However, I have heard that in Japan it is easier to adopt boys.  Can anyone confirm that?

Faithless

07-24-2003, 01:44 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Eros @ Jul 24 2003, 12:23 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Odd... I haven't noticed a lot of white parents/asian child commercials. Since I watch way too much tv, I'll have to watch the commcercials closer. I have noticed that there are a lot of asian kids (especially girls) in commercials in general, though. Maybe we're the new token ethnicities. [/b][/quote]
I've noticed it, and I keep thinking, "there goes another little sister that won't ever know the tenderness of fillet of rock cod until she gets out of the house".  :frown:

YuheiCarreau

07-24-2003, 02:02 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (RasFarengi @ Jul 24 2003, 03:50 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> It's sad because so many black and Latino kids are caught in the system in and out of foster homes their entire lives, especially boys. I know it is easier to adopt foreign children, from countries like China, at one time my wife and I thought we might have to adopt in the future, and were considering a Blasian kid from Okinawa (there are more than a few) but also a American kid as well, thankfully we found out we are all good to go in the baby making department. [/b][/quote]
Although I'm sure there are a lot of White parents who, if all conditions were equal, would still rather adopt a Chinese girl instead of a Black or Latino baby from the US, I was under the impression that American civil rights groups have been a major factor in preventing crossracial adoption within the US.

tapestrybabe

07-24-2003, 02:04 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (lethalweapon @ Jul 24 2003, 04:40 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Hello_Hapa @ Jul 24 2003, 04:02 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Makes sense (everyone's points) but I find it hard to believe that the amount of Asian adoptions by white people in reality matches the same amount I've seen in ads. I guess what I'm trying to say is that it seems to be in vogue or something. Like a good marketing tool, something that appeals to the average consumer who I guess is white?

It just seems off kilter, the media representation seems to overrepresent the occurence in real life. That it's being used as kind of a mainstream marketing tool has me scratchin my head. [/b][/quote]
It might be to appease the Asian audience. Look, there's Asians on TV! (no matter that they're babies or kids who have white parents). [/b][/quote]
i dunno... it doesnt really sit well with me... 
how do you view it?? do you view it as if its something as the norm- it just reflects the current trend?? cuz unless someone can tell me otherwise... i hardly think asians are the target audience when it comes to advertisement in such cases... to me... when it comes to such images... i do end up questioning it all... getting a sense they use it as a marketing tool... using asians kids in such a way... as like a commodity or something... for the white audience... i dunno... i could be wrong in their intentions... but its just what i sense sometimes...

YuheiCarreau

07-24-2003, 02:11 PM

How about these two images:

<img src='http://a1120.g.akamai.net/7/1120/51/24b34fe8575738/www.apple.com/ichat/images/index_top061703.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' /> <img src='http://a1280.g.akamai.net/7/1280/51/7d12a31a3e9cc1/www.apple.com/ichat/images/ichat_contexts031903v3.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' />

Which have been plastered all over Apple's stores and their website.

I can only imagine the advertising people meeting to create the campaign - "Biracial couple? Ooooh, very modern. Let's go with a White man and a Japanese woman. What's that you say? Go with a Japanese man? This is Silicon Valley, my friend. We don't have any Asian men around to photograph!"

kimpossible

07-24-2003, 02:13 PM

I wonder if Target would freak out if I took a picture of that poster.

kimpossible

07-24-2003, 02:16 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Eros @ Jul 24 2003, 12:23 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Odd... I haven't noticed a lot of white parents/asian child commercials. Since I watch way too much tv, I'll have to watch the commcercials closer. I have noticed that there are a lot of asian kids (especially girls) in commercials in general, though. Maybe we're the new token ethnicities. [/b][/quote]
Like I said. I was also flipping through a parenting mag and saw it there too. So, in total is was about two commercials on TV, the huge poster at Target and quite a bit in that one mag in the space of a week. I've never seen that many in that space of time before.

MellowDrama

07-24-2003, 02:19 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Hello_Hapa @ Jul 24 2003, 03:13 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> I wonder if Target would freak out if I took a picture of that poster. [/b][/quote]
Do it! Do it!
:lol:

>:^|

07-24-2003, 02:20 PM

I've seen this in a number of print ads (Kodak, Land's End, Target, etc.).  The demographic of White parents adopting from overseas is very attractive to advertisers--typically educated, older and moneyed. 

There were more than 5,000 adoptions from China in 2002.  There were approximately 8,606 adoptions in 2002 from the most-popular Asian countries (China, Korea, India, Vietnam ...).  Still that's a drop in the bucket compared to the number of people of Asian descent in the U.S.  And Asian Americans have impressively high levels of education and income compared to the general populace.  So where are the Asian families in ads?

State Department Listing of Orphan Visas (http://travel.state.gov/orphan_numbers.html)

And while the National Association of Black Social Workers came out with a policy statement regarding their concerns about transracial adoption, most Whites interpreted it as "THEY don't want US adopting THEIR kids."  But I think the NABSW was expressing very real concerns about the difficulties inherent in White families adopting children of color and the need for education--concerns that I have about children of Asian descent being adopted by non-Asians. 

lethal

07-24-2003, 02:20 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (tapestrybabe @ Jul 24 2003, 05:04 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (lethalweapon @ Jul 24 2003, 04:40 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Hello_Hapa @ Jul 24 2003, 04:02 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Makes sense (everyone's points) but I find it hard to believe that the amount of Asian adoptions by white people in reality matches the same amount I've seen in ads. I guess what I'm trying to say is that it seems to be in vogue or something. Like a good marketing tool, something that appeals to the average consumer who I guess is white?

It just seems off kilter, the media representation seems to overrepresent the occurence in real life. That it's being used as kind of a mainstream marketing tool has me scratchin my head. [/b][/quote]
It might be to appease the Asian audience. Look, there's Asians on TV! (no matter that they're babies or kids who have white parents). [/b][/quote]
i dunno... it doesnt really sit well with me...
how do you view it?? do you view it as if its something as the norm- it just reflects the current trend?? cuz unless someone can tell me otherwise... i hardly think asians are the target audience when it comes to advertisement in such cases... to me... when it comes to such images... i do end up questioning it all... getting a sense they use it as a marketing tool... using asians kids in such a way... as like a commodity or something... for the white audience... i dunno... i could be wrong in their intentions... but its just what i sense sometimes... [/b][/quote]
I don't like it.  THe sarcasm didn't come through very well.

VV o n g B a

07-24-2003, 02:39 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Hello_Hapa @ Jul 24 2003, 03:05 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> why can't we be concerned about both? I'm not against that type of adoption, I'm surprised by how it seems to be romanticized and used as a marketing tool. We're not holding a protest, we're just talking about it. [/b][/quote]
we can be i suppose. i can't say i don't share some of your concern, but even if it becomes a marketing tool and couples do this while ignorant of future political views of their adopted children, isn't the end outcome most likely still better than the life they would receive otherwise? which parent would the kid be more critical of? the ones who took a chance even tho they were stereotyping or the one who cared so much about her kid that she would dump her kid in an orphanage?

i know we're just talking about it, but there's nothing we can really form an opinion on here or do to significantly rectify the situation w/o asking for a lot of trouble. it's just reality. if we don't want chinese girls to be romantisized then we have to realize that it will directly impact those girls' life. and prolly in a bad way.

the other potential solution is to change social views in china to view the sexes as equal.  that is a viable, if monumental, alternative.

yoMAMA

07-24-2003, 03:42 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Chasiubao_Boy @ Jul 24 2003, 09:19 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> angelina jolie can adopt me anyday. [/b][/quote]
I second that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

adopt me Tomb Raider  :P

537

07-24-2003, 03:43 PM

I honestly haven't seen any of these ads.

yoMAMA

07-24-2003, 03:47 PM

I have seen the apple ads, but I thought the kid was pretty cute.

kimpossible

07-24-2003, 04:05 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (VV o n g B a @ Jul 24 2003, 01:39 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> we can be i suppose. i can't say i don't share some of your concern, but even if it becomes a marketing tool and couples do this while ignorant of future political views of their adopted children, isn't the end outcome most likely still better than the life they would receive otherwise? which parent would the kid be more critical of? the ones who took a chance even tho they were stereotyping or the one who cared so much about her kid that she would dump her kid in an orphanage?

i know we're just talking about it, but there's nothing we can really form an opinion on here or do to significantly rectify the situation w/o asking for a lot of trouble. it's just reality. if we don't want chinese girls to be romantisized then we have to realize that it will directly impact those girls' life. and prolly in a bad way. [/b][/quote]
I'm totally with you on the reality of actual adoption of foreign born Asian girls by white American couples. To make it clear that I'm not arguing either for or against it (and not really arguing about it at all), here's me saying yes Wongba, they are better off adopted than left in an orphanage. Agreed.

But in the past week and a half I had the experience where I saw like 5-8 representations of this in mainstream ads. I find it hard to believe that this proportionate representative of actual adoptions. Especially considering that most likely all Asian families most like outnumber white families with adopted Asian children in the US. Therefore, I find it weird that there I saw that many ads in such a short period of time showing white parents with Asian kids.

Sorry if I wrote something confusing, I tried to make sure I got 'ads' in the topic title. Am I wrong or do you think I'm trying to convince people that white people adopting Asians is wrong and it should be stopped? Because let me say right now that's not my point. Am I understanding you correctly? Not sure.

edit: and btw I did open up wondering if it was just coincidental. I know it might have just been chance to see that many so close together.

tapestrybabe

07-24-2003, 04:21 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (>:^| @ Jul 24 2003, 05:20 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>There were more than 5,000 adoptions from China in 2002. There were approximately 8,606 adoptions in 2002 from the most-popular Asian countries (China, Korea, India, Vietnam ...). Still that's a drop in the bucket compared to the number of people of Asian descent in the U.S. And Asian Americans have impressively high levels of education and income compared to the general populace. So where are the Asian families in ads?[/b][/quote]

yes, thats what i question...
where are the asian families depicted?? but of course, its just a mere ad, its just the media, its just television... some ppl dont care about such things... but the way i see it... there's such an inbalance to it all...

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (>:^| @ Jul 24 2003, 05:20 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>And while the National Association of Black Social Workers came out with a policy statement regarding their concerns about transracial adoption, most Whites interpreted it as "THEY don't want US adopting THEIR kids." But I think the NABSW was expressing very real concerns about the difficulties inherent in White families adopting children of color and the need for education--concerns that I have about children of Asian descent being adopted by non-Asians.[/b][/quote]
and while i would like to see more asians, asian americans adopting asian children instead... i'm NOT opposed to transracial adoptions... and yes, my sentiments EXACTLy... when it comes to children of asian decents being adopted by non asians... there's a helluva lot of education that needs to be done concerning this issue... theres so many ppl... who just sees it... oh, how nice that their doing such a thing... but its just not that simple sometimes... theres more to learn and be aware of than just merely wanting to adopt...

golden_buns

07-24-2003, 05:15 PM

Yup, GQ magazine had a couple of pictures of a white model posing with an asian baby

golden_buns

07-24-2003, 05:56 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (YuheiCarreau @ Jul 24 2003, 01:11 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> How about these two images:

<img src='http://a1120.g.akamai.net/7/1120/51/24b34fe8575738/www.apple.com/ichat/images/index_top061703.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' /> <img src='http://a1280.g.akamai.net/7/1280/51/7d12a31a3e9cc1/www.apple.com/ichat/images/ichat_contexts031903v3.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' />
[/b][/quote]
MSN is also using pictures of white dad with asian mom with hapa kids. That seems to have become a pretty common trend nowdays

AliBabaIncorporated

07-24-2003, 06:30 PM

MSN is also using pictures of white dad with asian mom with hapa kids. That seems to have become a pretty common trend nowdays
yeah, cuz idiot corporations always hire advertising agencies to try to compete to attract the demographic which was fasted growing a decade ago. same thing happened in the age of the baby boomers.

If they actually knew how to make an actual [i]product[i/] to attract the demographic which was growing fastest right now, they wouldn't have to hire some advertising agency to put a spin on it.

SunWuKong

07-24-2003, 06:57 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (AliBabaIncorporated @ Jul 24 2003, 09:30 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> yeah, cuz idiot corporations always hire advertising agencies to try to compete to attract the demographic which was fasted growing a decade ago. same thing happened in the age of the baby boomers.

If they actually knew how to make an actual [i]product[i/] to attract the demographic which was growing fastest right now, they wouldn't have to hire some advertising agency to put a spin on it. [/b][/quote]
maybe they thought they could attract Asian people, white people, mixed-race people all at once with these Asian/white ads.

golden_buns

07-24-2003, 07:02 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (SunWuKung @ Jul 24 2003, 05:57 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> maybe they thought they could attract Asian people, white people, mixed-race people all at once with these Asian/white ads. [/b][/quote]
I wouldn't say they're trying to attract ALL asian people. If you have noticed most of the asians in those adds are mainly women in the age range on 20 to late 30's, who are married with caucasian males. There's no representation of AF/BM or AF/Latinos, and there's barely any asian males in the picture.

The only add in which I saw an asian cuple was in a K-Swiss commercial

AliBabaIncorporated

07-24-2003, 07:15 PM

Bank of America has an ad with an Asian couple running on English TV too.

Also, ads with Asian couples regularly run all the time on Chinese-language TV. Maybe advertisers feel they're getting all the Asian business they need from that and don't consider AAs who get most of their news and entertainment from English-language media as an important target demographic. After all, 3/4 of Asians were born overseas ... and running an ad which gets more attention from AAs by way of featuring an Asian male or something, might well mean it gets less attention from the 90%+ of your other viewers.

supernova

07-24-2003, 07:19 PM

there's currently an ad with asian couple on AOL 9.0  :rolleyes:

thaite

07-24-2003, 07:23 PM

CUT THE RED TAPE!!
For Sale: My Asian seed. You provide willing white female and $5000 USD for exotic Asian baby. No adoption fees or paperwork necessary. I am willing to travel, provided expenses are included with my fee. Fee goes up for ugly chicks, $10,000 USD.

Tao

07-24-2003, 09:14 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (thaite @ Jul 24 2003, 10:23 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> CUT THE RED TAPE!!
For Sale: My Asian seed. You provide willing white female and $5000 USD for exotic Asian baby. No adoption fees or paperwork necessary. I am willing to travel, provided expenses are included with my fee. Fee goes up for ugly chicks, $10,000 USD. [/b][/quote]
amen  :lol:

YuheiCarreau

07-24-2003, 09:28 PM

I'm all in favor of multiracial people being shown as multiracial, but I don't like that the transracial adoption / White-Asian couple images I see in the media outnumber images of monoracial Asian couples. Even when monoracial Asians are shown they're almost always by themselves. I can't think of the last time I saw a monoracial Asian couple in an advertisement (or some other non-reality TV venue).

golden_buns

07-24-2003, 09:37 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (YuheiCarreau @ Jul 24 2003, 08:28 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> I'm all in favor of multiracial people being shown as multiracial, but I don't like that the transracial adoption / White-Asian couple images I see in the media outnumber images of monoracial Asian couples. Even when monoracial Asians are shown they're almost always by themselves. I can't think of the last time I saw a monoracial Asian couple in an advertisement (or some other non-reality TV venue). [/b][/quote]
yeah, that's exactly what annoys me about this hole deal. If they're gonna show asians show al of them Not just one small fraction and ignore the rest

tvbdude

07-24-2003, 10:10 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (BeTheReds @ Jul 24 2003, 01:03 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> The first and last time i noticed that was some kind of cold medicine commercial where the Asian kid and His white dad are both sick at home from school and work. They take the cough medicine and spend the whole day playing with each other. At the end it is obvious that they are not sick anymore and the white mom comes home, so they both cough and pretend they are sick again so they can do it again tomorrow.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that it is common, but I've seen it too. [/b][/quote]
4 years ago? I saw a similar one you described that was shown within a year ago.

hooligan

07-24-2003, 10:11 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (tvbdude @ Jul 24 2003, 09:10 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (BeTheReds @ Jul 24 2003, 01:03 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> The first and last time i noticed that was some kind of cold medicine commercial where the Asian kid and His white dad are both sick at home from school and work. They take the cough medicine and spend the whole day playing with each other. At the end it is obvious that they are not sick anymore and the white mom comes home, so they both cough and pretend they are sick again so they can do it again tomorrow.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that it is common, but I've seen it too. [/b][/quote]
4 years ago? I saw a similar one you described that was shown within a year ago. [/b][/quote]
anyone have a video stream of this commercial?  i haven't seen anything like this ... i don't watch tv and the one in the apartment is broken.

Deadpool

07-24-2003, 10:14 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (YuheiCarreau @ Jul 24 2003, 08:28 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> I'm all in favor of multiracial people being shown as multiracial, but I don't like that the transracial adoption / White-Asian couple images I see in the media outnumber images of monoracial Asian couples. Even when monoracial Asians are shown they're almost always by themselves. I can't think of the last time I saw a monoracial Asian couple in an advertisement (or some other non-reality TV venue). [/b][/quote]
Ive seen some. Usually they are for insurance companies though.
I guess it plays on the steroetype that Asians and responsible and smart people.
and that you should pic X company because smart people choose us.

Deadpool

07-24-2003, 10:17 PM

Oh BTW I haven't seen any White Parent Asian kid Commercials here. Ever. Might be due to the fact that I live in Can na duh

BeTheReds

07-25-2003, 05:13 AM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (YuheiCarreau @ Jul 25 2003, 01:28 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> I'm all in favor of multiracial people being shown as multiracial, but I don't like that the transracial adoption / White-Asian couple images I see in the media outnumber images of monoracial Asian couples. Even when monoracial Asians are shown they're almost always by themselves. I can't think of the last time I saw a monoracial Asian couple in an advertisement (or some other non-reality TV venue). [/b][/quote]
I remember there was this one commercial where this Asian couple just bought a house and were moving in and their annoying white neighbors kept trying to bother them when they just wanted to be left alone, so they close the garage door on them.

I think it was either a life insurance or bankloan commercial.

No asian seems to remember this becaue they only want to remember the bad and forget the good.

VV o n g B a

07-25-2003, 07:57 AM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Hello_Hapa @ Jul 24 2003, 06:05 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> I'm totally with you on the reality of actual adoption of foreign born Asian girls by white American couples. To make it clear that I'm not arguing either for or against it (and not really arguing about it at all), here's me saying yes Wongba, they are better off adopted than left in an orphanage. Agreed.

But in the past week and a half I had the experience where I saw like 5-8 representations of this in mainstream ads. I find it hard to believe that this proportionate representative of actual adoptions. Especially considering that most likely all Asian families most like outnumber white families with adopted Asian children in the US. Therefore, I find it weird that there I saw that many ads in such a short period of time showing white parents with Asian kids.

Sorry if I wrote something confusing, I tried to make sure I got 'ads' in the topic title. Am I wrong or do you think I'm trying to convince people that white people adopting Asians is wrong and it should be stopped? Because let me say right now that's not my point. Am I understanding you correctly? Not sure.

edit: and btw I did open up wondering if it was just coincidental. I know it might have just been chance to see that many so close together. [/b][/quote]
apparently we're in an agreementfest.

u'll notice i didn't say it wasn't weird.  i agreed with u that its weird.  and i don't believe that it is representative at all.  i don't believe its a coincidence b/c i have noticed the same thing.

but after taking note of the observation, what can u do with it?  basically, i'm saying there's not much point in discussing it b/c it's really just that... an observation.  i did understand that u were strictly talking about ads, but i went a step further and asked if u wanted to do anything about it.  seeing that u don't, then i'd be inclined to say that there isn't anything left to discuss.  its just something to keep in mind.

Tao

07-25-2003, 08:19 AM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (BeTheReds @ Jul 25 2003, 08:13 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> I remember there was this one commercial where this Asian couple just bought a house and were moving in and their annoying white neighbors kept trying to bother them when they just wanted to be left alone, so they close the garage door on them.

I think it was either a life insurance or bankloan commercial.

No asian seems to remember this becaue they only want to remember the bad and forget the good. [/b][/quote]
i don't even recall seeing such a commercial, let alone forget it intentionally

golden_buns

07-25-2003, 05:59 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (BeTheReds @ Jul 25 2003, 04:13 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> I remember there was this one commercial where this Asian couple just bought a house and were moving in and their annoying white neighbors kept trying to bother them when they just wanted to be left alone, so they close the garage door on them.

I think it was either a life insurance or bankloan commercial.

No asian seems to remember this becaue they only want to remember the bad and forget the good. [/b][/quote]
or maybe it's cuz many of them, including me, have not gotten to see this commercial

AngryABCGirl

07-25-2003, 08:56 PM

Does the concept of all these White parents adopting Chinese baby girls kind of rub anyone else in the wrong way?  Something about it feels really unsettling to me, maybe it's that they won't grow up with Chiense culture or that they may spend much of their lives feeling lost and marginalized by two societies, or the whole infamous "White Savior syndrome."  I'd rather see these girls raised with parents rather than not, but I'd rather see them grow up with Chinese parents or at least East Asian parents.

Chinese Tourist

07-25-2003, 10:05 PM

yes, I'd think it'd be pretty dangerous for those future generations. 

the demographic they are targeting is obviously the nerdy white man

I mean c'mon, my uncle-in-law is white and he's pretty cool but let's be real, these kinds of couples are way way overrepresented, and selling techy products.  Who the hell would care except nerdy white guys

Tao

07-25-2003, 10:27 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (AzNBuffGrL @ Jul 25 2003, 11:56 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Does the concept of all these White parents adopting Chinese baby girls kind of rub anyone else in the wrong way? Something about it feels really unsettling to me, maybe it's that they won't grow up with Chiense culture or that they may spend much of their lives feeling lost and marginalized by two societies, or the whole infamous "White Savior syndrome." I'd rather see these girls raised with parents rather than not, but I'd rather see them grow up with Chinese parents or at least East Asian parents. [/b][/quote]
what you said is true. and i have that feeling too. but then I remind myself that beggers can't be choosers. So i guess we'll just have to deal.

mr. x

07-26-2003, 12:04 AM

shy

07-26-2003, 08:04 AM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (hooligan @ Jul 24 2003, 09:04 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> it's quietly implying that asian babies and children are becoming the new accessory for surburban america. just like how pet rocks were during the 70s. [/b][/quote]
this is the typical conclusion i can't help but to see on this board often... personally, that disturbs me.

it is quite possible that their intent is not to impose a fad like the pet rock, but that they are trying to promote a conscious awareness of unwanted asian girls in china.

accessories.. please. my friend went through the adoption process. do you know how rigid it is? they want to make sure that all adopters will be ideal parents. i know that this system does fail and sometimes, a few nut-bags fall through the crack, but all in all... those that adopt put some very serious though into giving an orphan a good home.

it's so not about accessorizing and following the pet rock fad.

/rolls eyes/

shy

07-26-2003, 08:11 AM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (AzNBuffGrL @ Jul 25 2003, 07:56 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Does the concept of all these White parents adopting Chinese baby girls kind of rub anyone else in the wrong way? Something about it feels really unsettling to me, maybe it's that they won't grow up with Chiense culture or that they may spend much of their lives feeling lost and marginalized by two societies, or the whole infamous "White Savior syndrome." I'd rather see these girls raised with parents rather than not, but I'd rather see them grow up with Chinese parents or at least East Asian parents. [/b][/quote]
take it from me... what bothers you in this regards can be seen as on the petty side. sorry... but it has to be said.

doing my share of studies and research about both dysfunctional and healthy family environments... culture is not the only key to raising a healthy child. of course it is important for the child to have an understanding of his roots, but to what digree is questionable and depends on the child him/herself.

these children... of any race... need a loving home. loving and supportive homes are exactly what is the key here.

plus, adoption agencies require parents to go through many counceling seminars before they are even able to adopt. the idea of adopting a child that is different from their parent's race is most definitely touched upon.

in other words.. give the adopting parents some credit.

and... this needn't mean that the child won't be able to learn about his natural race. in time, if this is important to them (and remember, you and no one else can decide whether this is important to the child - what you want for yourself or your child should not dictate what is important to some one elses child in this type of scenerio), the child will seek out more of his/her roots.

kimpossible

07-26-2003, 09:20 AM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (VV o n g B a @ Jul 25 2003, 06:57 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Hello_Hapa @ Jul 24 2003, 06:05 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> I'm totally with you on the reality of actual adoption of foreign born Asian girls by white American couples. To make it clear that I'm not arguing either for or against it (and not really arguing about it at all), here's me saying yes Wongba, they are better off adopted than left in an orphanage. Agreed.

But in the past week and a half I had the experience where I saw like 5-8 representations of this in mainstream ads. I find it hard to believe that this proportionate representative of actual adoptions. Especially considering that most likely all Asian families most like outnumber white families with adopted Asian children in the US. Therefore, I find it weird that there I saw that many ads in such a short period of time showing white parents with Asian kids.

Sorry if I wrote something confusing, I tried to make sure I got 'ads' in the topic title. Am I wrong or do you think I'm trying to convince people that white people adopting Asians is wrong and it should be stopped? Because let me say right now that's not my point. Am I understanding you correctly? Not sure.

edit: and btw I did open up wondering if it was just coincidental. I know it might have just been chance to see that many so close together. [/b][/quote]
apparently we're in an agreementfest.

u'll notice i didn't say it wasn't weird. i agreed with u that its weird. and i don't believe that it is representative at all. i don't believe its a coincidence b/c i have noticed the same thing.

but after taking note of the observation, what can u do with it? basically, i'm saying there's not much point in discussing it b/c it's really just that... an observation. i did understand that u were strictly talking about ads, but i went a step further and asked if u wanted to do anything about it. seeing that u don't, then i'd be inclined to say that there isn't anything left to discuss. its just something to keep in mind. [/b][/quote]
Fair enough.

BeTheReds

07-26-2003, 10:57 AM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (YuheiCarreau @ Jul 25 2003, 06:11 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> How about these two images:

<img src='http://a1120.g.akamai.net/7/1120/51/24b34fe8575738/www.apple.com/ichat/images/index_top061703.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' /> <img src='http://a1280.g.akamai.net/7/1280/51/7d12a31a3e9cc1/www.apple.com/ichat/images/ichat_contexts031903v3.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' />

Which have been plastered all over Apple's stores and their website.

I can only imagine the advertising people meeting to create the campaign - "Biracial couple? Ooooh, very modern. Let's go with a White man and a Japanese woman. What's that you say? Go with a Japanese man? This is Silicon Valley, my friend. We don't have any Asian men around to photograph!" [/b][/quote]
I like how Junho Lee is conveniently out to lunch.

DragonKnight

07-26-2003, 12:48 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (BeTheReds @ Jul 26 2003, 09:57 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> I like how Junho Lee is conveniently out to lunch. [/b][/quote]
That's cause he's gonna be bangin Angela Vargas in a sec.

Cipherous

07-26-2003, 02:29 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (DragonKnight @ Jul 26 2003, 11:48 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> That's cause he's gonna be bangin Angela Vargas in a sec. [/b][/quote]
Shes been idle 140 hours!

krome

07-26-2003, 02:42 PM

promote a conscious awareness of unwanted asian girls in china
What about all the unwanted black babies here in the US? Where's all those commercials?

RasFarengi

07-26-2003, 04:39 PM

That is true, what about the kids right here in the US who need a home. Personally I think we should handle our own business before we run off to clean up China's mess, because those AMERICAN kids who got shoved around from foster home to foster home all their life, as wards of the state, many will be angry and they will be on the street in a neighborhood near you one day...and that is something our society has to deal with.

Kids in China...well if you don't bring them here, they are not a problem for us.

SunWuKong

07-26-2003, 07:58 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (RasFarengi @ Jul 26 2003, 07:39 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> That is true, what about the kids right here in the US who need a home. Personally I think we should handle our own business before we run off to clean up China's mess, because those AMERICAN kids who got shoved around from foster home to foster home all their life, as wards of the state, many will be angry and they will be on the street in a neighborhood near you one day...and that is something our society has to deal with.

Kids in China...well if you don't bring them here, they are not a problem for us. [/b][/quote]
it's supposed to be much much more difficult to adopt children in the US than adopting children from a country in Asia.

RasFarengi

07-26-2003, 08:01 PM

SunWuKung:

You brought up a good point. I assume this verys by state, but does anyone know how much more difficult it is to adopt an Asian National child than an American?  What kind of requirements their are...cost?

AliBabaIncorporated

07-26-2003, 08:30 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (RasFarengi @ Jul 26 2003, 08:01 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> SunWuKung:

You brought up a good point. I assume this verys by state, but does anyone know how much more difficult it is to adopt an Asian National child than an American? What kind of requirements their are...cost? [/b][/quote]
The figure I'm remembering is about $10,000 in fees and miscellaneous expenses to US adoption agencies, vs. $4,000 from a Chinese adoption agency, including the travelling expenses.

Also, lots of white parents probably think that black kids would be difficult to handle. They especially worry that adopted black kids (and to a certain extent, white kids) in the US would have been given up by irresponsible teen mothers who drank and used drugs during pregnancy, meaning the kid's not gonna be sleeping through the night for years, and may have lots of discipline problems as he gets older. And the NAACP has been calling it "genocide" and whatnot. So in the mind of the average prospective adopter, getting an Asian baby gives you an easier-to-handle product for a 60% discount. Cheap foreign labor wins out once again.

kimpossible

07-26-2003, 08:42 PM

That's weird. The one lady posting in the women's forum about wanting an Asian baby said on another site that she couldn't afford an international adoption but she still wanted an Asian baby so she had to switch her search to domestic Asian babies. *scratches head*

Napoleon Chynamite

07-26-2003, 09:03 PM

The pastor at my church (it's a Japanese church with mostly JA's and a few ABC's and FOB's but he's 3rd generation JA) and his white wife adopted a baby girl from China a few years ago *shrug* In my opinion, the girl really couldn't ask for better parents.

tapestrybabe

07-27-2003, 02:16 AM

i dont wanna give off the stereotype that every adopted child ends up being troubled and what not... my brother, whose black... he's pretty well adjusted... altho for myself... i think my experience has turned out to be different from his...

and i dont think anyone can really understand the effects of transracial adoption... unless... your actually in it yourself... unless you know what it feels like to be that child... and while i'm not against transracial adoption... i just think when ppl have the attitude... Oh, these children should be lucky... for being wanted in the first place by such parents... i feel sometimes... it just makes us silent when it comes to speaking about our own experiences... and internal struggles... like sometimes i sense an attitude of... shut up, stop complaining and whining... you should be lucky in the first place... but whateverz... yeah...

shy

07-27-2003, 07:15 AM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (tapestrybabe @ Jul 27 2003, 01:16 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> and i dont think anyone can really understand the effects of transracial adoption... unless... your actually in it yourself... unless you know what it feels like to be that child... and while i'm not against transracial adoption... i just think when ppl have the attitude... Oh, these children should be lucky... for being wanted in the first place by such parents... i feel sometimes... it just makes us silent when it comes to speaking about our own experiences... and internal struggles... like sometimes i sense an attitude of... shut up, stop complaining and whining... you should be lucky in the first place... but whateverz... yeah... [/b][/quote]
no one should assume what the child of an interracial adoption should be feeling and thinking.

actually, i would rather assume that the child will grow up with some questions and some confusion. and if they do, i don't think it's whining. i think it's very natural.

but this doesn't mean people should be fearfull or worrisome of interracial adoption.

the way this thread is running... there is a sense of over protectiveness that just sheilds children from the realities of the world. and it's like people forget the old sayind, "what doesn't kill us, makes us stronger." think about it... many of us have had our share of traumatic childhood experiences in one way or another. at some degree or another. it's helped shaped us to who we are today.

the child will grow up well adjusted so long as he/she is brought up by a loving family. just like any child.. adopted or not... interracial or not. sure it may require more work but life isn't perfect. and no two families are alike. and raising a family never comes without  a whole set/series of obstacles/problems.

bottom line... for those who think that interracial adoption is wrong... basically are saying that the child is at a disadvantage. but in my mind, the child is already at a disadvantage when they are w/out a family. and if no other asian family will take them, then what choice do they have?

i know a korean guy who was adopted by white parents. and he says he feels nothing BUT lucky. and he hasn't ignored his korean roots. in fact, his parents encourage him.

it would be very interesting to show him this thread... i wonder what he would say.

tapestrybabe

07-27-2003, 07:45 AM

and like i said... i DONT want to stereotype that every adopted child of an inter racial adoption turns out to be troubled... for some, like your friend... it turns out to be no big deal and not an issue.... but for others... it does... and while you may know... ppl like your friend... you still dont know what it feels like to be walking in my shoes and many others... who share this common internal struggle, the disconnection with the family and so forth... and to bring up the issue that inter racial adoption shouldnt be feared and worriesome... i think undermines... ppl on the OTHEr side... who do show concern about it...

i dont fall in the category of the extreme... but i do lean more to the other side... who advocates more asians, asian americans adopting other asians... and the fact that inter racial adoption will take place... i feel it shouldnt be taken lightly of... oh, if you just end up loving the child... thats good enough... its not that simple sometimes... but theres a need for a certain education-- when it comes to non asians... adopting kids of asian descent...

himura-dono

07-27-2003, 08:23 AM

himura-dono

07-27-2003, 08:28 AM

kimpossible

07-27-2003, 08:43 AM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (tapestrybabe @ Jul 27 2003, 06:45 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> and like i said... i DONT want to stereotype that every adopted child of an inter racial adoption turns out to be troubled... for some, like your friend... it turns out to be no big deal and not an issue.... but for others... it does... and while you may know... ppl like your friend... you still dont know what it feels like to be walking in my shoes and many others... who share this common internal struggle, the disconnection with the family and so forth... and to bring up the issue that inter racial adoption shouldnt be feared and worriesome... i think undermines... ppl on the OTHEr side... who do show concern about it...

i dont fall in the category of the extreme... but i do lean more to the other side... who advocates more asians, asian americans adopting other asians... and the fact that inter racial adoption will take place... i feel it shouldnt be taken lightly of... oh, if you just end up loving the child... thats good enough... its not that simple sometimes... but theres a need for a certain education-- when it comes to non asians... adopting kids of asian descent... [/b][/quote]
Well, correct me if I'm wrong but I don't hear you saying "I hated being fed, loved and given a family, as imperfect as it might have been."

From what I can tell you're saying, "I appreciate all that was done for me and I do love my family. But as an adult I have complex cultural, ancestral and social needs that have not been met. I feel my adoption in absolute terms was a wonderful thing but I need to reconnect spiritually and culturally to my ancestry and ethnic culture. Though I love my family, I feel I was cut off from that or it was something they could never provide."

Ain't a perfect interpretation but that's my general sense.

>:^|

07-27-2003, 05:42 PM

People in the U.S. who choose to parent through adoption should not solely bear the burden of being responsible for children needing homes in the U.S. 

No child should be made to feel "lucky."  All children are deserving of loving homes.  A child who has been adopted should not have his or her concerns or feelings discounted or dismissed by being reminded of the alternative fate that they _might_ have experienced.  It is a form of emotional blackmail. 

I think that we should be careful not to discount the concerns of transracial adoptees and the communities of color that share a heritage with those adoptees.  It is patronizing for non-affected parties to decide what should or should not be of concern to affected parties.  Certainly the Asian American community should recognize how this feels and works within the broader society. 

It could be said that "cultural genocide" is a valid concern.  Look at the First Nations people--their children forcibly removed from their homes, placed in Christian orphanages with the intent of "civilizing" them, and the IHS sterilizing native peoples against their will.

Contrary to popular opinion, and in keeping with tapestrybabe's opinion: 
Love is never enough. 

And getting back to the original question--it feels a little as if Asian Americans cannot be seen as individuals not under the auspices of Whites. 

Eros

07-27-2003, 11:09 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (shy @ Jul 26 2003, 10:04 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>accessories.. please. my friend went through the adoption process. do you know how rigid it is? they want to make sure that all adopters will be ideal parents. i know that this system does fail and sometimes, a few nut-bags fall through the crack, but all in all... those that adopt put some very serious though into giving an orphan a good home.

[/b][/quote]
I have to really agree with this point.  My aunt (who is white) adopted an asian baby years ago.  She was/is also a single woman (which I imagine was a stumbling block in the adoption process).  During process of checking her background there was a much talk about her, as a single woman, having a female roommate a few years a before.  Apparently they had to make sure that my aunt wasn't a lesbian and that the roommate wasn't a lover.  When I heard this story I was surprised at it (especially since same-sex roommates are common).

Personally, on this issue, I have to fall to the side of supporting the adoptions to a degree.  While in an ideal world, it would be better if asian americans (or asian in asia) were the ones adopting asian babies or, at least, if the non-asian future parents had to go through some training process to help them raise their asian kids.  Of course, ideally there also wouldn't be many kids who need to be adopted.  However, in the real world, it is better that kids are raised in by parent(s) rather than by an orphanage.

shy

07-28-2003, 06:22 AM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Hello_Hapa @ Jul 27 2003, 07:43 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (tapestrybabe @ Jul 27 2003, 06:45 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> and like i said... i DONT want to stereotype that every adopted child of an inter racial adoption turns out to be troubled... for some, like your friend... it turns out to be no big deal and not an issue.... but for others... it does... and while you may know... ppl like your friend... you still dont know what it feels like to be walking in my shoes and many others... who share this common internal struggle, the disconnection with the family and so forth... and to bring up the issue that inter racial adoption shouldnt be feared and worriesome... i think undermines... ppl on the OTHEr side... who do show concern about it...

i dont fall in the category of the extreme... but i do lean more to the other side... who advocates more asians, asian americans adopting other asians... and the fact that inter racial adoption will take place... i feel it shouldnt be taken lightly of... oh, if you just end up loving the child... thats good enough... its not that simple sometimes... but theres a need for a certain education-- when it comes to non asians... adopting kids of asian descent... [/b][/quote]
Well, correct me if I'm wrong but I don't hear you saying "I hated being fed, loved and given a family, as imperfect as it might have been."

From what I can tell you're saying, "I appreciate all that was done for me and I do love my family. But as an adult I have complex cultural, ancestral and social needs that have not been met. I feel my adoption in absolute terms was a wonderful thing but I need to reconnect spiritually and culturally to my ancestry and ethnic culture. Though I love my family, I feel I was cut off from that or it was something they could never provide."

Ain't a perfect interpretation but that's my general sense. [/b][/quote]
and i think hello_hapa has a point here....

tapestrybabe... don't get me wrong. i also pointed out that i don't expect those in your shoes NOT to have difficulties with connections and confusions. i would almost expect that because you're human. and at some point in time, said adopted child will most definitely have to come to turns w/ such crisis.

unless you feel that you have bad adopted parents that treated you badly though, i don't feel sorry for you... probably because i've seen children that weren't adopted but were abused or sexually assaulted by those that are in their family (immediate or other relatives). and i can't help but to think that these kids would have been better if there were adopted into a loving family.

i'm not dissing your problems though... i truely do hope you find the answers that you need. and you're right.. i haven't been in your shoes. but my point isn't about telling you how you should or should not feel.

so don't take my points so personally. if you are taking them personally, it's due to your own personal conflicts which is up to you to solve.

my main reason w/ all my points is that i find such comments from some people, like non-AA adopting AA kids to be like this fad or accessory, to be thoughtless, closeminded and completely illogical statements. and to be completely honest, i'll bet some of these said people aren't thinking on your level either... they're just whining about racism, to some degree, over something which has nothing to do w/ racism. at least to some degree...

furthermore... to get back to your situation... if you can honestly say that you have had good parents and a good home growing up, taking away your identity-cultural crisis, then it sounds to me that your parents, the one's that you know as parents now, did the best they could. they are human, after all, just like you.

have you talked to them about it? maybe they can at least be supportive of you if you let them be?

plus, sorry to say, but you feeling disconnected is something only you can fix.

good luck.

shy

07-28-2003, 06:31 AM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Eros @ Jul 27 2003, 10:09 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Personally, on this issue, I have to fall to the side of supporting the adoptions to a degree. While in an ideal world, it would be better if asian americans (or asian in asia) were the ones adopting asian babies or, at least, if the non-asian future parents had to go through some training process to help them raise their asian kids. Of course, ideally there also wouldn't be many kids who need to be adopted. However, in the real world, it is better that kids are raised in by parent(s) rather than by an orphanage. [/b][/quote]
very well said. sometimes we are faced w/ not always the most ideal, optimal choices... but regardless, there's still a choice. and there's still one choice that's better then the other.

i also agree that if it's going to be an interracial adoption, counceling should be provided. i believe it's done that way in canada.

kimpossible

07-28-2003, 08:19 AM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (shy @ Jul 28 2003, 05:22 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> my main reason w/ all my points is that i find such comments from some people, like non-AA adopting AA kids to be like this fad or accessory, to be thoughtless, closeminded and completely illogical statements. and to be completely honest, i'll bet some of these said people aren't thinking on your level either... they're just whining about racism, to some degree, over something which has nothing to do w/ racism. at least to some degree...

furthermore... to get back to your situation... if you can honestly say that you have had good parents and a good home growing up, taking away your identity-cultural crisis, then it sounds to me that your parents, the one's that you know as parents now, did the best they could. they are human, after all, just like you.

[/b][/quote]
Well I'd have to respectfully disagree... not in a big way though. And I have to say I think the discussion in this thread has assisted in putting an end to my fencesitting on this subject.

While I'm not opposed to transracial adoptions by any means, I don't think it isn't without a small amount of commodifying children based on their ethnicity. This doesn't mean that I think adoptive parents are bad people - but like you said, they're human and imperfect. They can be subject to wanting Asian kids like an ethnically chic accessory. I understand your reasoning Shy, in fact it's an excellent rebuttal and great way to swing the pendulum of the discussion the other way. But just as I listen to one side I can't ignore the other. I've met a few transracial adoptees in real life and read some accounts online. As much as we who were not transracial adoptees can sit and point and say "Goddam, you had food, shelter and love, what more did you need?" it doesn't address their needs to reconnect as adults. Maybe as a hapa I have a little more empathy with that goal. Who knows. But from adoptees I've talked to and online accounts I've read (yes, yes I know this includes stuff like Transracial Abductees) it seems to be a common experience among them.

In some ways, I think the adoptees get two families. One is the adoptive family that fulfills most of their physical and emotional needs growing up. The other family is the Asian American community - I think they jump in with both feet as adults, not uncommonly feeling alien in their own adoptive families.

I heartily disagree with anyone that has or will say that basically the adoptees should shut up because the life of an orphan is horrible. I heartily agree that adoption in absolute terms is a wonderful thing. But take away the hoopla and extremists cries of racism in transracial adoption and I still have some serious concerns. You can exist with food, water and shelter. You can blossom under love, guidance and protection. But how can you live, truly live and be happy as a person if you have, or at least feel you have, been stripped of your identity?

In any case, I'm not unconvinced that the image of a 3-4 year old Asian kid has not been commodified in a little puppy or exotic pet type of cute addition to the all-American family. I do find it disturbing that I see more images lately of white mothers with Asian children than I do Asian mothers of Asian children. It seems a very artificial separation. However, many of the counterpoints have finally got me off my ass to cease my fencsitting when it comes to adoption. My mother in law mentioned it to me before she passed away. At the time I dismissed it but now that we're having kids of our own my husband and I revisited the topic. There's a good chance we'll adopt in a few years.

bluetrianglescott

07-28-2003, 09:01 AM

Seems like there's several things going on--on one level, yes, definitely it's possible for there to be real love between adopted parents and children of different races. If I didn't think that, I'd be one sad person. But at the same time, I have heard white friends say things to me about how they'd love to someday adopt a Chinese baby or whatever, and they're implying this sort of "savior" role while also kind of fetishizing the "differentness"--my one friend actually said something like "Chinese babies are just so cute!" which struck me as patronizingly racist. She became very defensive when I pointed that out, but it gave her something to think about.

I think there's definitely something too in how the same people just (unconsciously?) rule out adopting an African American or Latino/a baby--not that it would be all hunky dory if they made that decision with the same "savior" mentality, but it does say something about how race configures itself in American consciousness.

then there's the whole other thing about how middle class families are the ones that tend to have all these ideas of themselves as capable of saving others, like with the little bit of privilege they have in this society, they can do something for the "innocent" victims of shit like poverty and capitalist dislocation and shit like that. I mean, there's some positive aspects of how they are drawn to embrace differences and that sort of thing, but the problem seems to be when it gets mixed in with that patronizing, savior stuff.

I guess what I'm saying is, if what you want is a baby, adopt a baby, and love it with all you've got. But if you want to help the poor little children of the world, then fight for a better world. Take responsbility for the stuff YOUR government is doing to make people poor.

shy

07-28-2003, 09:40 AM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Hello_Hapa @ Jul 28 2003, 07:19 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (shy @ Jul 28 2003, 05:22 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> my main reason w/ all my points is that i find such comments from some people, like non-AA adopting AA kids to be like this fad or accessory, to be thoughtless, closeminded and completely illogical statements. and to be completely honest, i'll bet some of these said people aren't thinking on your level either... they're just whining about racism, to some degree, over something which has nothing to do w/ racism. at least to some degree...

furthermore... to get back to your situation... if you can honestly say that you have had good parents and a good home growing up, taking away your identity-cultural crisis, then it sounds to me that your parents, the one's that you know as parents now, did the best they could. they are human, after all, just like you.

[/b][/quote]
Well I'd have to respectfully disagree... not in a big way though. And I have to say I think the discussion in this thread has assisted in putting an end to my fencesitting on this subject.
[/b][/quote]
keep in mind that i'm not coming down on every one in this thread. just a handfull that i've picked up on...

kimpossible

07-28-2003, 09:47 AM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (shy @ Jul 28 2003, 08:40 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
keep in mind that i'm not coming down on every one in this thread. just a handfull that i've picked up on... [/b][/quote]
*nods* Understood. But it was well said (by you) in any case.

tapestrybabe

07-28-2003, 10:23 AM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (>:^| @ Jul 27 2003, 08:42 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> People in the U.S. who choose to parent through adoption should not solely bear the burden of being responsible for children needing homes in the U.S.

No child should be made to feel "lucky." All children are deserving of loving homes. A child who has been adopted should not have his or her concerns or feelings discounted or dismissed by being reminded of the alternative fate that they _might_ have experienced. It is a form of emotional blackmail.

I think that we should be careful not to discount the concerns of transracial adoptees and the communities of color that share a heritage with those adoptees. It is patronizing for non-affected parties to decide what should or should not be of concern to affected parties. Certainly the Asian American community should recognize how this feels and works within the broader society.

It could be said that "cultural genocide" is a valid concern. Look at the First Nations people--their children forcibly removed from their homes, placed in Christian orphanages with the intent of "civilizing" them, and the IHS sterilizing native peoples against their will.

Contrary to popular opinion, and in keeping with tapestrybabe's opinion:
Love is never enough.

And getting back to the original question--it feels a little as if Asian Americans cannot be seen as individuals not under the auspices of Whites. [/b][/quote]
funny how this quote seems to have totally gotten ignored by everyone else... and its this quote that  grabbed my 100% attention from me... everything being said here... reflecting a true understanding... striking at the inner essense of how i feel...

truly, what you have said here, i couldnt have expressed it all better myself...

BeTheReds

07-28-2003, 10:49 AM

I've usually tried to stay out of threads like these because there was a time that nearly everything I said would offend a certain transracial adoptee on this message board, but I feel that those times have past, hopefully.

Anyway, I am not for or against transracial adoption. However in my experience, every female transracial adoptee I have met in person is sad, promiscuous, dislikes anything Asian (including guys), has a drug problem, or any combination of the above. This can't be a coincedence. Transracial adoptions will cause issues. Sometimes the adoptee has hatred towards Asians, and sometimes feeling angry at his or her parents for putting them in a situation that didn't give them much insight into their heritage. But the answer isn't to stop interracial adoption, because living anywhere, with any loving family IS better than growing up parentless in an orphanage. In the case of Korea, there is a stygma over adopting children who are not related to you by blood. Simply saying, damn those Koreans for having that view is also not enough. As Americans we have no right to judge another society for these kinds of views.

I agree with what tapestrybabe said about having Asians adopting asian babies. Moreover what I would like to see however is that Koreans in Korea adopt their own, tho I don't see the mindset changing.

Consequently, in America, most white adopting parents would want a white kid. There is a serious shortage of white kids to adopt. My mom's sister tried and honestly it's damn near impossible, so she adopted kids out of Ireland and the Ukraine.

There are also plenty of black children waiting to be adopted, but white americans would rather go overseas to get white kids or to get what they believe is the next best thing, Asians. Anyone who claims that they are NOT racist and using the Asian baby as proof throws a weak argument, because they could have adopted a black or hispanic child with ease.

As for adopting babies out of Korea, if it continues, Korea will see it as the solution to crowding in orphanages. Many young korean mothers with unwanted pregnancies will easily give their children up for adoption by kind loving white foreigners. However if for some reason White Americans STOP adopting Korean babies, and start taking care of American kids who need to be adopted. Then Korea will have a serious problem on its hands, as orphanages overcrowd, the government will try to find ways to make Korean people like the idea of adoption, thru education and public service announcements (or propaganda even... haha). They have a way of making the people think that "this is the korean thing to do!!" and it suddenly becomes the Korean thing to do. Example: at the opening of the sunshine policy with the north many people who had grown up institutionalized and indoctrined with hatred towards the north were treated to reuniions and crying people televized on large screens outside. and in public places like coex mall. It would be just as easy to show crying kids in orphanages and hear testimonials from adoptees who are unhappy with what has happened to them (conveniently not showing the well adjusted ones who are happy with their lives.) People will begin that hate america tirade and go out and adopt their own to save these kids from american imperialism.

I know it's not that simple, but we are talking about some serious issues here. For every asian kid who is adopted by white parents, there are probably 2 non-white
American kids who are in an orphanage.

I also think that people who call Asian adoptees ungrateful to their families for speaking out on what they think is a social problem need to be quiet, becase as someone who is not an adoptee, it is impossible to know the kinds of things that an adoptee has to deal with. 

shy

07-28-2003, 10:53 AM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Hello_Hapa @ Jul 28 2003, 08:47 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (shy @ Jul 28 2003, 08:40 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
keep in mind that i'm not coming down on every one in this thread. just a handfull that i've picked up on... [/b][/quote]
*nods* Understood. But it was well said (by you) in any case. [/b][/quote]
okay... i have some time to pose a couple of questions to your previous post...

regarding the disconnection thing... aren't a lot of people who have been adopted finding that they want answers of where they came from? yes, perhaps a child who's a different race from the adopters feel more then just "where did i come from" but also "who can i identify with?" but generally, don't all adoptees, regardless of interracial families or not, face some identity crisis and/or disconnection at one point in time?

plus i'm a huge advocate of accountability and ownership. though i sympathize with what they must deal with, as i do with any child who must adapt to a special situation (in comparison to the majority of their peers), also think that we all have to deal with with the cards that we're delt with.

nothing is perfect in this world. nor should perfection be expected. but once we all take ownership of things that we never asked for and just deal with it, aren't we all in a place that's much better? or should we just remain victimized?

for every kid out there that is in such a situation for feeling, "i wish i wasn't adopted" or "i wish i was adopted by parents w/ the same race" i'll bet there's at least one kid out there that's thinking, "i wish i was adopted so i didn't have to live with my abusive parents!"

i'm just trying to put things into perspective here. the big picture...

regarding the commercials that are showing more non-AA's with AA kids.

this COULD be a result of just being up with the times. i mean, for awhile, i could remember people complaining that there weren't enough interracial coupels and/or families on the media.

are we damned if we do... and damned if we don't?

kimpossible

07-28-2003, 10:56 AM

Just sharing some info I found. We're getting more into the actual adoptions themselves rather than the original media image anyhow.

I'm reading this for my own edification.

KAD Nationalism (http://www.geocities.com/kadnation/)

shy> didn't want to do another post so I amended this one. I would recommend the link I posted above. I'm reading it right now. Interesting stuff. It critiques the Korean government and social view of adoptions as well.

But regarding the multicultural families; no problem there. But since when do we just lightly skim over African American families, Hispanic families like they're invisible (I say this because those images don't seem to be used as much) and jump straight to white family with eternally 3-4 year old Asian kids? My answer to that is because it's a palatable image for white Americans. I'm not out to dog white people, I'm nearly 3/4 white myself. But I know how well these images are constructed, tested and researched. And the appeal it's trying to make creeps me out a bit. Feels a little colonial to me.

edited to fix my damn spelling

SunWuKong

07-28-2003, 11:54 AM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Hello_Hapa @ Jul 26 2003, 11:42 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> That's weird. The one lady posting in the women's forum about wanting an Asian baby said on another site that she couldn't afford an international adoption but she still wanted an Asian baby so she had to switch her search to domestic Asian babies. *scratches head* [/b][/quote]
maybe she doesn't want to do the adoption in the "official" way...

SunWuKong

07-28-2003, 12:13 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (shy @ Jul 28 2003, 01:53 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Hello_Hapa @ Jul 28 2003, 08:47 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (shy @ Jul 28 2003, 08:40 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
keep in mind that i'm not coming down on every one in this thread. just a handfull that i've picked up on... [/b][/quote]
*nods* Understood. But it was well said (by you) in any case. [/b][/quote]
okay... i have some time to pose a couple of questions to your previous post...

regarding the disconnection thing... aren't a lot of people who have been adopted finding that they want answers of where they came from? yes, perhaps a child who's a different race from the adopters feel more then just "where did i come from" but also "who can i identify with?" but generally, don't all adoptees, regardless of interracial families or not, face some identity crisis and/or disconnection at one point in time? [/b][/quote]
maybe some transracial adoptees feel this "disconnect" to a much much larger degree.  a lot of minority people who aren't even adopted are stygmatised by simply being a minority in the US/Canada.  i might be talking out of my ass here because i wasn't adopted, but i can only imagine that this "disconnect" is much more eminent with transracial adoptees.  it's not just about having white parents.  what if all your relatives are white, but you are Asian?

SunWuKong

07-28-2003, 12:25 PM

i found a book at Borders or Barnes & Noble once which i thought was very nice. it was about a single white woman who adopted a little girl from China. the woman had spent parts of her childhood in China and had travelled there quite a bit as an adult. here's the book: Wuhu Diary (http://www.adoptivefamilies.com/articles.php?aid=398). i thought it was really touching that she wrote a letter to the girl's unknown mother, in which she wrote "don't worry, she will know where she came from."

<img src='http://www.adoptivefamilies.com/photos/20030310012238_398_P.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' />

by the way, does anybody have any information on adopting babies from Africa?

thaite

07-28-2003, 12:30 PM

by the way, does anybody have any information on adopting babies from Africa?

Hey man! This ain't an adoption site!

SunWuKong

07-28-2003, 12:33 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (thaite @ Jul 28 2003, 03:30 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
Hey man! This ain't an adoption site! [/b][/quote]
hah!   :lol:

but no, seriously.  i've never heard of adopting babies from Africa.  does that happen?

BeTheReds

07-28-2003, 01:20 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (SunWuKung @ Jul 29 2003, 04:33 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (thaite @ Jul 28 2003, 03:30 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
Hey man! This ain't an adoption site! [/b][/quote]
hah! :lol:

but no, seriously. i've never heard of adopting babies from Africa. does that happen? [/b][/quote]
No, because if an American family wants to adopt a black kid, there are plenty of American black kids waiting for adoption.

IT just so happens tho that the majority of couples seeking to adopt are white, and usually don't want to adopt black kids. 

If there are plenty of domestic black orphans, there is no need to worry about overseas adoptions hassles that would come with adopting a kid out of nigeria or ethiopia.

shy

07-28-2003, 01:38 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (SunWuKung @ Jul 28 2003, 11:13 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> what if all your relatives are white, but you are Asian? [/b][/quote]
well i do have white relatives. my favourite uncle is white. i don't think of him as my white uncle though. i think of him as my fave uncle because he's been there for me the most which is a lot more i can say then some of my other uncles...

shy

07-28-2003, 01:41 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Hello_Hapa @ Jul 28 2003, 09:56 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> But regarding the multicultural families; no problem there. But since when do we just lightly skim over African American families, Hispanic families like they're invisible (I say this because those images don't seem to be used as much) and jump straight to white family with eternally 3-4 year old Asian kids? My answer to that is because it's a palletable image for white Americans. I'm not out to dog white people, I'm nearly 3/4 white myself. But I know how well these images are constructed, tested and researched. And the appeal it's trying to make creeps me out a bit. Feels a little colonial to me. [/b][/quote]
well, i can't deny that you don't have a point. or at least, i can understand why you bring up this notion as it's plausable.

but i am also a firm believer that in order to be progressive in this world, it takes time. and we need to start somewhere. and most definitely, nothing of true value can happen over night... and stay that way.

it's a long road until we reach a better goal.

anyway, my conclusion is that i don't think there's anything wrong with those commericals. and i don't think there's anything wrong with non-AA adopting AA children.

instead of fighting the reality that there are non-AA's adopting AA children, i think it's way more effective to accept the fact, but look into strenghening the support that these kids will need when they start to face some disconnection.

and also any preventative steps in counceling the parents even before they adopt the child.

RasFarengi

07-28-2003, 01:48 PM

SunWuKung:

If you want a black kid to go with your black (not black)...not real girlfriend... :D

Here you go...

http://www.safricanadoptions.com/TheProcess.html

SunWuKong

07-28-2003, 01:52 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (shy @ Jul 28 2003, 04:38 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> well i do have white relatives. my favourite uncle is white. i don't think of him as my white uncle though. i think of him as my fave uncle because he's been there for me the most which is a lot more i can say then some of my other uncles... [/b][/quote]
well, anyway, my point was that what if you had no relatives you can go to, to ask about your ethnic heritage...  some adopted Asian kids might be able to ignore their race internally, but there are going to be times when society makes it a point to make sure they know that they're not white.

you wouldn't find it strange if everybody you were related to were white?  i think i would find that strange.

AngryABCGirl

07-28-2003, 04:33 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (SunWuKung @ Jul 28 2003, 12:52 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> well, anyway, my point was that what if you had no relatives you can go to, to ask about your ethnic heritage... some adopted Asian kids might be able to ignore their race internally, but there are going to be times when society makes it a point to make sure they know that they're not white.

you wouldn't find it strange if everybody you were related to were white? i think i would find that strange. [/b][/quote]
I'd find it really strange and disconnected.  AAs are already disconnected from everything by societal design, and we have parents and grandparents and lands to look back to, but we're still in some way estranged from all of that.  Magnify that by 100x for these adopted babies.

amietron

07-28-2003, 04:48 PM

BigLew

07-28-2003, 04:52 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (AzNBuffGrL @ Jul 28 2003, 03:33 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (SunWuKung @ Jul 28 2003, 12:52 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> well, anyway, my point was that what if you had no relatives you can go to, to ask about your ethnic heritage... some adopted Asian kids might be able to ignore their race internally, but there are going to be times when society makes it a point to make sure they know that they're not white.

you wouldn't find it strange if everybody you were related to were white? i think i would find that strange. [/b][/quote]
I'd find it really strange and disconnected. AAs are already disconnected from everything by societal design, and we have parents and grandparents and lands to look back to, but we're still in some way estranged from all of that. Magnify that by 100x for these adopted babies. [/b][/quote]
It's not strange while you are growing up just because it is all you ever knew.  Most adoptees (including me) were adopted at a very young age, something can only be "strange" if you have something else that is "not strange" to compare it with and if being the oddball is all you ever knew it's not strange just sad. 

Actually what I found strange was my first interactions with other Asians and thier annoyance with the fact that I didn't "act asian" enough for them.

The feeling I had was of being alone kinda like I was my own race.  My parents couldn't understand the difference of an insult and a racial insult therefore couldn't truly console me if I got into a fight in school cause some other kid was pulling back his eyes.  Then when I finally met asians, the feeling was solidified in the by the feeling I couldn't even relate with people that did look like me.

You get a couple of common outcomes that I have seen in these situations.  The first is: kids grow up accepting an honorary white status proud of thier european family name and keep only superficial ties to thier asian heritage hence "I'm still Korean because I can use chopsticks and I like kim chi."  The second is where kids grow up to disdain the fact they were separated from thier culture, become alienated from thier white parents and overcompensate by being extreme in thier "pride" of being asian.

tapestrybabe

07-28-2003, 05:48 PM

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (BigLew @ Jul 28 2003, 07:52 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (AzNBuffGrL @ Jul 28 2003, 03:33 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (SunWuKung @ Jul 28 2003, 12:52 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> well, anyway, my point was that what if you had no relatives you can go to, to ask about your ethnic heritage... some adopted Asian kids might be able to ignore their race internally, but there are going to be times when society makes it a point to make sure they know that they're not white.

you wouldn't find it strange if everybody you were related to were white? i think i would find that strange. [/b][/quote]
I'd find it really strange and disconnected. AAs are already disconnected from everything by societal design, and we have parents and grandparents and lands to look back to, but we're still in some way estranged from all of that. Magnify that by 100x for these adopted babies. [/b][/quote]
It's not strange while you are growing up just because it is all you ever knew. Most adoptees (including me) were adopted at a very young age, something can only be "strange" if you have something else that is "not strange" to compare it with and if being the oddball is all you ever knew it's not strange just sad.

Actually what I found strange was my first interactions with other Asians and thier annoyance with the fact that I didn't "act asian" enough for them.

The feeling I had was of being alone kinda like I was my own race. [/b][/quote]
yeah, same here... at a young age, thats how i kinda felt...
my brother whose black... i've just always viewed him as my natural brother... just like with my white sister... to me, its just been normal to me... cuz i've never known any other way... to compare it to...

but it has been encountering other asians that i often felt weird about... even at a very young age like 5th grade... when i was the only asian in class... i remember this new korean student entered in class in the middle of the school year... she didnt know english that well.... and i remember that weird feeling to me... like BEFORE... i didnt give too much thought i was the only asian... but when she entered as a new student... she made me all the more conscious and aware of my asian ness in a sea of a class of non asians... and the other students... they would never let me forget how asian i was... when it comes to their attitude of clumping me and her together... anyways, while this new korean student ended up gravitating towards me... unfortunately, i kinda tende