DO NOT WATCH "Dumb and Dumberer", RACIST!

[chunglove]

I went to watch "Dumb and Dumberer" and it was such a HORRIBLE movie! First of all, they portrayed an Asian female as a Fresh Off The Boat girl who couldn't speak a word of English whom they named Ching Chong. Then, they made racial jokes poking fun at the Asian language by communicating with this Asian girl by speaking in these exact words "Ching Ching Chong." Flashback, does this sound familiar to anyone???? Such as the Shaq incident. Then the movie continues with the Asian racial joke in which they fast forward a tape in a tape player and say " NOW THAT'S CHINESE!!!" Then, the white guy in the movie gets the Asian girl and tells her that he ONLY wants to hear her speak in her BUSTED UP Accent in which she complies subserviently. This movie made me SICK to my stomache. I utterly did NOT find any humor in their racist jokes NOR the potty humor that was implied. I found this movie DERAGATORY to Asian Women and RACIST towards Asians. Haven't we learned already from the Shaq incident, Abercrombie and Fitch, and many others that I am probably not aware of that RACISM will NOT be tolerated. I am asking you all, WE need to BOYCOTT this movie, the company, AND the people who produced this movie. We are all human beings and should be treated EQUALLY.

[Iconoclastic]

yes. Can anyone who knows how to start a petition start one? What bullshit.

[Jenny]

It seems a little too late to boycott it since it's already out, but I'm behind whatever it is you guys choose to do all the way. Good thing I rarely go to the theater though. :rolleyes:

[pinkskyes]

that sounds horrible...

can u enlighten me on the shaq and abercrombie and finch things?(im in australia)

[YuheiCarreau]

http://angryasianman.com/angry.html

for a longer diatribe against Dumb & Dumberer.

[mr. x]

Originally posted by pinkskyes@Jun 14 2003, 08:04 PM
that sounds horrible...

can u enlighten me on the shaq and abercrombie and finch things?(im in australia)
the abercrombie and fitch thing was i believe about a year ago and basically A & F designed a coupla shirts with designs featuring asian caricatures like squinty chinamen in straw hats

the shaq incident was when shaq was apparently miffed cuz yao referred to him in some way. so shaq's like "yeah well tell yao "ching chong blah blah blah (orientalish crap) "

[mr. x]

yes! its like The Toll of the Sea for the new generation! man even if i were an asian woman dating a white guy id find this shit offensive

[tvbdude]

after seeing so many of these AF & WM pairs, I have more courage to ask asian girls out.

[mr. x]

Originally posted by tvbdude@Jun 14 2003, 09:11 PM
after seeing so many of these AF & WM pairs, I have more courage to ask asian girls out.
err are u white?

btw if u wanna girl like the one in this movie than ur looking in the wrong places

[Bhodi_Li]

From what I've been hearing about this movie, it hasn't been doing too well at the box office. Can anyone confirm this?

[rakovlam]

From what I've been hearing about this movie, it hasn't been doing too well at the box office. Can anyone confirm this?

nope, it's the number #3 movie as of Friday.

[Jenny]

Anyone not think it's a coincidence that they put it out at the same time as Jim Carrey's "Bruce Almighty" comes out? Trying to ride the coattails of his success. <_<

[tvbdude]

Originally posted by mr. x@Jun 15 2003, 01:16 AM
err are u white?

btw if u wanna girl like the one in this movie than ur looking in the wrong places
100% chinese. because I see all these girls from my race dating white guys, I am pissed, that's why I have more courage. haha, the earlier post does make me sound white.

[Deadpool]

Wait....you actually paid money to watch this movie? :lol:

[Tao]

i'll sign a petition if the mods and admins here are willing.....but now that I think about it, what exactly will it do? I mean I doubt they're gonna pull the movie just cause we object. That being said I also didn't see the movie so if anyone has a better description, like a transcript or something (besides the angryasianman one), it help alot.

[DragonKnight]

DO NOT WATCH "Dumb and Dumberer"

Didn't plan on watching it anyway. Movie looked like a piece of shit to begin with. Now it's confirmed that its a racist piece of shit. So to hell with it. :angry:

[blue hoodie]

When I read this on Angry, I got hella pissed. When is Hollywood going to learn? Does anyone know if anyof the active Asian groups out there are doing anything about this?

[deez nuts]

Originally posted by Deadpool@Jun 15 2003, 01:01 AM
Wait....you actually paid money to watch this movie? :lol:
hahahaha

werd.

[luv]

Didn't plan to see it anyways....it seems like such a waste of money even for rental...

[ChairmanMah]

it's complete shit. Those guys are jackasses and dorks but i have to admit, that movie is supposed to be stupid. Look at the main characters.

Also, almost every east indian male i've ever seen on t.v. has worked at a convenience store and had an accent too.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

[ChairmanMah]

Originally posted by chunglove@Jun 14 2003, 07:06 PM
Then, the white guy in the movie gets the Asian girl
this is just another ploy to educate the white dorks to steal our women again.

the only way to send a message i think is to send lettermail of our views to every asian residence with an asian last name in north america. Then the power to fight will come out.

if only there was an asian activist rich enough to spend his money on all the postal service.


i think that this would help asians become more vigilante and fight for their social rights knowing that we have banded together.

but honestly, most asian ppl probly don't give a shit like us. and they might be the ones perpetuating the stereotype.

[Faithless]

Here's a review, but no talk of racism.

http://www.cinecon.com/news.php3?d=030613&n=2

[mr. x]

hmm, guess it dropped fast cuz as of sunday its number 6

im also glad hollywood homicide didnt do so well, not that its racist but it looks like shite too

[himura-dono]

ok, not that i'm trying to defend it, but maybe bring a little thought into it, a movie about two borderline retarded guys. do you really think they're gonna be pc about anything? :rolleyes:

[mr. x]

Originally posted by himura-dono@Jun 15 2003, 01:43 PM
ok, not that i'm trying to defend it, but maybe bring a little thought into it, a movie about two borderline retarded guys. do you really think they're gonna be pc about anything? :rolleyes:
but shit when DO we start complaining, only when a sophistimicated movie does it?

[kitty]

I think a petition might be a good idea... at least to try and encourage people not to see the movie -- but it might just increase publicity... I definitely think it would be a bad idea to just shut up and put up!! Asians are picked on precisely because we don't mobilize and take action... would jokes like these targeting other ethnic groups fly in today's Hollywood?

I think we could at least have someone write a review to post on the main site... would someone write this and submit it? I would but I haven't seen the movie.

[cftofu]

i dont think jim carrey is in dumb and dumberer. i doubt i'll go see this movie anyways, since its stupid and racist.

[chunglove]

Where else can I post my complaints about this movie??? I am sick and tired of them making fun of Asians. I'm ready to put an IRON FIST down their throats.

[kitty]

wow... that's amazing energy... I definitely think we should do something but we need to think about what we can do and what we can effectively accomplish.

[mr. x]

check out the website: http://www.whenharrymetlloyd.com/
on the "checklist" thing there's a chinese name, which for all i know says "blowjob" or "dogshit" or something

anyway here's a transcript of the entire movie courtesy of those quasi pirates "the movie spoiler" : http://www.themoviespoiler.com/Spoilers/du...nddumberer.html (http://www.themoviespoiler.com/Spoilers/dumbanddumberer.html)

The movie opens up in a hospital room where a woman is giving birth. The doctor there is puzzled that the baby keeps moving out of the woman, but then keeps crawling back in. The doctor then puts his hand in to give him a pull and the baby bites him. We then find out that this is Harry's mom as the opening credits start going.

The next scene is Harry at eight years old, looking down into a well in the backyard of his house. He calls the police and says his friend fell in, but when the police show up, we find out the friend is imaginary and is named Captain Ron. His mother apologizes to the officer for the incident.

The movie then jumps to the present, 1986, where Harry is now seventeen. His mother finally decides to put him into regular school after all his education came from home schooling. He is reluctant about going, but his mom hands him a treasure map and says follow it to get to the treasure (the map leads to the school). So he goes off on his way.

We now are taken into the school, where we find out Lloyd is living, with his father, who is the janitor. His dad is also getting him ready for his first day, and dresses him up all nice with clothing from the lost and found. He then sends Lloyd on his way, who now is looking for the school, even though he is already there. He leaves the school in search of the school.

Along the way, Harry and Lloyd run into each other (literally). Lloyd chips his tooth and Harry gets the other part of it in his forehead.

The two instantly bond and follow Harry's treasure map, which takes them back to the school.

They make their way back to school, and the two of them encounter a beautiful girl named Jessica. Jessica pulls Harry to the side and tells him that she wants to do a story on him for the school paper.

Harry is too stupid to realize what exactly is going on. During this, a boy with a mohawk named Turk comes and starts beating on Lloyd. Lloyd tells Harry that Turk is a friend of his, even though this doesn't appear so. Jessica is upset at Turk's behavior and walks off. Turk then takes the two of them and hangs them from the flagpole.

During this, in the principal’s office, we meet the sleazy principal and his partner in crime, the school's head lunch lady. In order to scam money for themselves, they get the idea to set up a mock special needs class. Having a special needs program will allow the school to receive 100,000 dollars from the school board. They will then embezzle the money, and go to a tropical island. However, in order to do this, they need to set up a special needs class. Looking out the window, they see Harry and Lloyd hanging from the flagpole, and they decide that those two would be the perfect candidates to set up the class.

Later that day, Harry and Lloyd are given an assignment from the lunch lady to recruit more kids for the class. Thinking they are important, the two agree to do it. The recruits include a kid with a broken arm and leg and his girlfriend, Turk, who is joining the class to avoid a suspension for spying in the girl's locker room, a boy who works in town as a mascot of various products, another boy who is insanely obsessed with football, and a Chinese girl, an exchange student who barely speaks any english. The class is then established.

That night, Lloyd spends the night at Harry's house, while leaving behind a note for his father, written in ketchup across the gym floor. The two of them spend the night acting like idiots, and then as Harry's mom kisses Harry and Lloyd goodnight, Lloyd thinks that Harry's mom has made a move on him. This now has Lloyd thinking that she has a crush on him and he's going to become Harry's father.

The next day the duo head down to a 7-11 type store to purchase some slurpees. The two of them start playing a game of tag in the store, getting the clerk very irate. The clerk demands the two pay him the money for the slurpees, while Lloyd tags him, making the clerk "it". The clerk at first doesn't give into the game, but then tags Lloyd and calls "no backsies" and other assorted calls. The two give up and pay for their drinks and leave the store. Outside, the two decide to drink their cold drinks very fast, causing them to have brain freeze.

While this is going on, Jessica is on to the new "special needs" program, believing it is a scam. She decides that this would be a great story for her to write, and she goes into Nancy Drew mode. The next day when the class goes on a field trip to the museum, Jessica decides to follow them. The lunch lady, realizing Jessica is following them, directs the bus driver to loose Jessica. After a car chase, Jessica is stopped behind a Mac truck while the bus makes its way to the museum.

At the museum, Harry stares at a polar bear and wonders if it is real or not when Jessica appears behind him. Jessica tells Harry that they need to talk, and for him to come to her house that evening. Harry believes that she asked him on a date, and he goes to his best buddy Lloyd for help. Lloyd then tells him what he needs to do is bring her chocolate. Harry then buys a candy bar at the machine.

Later that night, Harry goes to Jessica's house. Jessica answers the door and tells him to come upstairs to her room. While in her room, Jessica starts to question Harry about the program, while Harry is sitting on a heater. Harry starts getting burned by the heater and jumps up and asks her to go to the bathroom. He leaves and heads to the bathroom to realize that the chocolate he bought has completely melted. Trying to get the chocolate off his hands, he wipes it all over the bathroom, making it look like he crapped all over everything. Jessica then knocks on the door and asks Harry to stay for dinner, and Harry agrees, but his clothing is all ruined from the chocolate and the bathroom is completely covered in it as well.

While this is happening, Lloyd decides to head over to Jessica's house to check up on his friend. Harry starts talking to him out the window, and Lloyd tells him to go downstairs so he can tell him what to say to her from the outside, like he saw in the movies. He agrees. Harry leaves the bathroom and finds a suit, which he changes into. He comes downstairs and tells Jessica that he changed for dinner. Lloyd is right outside and is now telling Harry what to say to her, when a dog comes up to Lloyd. Lloyd then starts talking to the dog, saying things such as "I knew it was you I remember your nipples" and other things, which Harry parrots to Jessica. Jessica's father then comes in to see what is happening, and then announces dinner is ready. Harry goes to join him at the table while Jessica spots Lloyd outside.

While Harry goes to the dinner table, Jessica starts talking to Lloyd about the program. Lloyd tells her that he has access to the principal's office, because of his dad being the janitor, which gets Jessica so happy that she kisses him. Harry sees this all happen and he gets very upset at Lloyd and leaves Jessica's house. Lloyd tells Jessica that he'll meet her at the school at eight so they can go into the principal's office. Meanwhile, Jessica's father enters the bathroom to find the mess Harry left him. He starts announcing that there's $hit all over the place in a very loud voice as the scene ends.

While Lloyd is waiting for Jessica to meet him at the school, he has a fantasy about Jessica and Harry's mom fighting over him. He then announces that this will be settled with a "make out contest", and Jessica and Harry's mom hook up. The fantasy then ends with Lloyd farting, and Jessica asking if he farted back in the real world. The two of them then go into the office, where Jessica is looking for clues and Lloyd is thinking that they're having a date. Jessica doesn't find anything, and then leaves when she spots her boyfriend outside. Lloyd is heartbroken, but while still in the office, he finds a treasure chest. Thinking that this was Harry's treasure, he takes the box and leaves the office.

He then goes to Harry's house to find that Harry is very upset at him about what happened at Jessica's house. Lloyd tells him that nothing happened between them, but Harry doesn't believe him and is now talking to his imaginary friend Captain Ron again. Lloyd is upset and leaves.

As Lloyd is walking back through town, he spots a man in a pirate costume. The person in the costume is the kid who is in his class and who works as being a mascot. Lloyd thinks that he's Captain Ron, and attacks him. He then remembers how much fun he had with Harry, so he goes to the museum, steals the polar bear and brings it back to Harry's house. When he gets there, the two come to terms with each other and bond again.

Back at the school, the principal realizes his treasure chest is missing. The lunch lady tells him that she believes it was Jessica who took it, because she was following them to the museum on the trip. The principal finds Jessica and kidnaps her.

While that is going on, the lunch lady is teaching the class, telling them that they must build a float for the Thanksgiving parade. The class works together and creates a George Washington float for the parade.

Meanwhile, the principal stops outside the 7-11 store to make a call to Jessica's parents. Disguising himself as a friend of hers, he tells them they are having a sleepover and not to expect her home that night.

While that happens, the duo is waiting outside the store, wanting to get slurpees, but the clerk is waiting for them to come into the store so he can "tag" them. They find a kid who they bribe to get them the slurpees, after he does, they start laughing at the clerk, but it turned out that the clerk peed in them.

After they leave victorious, they spot Jessica in the principal's car where he is keeping her. They now think that he is her boyfriend and they decide to follow him. They follow them back to the principal's house, where he keeps Jessica handcuffed to a chair. Jessica denies all knowledge of her having the treasure chest, and as the principal leaves the room to investigate a tape she had (which was actually given to her by Lloyd), she spots the duo outside the window. She tells them to use the chest to expose the principal, which they decide to do.

They go back to Harry's house where the chest is and discover all the scams the principal has done. They then find a tape explaining his plans to use the "special needs" program to embezzle money, and they then alter the George Washington float to make it look like the principal. They find their other classmates and show them what they have discovered, and at the Thanksgiving Day parade, they would expose them. Oh, and it also turns out that the exchange student speaks perfect english.
At the parade, the special needs kids drive the float out and play the tape of the principal's scam blueprint, and the principal and lunch lady are arrested. They duo find Jessica again and she thanks them for what they have done, and then runs off with her boyfriend.

After that is done, Harry and Lloyd are walking down the street when a car with two beautiful ladies pulls up next to them. After they both decide not to let women come between them again, the two ladies get offended and drive away, with the tires splashing mud all over Harry. Harry then runs out in the middle of the street where he is hit by a car. Driving the car is Jessica's father, who realizes that he just hit Harry, and now his car is covered in mud, which he believes is $hit. He starts yelling about how his car is covered in crap, as the two friends walk away together.

During the credits, various outtakes and such are shown.

[mr. x]

the spoiler kinda glosses over her scenes, the website dont even give her a damn name in the credits, she's just that chinese girl (fuck why didnt they get anna may wong to play her)

http://us.ent4.yimg.com/movies.yahoo.com/images/hv/photo/movie_pix/new_line_cinema/dumb_and_dumberer__when_harry_met_lloyd/_group_photos/derek_richardson4.jpg

probly not even a fob type, probly some desperate asian girl in the LA area in search of work

[Deadpool]

Wow. Do all of those anglos get a turn to ride the Chinadoll like a bike in the movie?
If I was raised soley on American media I would have sworn Asian males don't exist and if they do they usually are FOBs with thick accents and Asian women exist for the sole purpose of servicing white males. Aren't they just purrrfect for eachother? :gross: *Puke*

[tvbdude]

find that girl and murder her :ph34r:

[mr. x]

Originally posted by tvbdude@Jun 15 2003, 08:44 PM
find that girl and murder her :ph34r:
like i said, hard to do cuz they dont even credit her

anyone know what the text says on the website?

[mr. x]

ive got a name, Michelle Krusiec: http://www.imdb.com/Name?Krusiec,+Michelle

also look here: http://www.girlpower.gov/girlarea/gpguests...ts/oneworld.htm (http://www.girlpower.gov/girlarea/gpguests/oneworld.htm)

i like how the second one talks about her knowledgeability when she does this ignorant piece of trash.

[tvbdude]

Originally posted by mr. x@Jun 16 2003, 02:26 AM
ive got a name, Michelle Krusiec: http://www.imdb.com/Name?Krusiec,+Michelle

also look here: http://www.girlpower.gov/girlarea/gpguests...ts/oneworld.htm (http://www.girlpower.gov/girlarea/gpguests/oneworld.htm)

i like how the second one talks about her knowledgeability when she does this ignorant piece of trash.
I don't see it anywhere that she knows about the movie. She is pretty but a traitor to her race.

[ChinaLama]

this is why people don't take "activists" seriously. "Find the girl and murder her?" "I would but I don't know her name?"

[SunWuKong]

it's admirable when asian actors put their feet down and refuse stereotypical roles, but i don't think anybody has a right to criticise their choice of roles unless they've been asian actors themselves in hollywood.

[AliBabaIncorporated]

Originally posted by tvbdude@Jun 16 2003, 02:14 AM
Originally posted by mr. x@Jun 16 2003, 02:26 AM
ive got a name, Michelle Krusiec: http://www.imdb.com/Name?Krusiec,+Michelle

also look here: http://www.girlpower.gov/girlarea/gpguests...ts/oneworld.htm (http://www.girlpower.gov/girlarea/gpguests/oneworld.htm)

i like how the second one talks about her knowledgeability when she does this ignorant piece of trash.
I don't see it anywhere that she knows about the movie. She is pretty but a traitor to her race.
*yawn*

"traitor to her race" ... "find that girl and murder her" ... hahaha you sound like that white pride website ChairmanMah posted three days ago. I guess that's aZnPRyDe for ya.

Maybe, like most people, she is just looking out for her own interest (rather than the interest of her "Asian brothers" who would probably bitch about her no matter what role she played) and doesn't give a flying fuck about people who will go ballistic over a movie whose entire content is an adolescent joke.

[deez nuts]

alrite i'm with you, guys

let's go murder her....

you guys go first. i'll catch up.

Dieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee traitor!

AzN pRyDe!

[lethal]

"One World"

I knew I recognized her from somewhere. I'm pretty sure her character on that show isn't all that favorable either. She's either ditzy or slutty or both. I forgot.

Doesn't matter. People take roles that they can get. Everyone's gotta put food on the table.

Its great if they can get better roles, but don't blame the actors...blame the casting people, writers, directors, and producers for not giving better parts to good actors.

I'm not watching this movie...never intended to. But one thing to do is write the production and distribution company. Real letters, not just e-mail. These companies listen to what the public wants. I've heard something where each letter represents 10 or 100 moviegoers...I forgot what it was.

You don't like it, don't pay the studio any money and write them protest letters. They listen to your wallets.

[himura-dono]

Originally posted by mr. x@Jun 15 2003, 01:51 PM
but shit when DO we start complaining, only when a sophistimicated movie does it?
i see it from two angles if it's bad enough.

1. fux0ring with asians and any other minority pisses me off.

2. propagation of whitie = racist also pisses me off.

i mean look at it from both of those and you'll see what i mean. in all the movie examples we've ever talked about, both topics are there. but no one blames white hollywood for continuing to make white people look like racist trash. =(

[himura-dono]

Originally posted by ChinaLama@Jun 15 2003, 11:41 PM
this is why people don't take "activists" seriously. "Find the girl and murder her?" "I would but I don't know her name?"
naw, they're not "activists" they're "aKtiViztZ".


btw, anyone who payed to see this movie is totally dumberest.

[sOKaLiBoY]

hell at best all i would have done is download the movie. now i see it's not worth that. i wonder how much money she got to play the fob?

[Jenny]

Originally posted by SunWuKung@Jun 16 2003, 12:54 AM
it's admirable when asian actors put their feet down and refuse stereotypical roles, but i don't think anybody has a right to criticise their choice of roles unless they've been asian actors themselves in hollywood.
I agree. It's easy for us to criticize her for taking a role like that... but you can imagine how hard it must be to for an Asian to get a job in Hollywood. She is probably trying to make the best of the acting career that she's got. And for the AA actors that choose stereotypical, or even racist roles, they probably figure that the backlash from a fraction of the 4% of Asian Americans in the US is worth it to get national recognition/exposure, and another thing to add to their resume. From a serious actor's POV, it would make sense (with the exception of the "Better Luck Tomorrow" cast since they've already made a point of not doing this). And honestly, she's not in the position where she can easily turn down roles because she can expect a new one to come along at any moment. So after some thinking, I blame the writers of the script for forcing Asian American actors to settle for such demeaning roles.

Ohh, and I remember her on "One World". I remember when I saw her I liked the fact that she wasn't playing a stereotypical Asian American girl. :)

[himura-dono]

asians are 8% i think

[Jenny]

Originally posted by himura-dono@Jun 16 2003, 07:10 AM
asians are 8% i think
I'm just going by the 2000 census, it might've gone up since then.

[Tao]

i guess AA progress in the media is similar to that of blacks back in the days when they were only allowed to play blundering idiots, or deviants in films and on TV. And also when African women were also viewed as exotic and wild in bed.

But still, when I looked at the link to her resume here (http://www.imdb.com/Name?Krusiec,+Michelle). Her role as "Ching Chong" still bothered me. I still think a petition or writing letters is appropriate. I mean that's like telling a black guy "hey wanna play the role of nigger?" That language just rubs me the wrong way.

[lethal]

Originally posted by Tao@Jun 16 2003, 11:40 AM
i guess AA progress in the media is similar to that of blacks back in the days when they were only allowed to play blundering idiots, or deviants in films and on TV. And also when African women were also viewed as exotic and wild in bed.

But still, when I looked at the link to her resume here (http://www.imdb.com/Name?Krusiec,+Michelle). Her role as "Ching Chong" still bothered me. I still think a petition or writing letters is appropriate. I mean that's like telling a black guy "hey wanna play the role of nigger?" That language just rubs me the wrong way.
I'm not fond of "Ching CHong" either...but isn't that a potentially real name? I've never met anyone with that name, but I have met people with the first name Ching and different people with the last name Chong.

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by himura-dono@Jun 16 2003, 11:10 AM
asians are 8% i think
nation-wide it's 4%.
many, if not most, are FOBs, and would not give half a shit about hollywood movies or how hollywood portrays them.

[Tao]

well the way they use it here it's more along the lines of having the ending credits read:

"Ching Chong - Michelle Krusiec
Spic - John Perez
'boy' - Tyson Beckford "

Technically you could say that it is a legit name, but I bet if you see the movie her name won't be actually "ching chong," they just call her that out of convience.

note: sorry for the extensive use of racial epithets

[himura-dono]

oh... well, i said think, but i'll gladly admit i'm totally wrong =)

[kitty]

Originally posted by lethalweapon@Jun 16 2003, 03:47 PM
Originally posted by Tao@Jun 16 2003, 11:40 AM
i guess AA progress in the media is similar to that of blacks back in the days when they were only allowed to play blundering idiots, or deviants in films and on TV. And also when African women were also viewed as exotic and wild in bed.

But still, when I looked at the link to her resume here (http://www.imdb.com/Name?Krusiec,+Michelle). Her role as "Ching Chong" still bothered me. I still think a petition or writing letters is appropriate. I mean that's like telling a black guy "hey wanna play the role of nigger?" That language just rubs me the wrong way.
I'm not fond of "Ching CHong" either...but isn't that a potentially real name? I've never met anyone with that name, but I have met people with the first name Ching and different people with the last name Chong.
Potentially but I'm sure it's a play on the fact that they can speak chinese to her by saying "ching chong" whatever to her as someone said earlier.

[YuheiCarreau]

Originally posted by SunWuKung@Jun 16 2003, 11:55 AM
nation-wide it's 4%.
many, if not most, are FOBs, and would not give half a shit about hollywood movies or how hollywood portrays them.
That's because FOBs are the same as White people in the US. You make it sound like they're the wiser of the two because they're above all the 'whining' about how Asians are portrayed in the US media, but the truth is they don't give a shit only because they don't have a clue what it's like to grow up as a minority and constantly be shown by the media and the people around them that their culture is worthless and OK to make fun of.

The only kinds of people that have been seriously racist against me are White Americans and FOB Japanese, and although I'm not holding a grudge against ALL Whites and Japanese, I know that their experiences and attitudes are more like each other's than my own. I don't expect FOBs to be offended just 'cause they're Asian, and by the same logic just 'cause they're Asian doesn't mean their opinions matter in this case - because they weren't raised in the US and (for the most part) are just as clueless as Whites about how it feels to be stereotyped and discriminated against.

[Faithless]

Originally posted by mr. x@Jun 15 2003, 08:02 PM
the spoiler kinda glosses over her scenes, the website dont even give her a damn name in the credits, she's just that chinese girl (fuck why didnt they get anna may wong to play her)

http://us.ent4.yimg.com/movies.yahoo.com/images/hv/photo/movie_pix/new_line_cinema/dumb_and_dumberer__when_harry_met_lloyd/_group_photos/derek_richardson4.jpg

probly not even a fob type, probly some desperate asian girl in the LA area in search of work
So, then, how incidental is the Asian characterization? And is it worth it to boycott a movie on something if it's slight?

[SunWuKong]

i think it's kind of fucked up. everytime an Asian woman gets a role in Hollywood, she steps on people's toes for being "stereotypical". it's as if an Asian woman must play a boringly average character in order to be accepted by Asian Americans.

1. can't kungfu
2. can't be booksmart, that's a model minority myth
3. can't be dumb, that's negative portrayal
4. can't be the object of sexual desire
5. can't be evil
6. can't play classical music (that's a stereotype... even though you know as well as i do that most asian people in our generation play at least one classical instrument)
7. can't speak english with an accent
8. etc etc etc

and the most ridiculous thing about it is, after the character passes all those tests, the acceptability of her choice of roles then depends on whether or not the character is matched up with an asian male character.

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Jun 16 2003, 12:34 PM
Originally posted by SunWuKung@Jun 16 2003, 11:55 AM
nation-wide it's 4%.many, if not most, are FOBs, and would not give half a shit about hollywood movies or how hollywood portrays them.
That's because FOBs are the same as White people in the US. You make it sound like they're the wiser of the two because they're above all the 'whining' about how Asians are portrayed in the US media, but the truth is they don't give a shit only because they don't have a clue what it's like to grow up as a minority and constantly be shown by the media and the people around them that their culture is worthless and OK to make fun of.
Asian Americans' "culture" is American culture. i'm not saying that FOBs are wiser, i'm saying that they don't seek social approval from white people. that's something that American born/raised Asians can learn.

[chunglove]

i think it's fucked up that Asians always have to play a "stereotypical" role. Yes, it's the actors choice of the role they chose but where are the available roles for a STRONG ASIAN female or male???? How often do they have roles like that for Asians in the movies?? Usually, in the movies, Asians have been portrayed as evil bad guys and girls, idiots who can't speak English correctly, or innocent and submissive.

[Faithless]

Originally posted by SunWuKung@Jun 16 2003, 09:30 AM
i think it's kind of fucked up. everytime an Asian woman gets a role in Hollywood, she steps on people's toes for being "stereotypical". it's as if an Asian woman must play a boringly average character in order to be accepted by Asian Americans.

1. can't kungfu
2. can't be booksmart, that's a model minority myth
3. can't be dumb, that's negative portrayal
4. can't be the object of sexual desire
5. can't be evil
6. can't play classical music (that's a stereotype... even though you know as well as i do that most asian people in our generation play at least one classical instrument)
7. can't speak english with an accent
8. etc etc etc

and the most ridiculous thing about it is, after the character passes all those tests, the acceptability of her choice of roles then depends on whether or not the character is matched up with an asian male character.
Would people have a problem if an Asian woman played an unidentifiable Star Trek character?

[537]

Originally posted by SunWuKung@Jun 16 2003, 09:30 AM
i think it's kind of fucked up. everytime an Asian woman gets a role in Hollywood, she steps on people's toes for being "stereotypical". it's as if an Asian woman must play a boringly average character in order to be accepted by Asian Americans.

1. can't kungfu
2. can't be booksmart, that's a model minority myth
3. can't be dumb, that's negative portrayal
4. can't be the object of sexual desire
5. can't be evil
6. can't play classical music (that's a stereotype... even though you know as well as i do that most asian people in our generation play at least one classical instrument)
7. can't speak english with an accent
8. etc etc etc

and the most ridiculous thing about it is, after the character passes all those tests, the acceptability of her choice of roles then depends on whether or not the character is matched up with an asian male character.
I have been reading this thread since it was created, and SWK has stated exactly what I was thinking.

I neglected to post my views on this particular subject for this long for the sole reason that I don't have the time to argue my views (at friggin' work!). Anyhow, I think for those of you that don't wish to watch this movie based only on this particular character.....you shouldn't! Just....don't....watch it. In regards to the actress' role in the movie, I think that would be a comical portrayal and wouldn't think anything else of it. She's doing what we're all trying to do - get money!

Let her do her job, will ya?

Stereotypes are just that - stereotypes. They are either created out of ignorance, or projected out of hate. In either instance, what harm does it do you to just pay no attention to the idiocy and lunacy of that which is directed towards a myth? Give people credit where credit is due. Have faith in the people you wish to associate yourself with that they will not be weak-minded enough to fall for the steretypical images prevalent everywhere. As for the people that do not possess 'free thought' for themselves, and instead rely on stereotypical portrayals and common generalizations to judge a person's character for them......everybody's got to ask themselves:

Is this person of enough value to you to reveal the truth to? Do you even care what this person thinks?

[chunglove]

While actresses in the movies are busy portraying how a typical Asian female should be for the LOVE of MONEY, I'm just a normal Asian female trying to get through the day with Blacks and White who I encounter through work, in the streets, and from school automatically assuming that I can't speak a word of English, ask me about kung fu moves, and make racial taunts such as "Sukkky suckkky!" Do I enjoy such encounters?...NO. Would I like to make some changes?..YES. Will it ever change? Probably NOT. This movie is another prime example of stereotyping Asians.

[golden_buns]

where's Geegeh and Asianrules when we need them

[DragonKnight]

Originally posted by chunglove@Jun 16 2003, 10:14 AM
and make racial taunts such as "Sukkky suckkky!" Do I enjoy such encounters?...NO. Would I like to make some changes?..YES. Will it ever change? Probably NOT.
*Holds baseball bat in a threatening position*

I'll be glad to 'encourage' some change in where you work. Just tell me where the f*cks are at and 'fuggitaboutit'. :angry:

-Rich

[golden_buns]

Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Jun 16 2003, 08:34 AM
That's because FOBs are the same as White people in the US. You make it sound like they're the wiser of the two because they're above all the 'whining' about how Asians are portrayed in the US media, but the truth is they don't give a shit only because they don't have a clue what it's like to grow up as a minority and constantly be shown by the media and the people around them that their culture is worthless and OK to make fun of.
True, they don't know what is like to be the only asian kid in town. My parents never understood that

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by chunglove@Jun 16 2003, 02:14 PM
While actresses in the movies are busy portraying how a typical Asian female should be for the LOVE of MONEY, I'm just a normal Asian female trying to get through the day with Blacks and White who I encounter through work, in the streets, and from school automatically assuming that I can't speak a word of English, ask me about kung fu moves, and make racial taunts such as "Sukkky suckkky!" Do I enjoy such encounters?...NO. Would I like to make some changes?..YES. Will it ever change? Probably NOT. This movie is another prime example of stereotyping Asians.
where do you live, and just how often do you encounter non-asian people that assume you can't speak english and knows kungfu, as opposed to how often you encounter non-asian people that make no such assumptions?

and next time someone thinks you can't speak english, curse him/her out in the asian language of your choice.

[YuheiCarreau]

Originally posted by SunWuKung@Jun 16 2003, 01:37 PM
That's because FOBs are the same as White people in the US. You make it sound like they're the wiser of the two because they're above all the 'whining' about how Asians are portrayed in the US media, but the truth is they don't give a shit only because they don't have a clue what it's like to grow up as a minority and constantly be shown by the media and the people around them that their culture is worthless and OK to make fun of.
Asian Americans' "culture" is American culture. i'm not saying that FOBs are wiser, i'm saying that they don't seek social approval from white people. that's something that American born/raised Asians can learn. [/quote]
I didn't say word one about AA culture. I'm talking about being Asian in America, more specifically how Asians are treated by non-Asian Americans. I could give two shits whether Joe Redneck thinks well of Japanese culture, I just don't want him thinking it's OK to scream CHING CHONG at Asians or make fun of anyone who's ESL and has difficulty with the language. I'm not talking about begging for tablescraps from Whites, I'm talking about being treated with dignity. Even if I don't want the 'social approval' of Whites to validate my culture, if I live and work in the US I still need respect from them in order to function well.

[golden_buns]

Originally posted by SunWuKung@Jun 16 2003, 09:30 AM
i think it's kind of fucked up. everytime an Asian woman gets a role in Hollywood, she steps on people's toes for being "stereotypical". it's as if an Asian woman must play a boringly average character in order to be accepted by Asian Americans.

1. can't kungfu
2. can't be booksmart, that's a model minority myth
3. can't be dumb, that's negative portrayal
4. can't be the object of sexual desire
5. can't be evil
6. can't play classical music (that's a stereotype... even though you know as well as i do that most asian people in our generation play at least one classical instrument)
7. can't speak english with an accent
8. etc etc etc

and the most ridiculous thing about it is, after the character passes all those tests, the acceptability of her choice of roles then depends on whether or not the character is matched up with an asian male character.
amen.

[kitty]

I agree (edit: what Yuhei said) ... while it's true that it'll be difficult to find a role that will please all asian americans (BLT was enough proof of that), I think it's justifiable to be outraged by such a blatant dehumanization and disrespecting of Asians. Ching Chong's character is an example of so many different negative stereotypes, it's almost on the level of Kung Pow/Steve Oederkirk. While I can understand if we're talking Kelly Hu's character, Lady Deathstrike, in X2... I really don't think this argument is really viable when we're talking about Dumb and Dumberer.

[deez nuts]

http://us.ent4.yimg.com/movies.yahoo.com/images/hv/photo/movie_pix/new_line_cinema/dumb_and_dumberer__when_harry_met_lloyd/_group_photos/derek_richardson4.jpg


awwwwwwwwww.......

she looks so hot in that little red outfit. kinda looks like chun li.

that bizatch is da shizatch.


oh yeah forgot....

die bitch die! all traitors must die.

aZn PrYdE p0wAh!

fear of a yellow planet!

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Jun 16 2003, 02:24 PM
Originally posted by QUOTE@SunWuKung @ Jun 16 2003, 01:37 PM
Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Jun 16 2003, 08:34 AM
That's because FOBs are the same as White people in the US. You make it sound like they're the wiser of the two because they're above all the 'whining' about how Asians are portrayed in the US media, but the truth is they don't give a shit only because they don't have a clue what it's like to grow up as a minority and constantly be shown by the media and the people around them that their culture is worthless and OK to make fun of.
Asian Americans' "culture" is American culture. i'm not saying that FOBs are wiser, i'm saying that they don't seek social approval from white people. that's something that American born/raised Asians can learn.
I didn't say word one about AA culture. I'm talking about being Asian in America, more specifically how Asians are treated by non-Asian Americans. I could give two shits whether Joe Redneck thinks well of Japanese culture, I just don't want him thinking it's OK to scream CHING CHONG at Asians or make fun of anyone who's ESL and has difficulty with the language. I'm not talking about begging for tablescraps from Whites, I'm talking about being treated with dignity. Even if I don't want the 'social approval' of Whites to validate my culture, if I live and work in the US I still need respect from them in order to function well.
are we still talking about American popular media here?

do you honestly think that this movie will instill the idea into someone that it's ok to scream ching chong at asian people?

i'm saying that asian americans should care less about what hollywood does, like FOBs. and you're saying that you don't want non-asian people to be racist toward asian people. i don't think you're talking the same thing that i'm talking about.

[blue hoodie]

Originally posted by SunWuKung@Jun 16 2003, 10:46 AM
do you honestly think that this movie will instill the idea into someone that it's ok to scream ching chong at asian people?

actually, yes I do think so. This is a median that influences millions of people. so yes, I do think that this movie would reinforce those kind of behaviors and sterotypes. We might know better that it's just a stupid ass joke in the movie, but there are a lot of stupid people out there who won't.

[chunglove]

I have to agree completely with blue hoodie. Unfortunately, there ARE people out there that will believe that it's okay to call an Asian Ching Chong or Mr. Wong (the portrayal of a pathetic and weak Asian male) http://icebox.allcharge.com/shows/show_won...g/showpage.html (http://icebox.allcharge.com/shows/show_wong/showpage.html)

Most of the time, people know that it's not okay to do so because it's racist but their defense will be that they saw it in the movies or on the internet etc, therefore making it seem acceptable when it's NOT.

[YuheiCarreau]

Originally posted by SunWuKung@Jun 16 2003, 02:46 PM
Asian Americans' "culture" is American culture. i'm not saying that FOBs are wiser, i'm saying that they don't seek social approval from white people. that's something that American born/raised Asians can learn.
I didn't say word one about AA culture. I'm talking about being Asian in America, more specifically how Asians are treated by non-Asian Americans. I could give two shits whether Joe Redneck thinks well of Japanese culture, I just don't want him thinking it's OK to scream CHING CHONG at Asians or make fun of anyone who's ESL and has difficulty with the language. I'm not talking about begging for tablescraps from Whites, I'm talking about being treated with dignity. Even if I don't want the 'social approval' of Whites to validate my culture, if I live and work in the US I still need respect from them in order to function well. [/QUOTE]
are we still talking about American popular media here?

do you honestly think that this movie will instill the idea into someone that it's ok to scream ching chong at asian people?

i'm saying that asian americans should care less about what hollywood does, like FOBs. and you're saying that you don't want non-asian people to be racist toward asian people. i don't think you're talking the same thing that i'm talking about. [/quote]
Yes, I do think people will see this movie and think it's OK to scream "ching chong" at Asians. They won't think they're being particularly clever when they do it, but they'll do it all the same.

And I'm saying that for most AAs, avoiding American media isn't an option. A lot of them can only speak English, just like the majority of people in the US, while FOBs are fluent in their native language and can easily immerse themselves in Asian music, books, and television (not to mention Chinatowns, Koreatowns, etc.).

You've mentioned before that you've foregone all non-Chinese magazines and newspapers to improve your Chinese literacy. You've also said that you'd like to go back to HK, and possible raise a family there. But what if the only home you've ever known is the US, and you don't have the time, money, or even just the patience to learn your ancestral language? For a lot of AAs, being a minority in the US isn't a choice, it's a certainty, because realistically they have no other options. For me, going back to Japan doesn't better my situation at all; the only difference would be that over there, instead of being a Chink or a Jap I'll be a haafu or Americajin. I don't want to be a minority and I'm not trying to exaggerate my victimhood, but until someone builds an island for hapas I have to accept that no matter where I live I'll be surrounded by people who are not like me and have no vested interest in respectfully representing me, my characteristics, my circumstances, and those of people like me. "Be more like a FOB" to me just means "Be a White person with Yellow skin", because the only thing that sets FOBs apart from AAs is that they still act as if they're members of the majority, and they can easily avoid any people, magazines, TV shows, etc. that might show them otherwise.

[chunglove]

The question of where I live and how often I encounter these assumptions from Black and Whites is not the point. The point implied is that I will NOT be the ONLY Asian individual who will encounter such racist taunts. My experience with such encounters is only a small minute portion of what other Asians have experienced. An example would be our parents, many of whom cannot speak English fluently nor can they understand it when they're being made fun of by other race for simply being a "Chink". I will also not exclude our children or brothers and sisters, who go to schools or live amongst Whites and Blacks, that will encounter racial epithets in one form or another. Most of these racist taunts, generalization, stereotypes come from non other than what's shown on any screen t.v. or movie etc. So, when will the lines of racism be defined?? It will only be defined when Asians get together and put OUR foot down and draw the line.

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Jun 16 2003, 05:18 PM
Yes, I do think people will see this movie and think it's OK to scream "ching chong" at Asians. They won't think they're being particularly clever when they do it, but they'll do it all the same.

well, i'd have to disagree with you on this. i don't think it'll cause anybody in this day and age to start screaming "ching chong" unless they already have it in them to be ignorant like that, or if they're already growing up in an environment that tells them it's ok to do so. i don't think a movie like this will change non-ching-chong-screaming people into ching-chong-screaming people, especially since movies with this kind of blatant racist stupidity no longer saturates hollywood.

Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Jun 16 2003, 05:18 PM
And I'm saying that for most AAs, avoiding American media isn't an option. A lot of them can only speak English, just like the majority of people in the US, while FOBs are fluent in their native language and can easily immerse themselves in Asian music, books, and television (not to mention Chinatowns, Koreatowns, etc.).

and a lot of non-Asian people can manage to stay away from consuming mainstream popular media. i don't see how Asian people in this country who only speak English cannot do the same, especially since most Asian films nowadays have English subtitles. how the hell have i been enjoying Korean cinema since i don't speak Korean?

and nobody is forcing anyone to watch movies like Dumb and Dumberer. 99% of all other movies from hollywood in recent years have not been this blatantly racist. people can whine about movies like this all they want, i myself make sarcastic remarks now and then about them, but why do you want to give a fuck about a movie like Dumb and Dumberer. this is not some "critically acclaimed" movie.

99.9% of all American music is not racist against Asians
i have honestly never read any book that would encourage ching-chong-screaming
most TV programs nowadays are not racist against Asians, and most of them are pure stupidity anyway.
most hollywood movies nowadays are also not racist, even though they have unrealistic portrayals of Asian people. and like i've mentioned before, if you don't like hollywood, there are Asian films in subtitles. or maybe you don't like Asian films. well, sorry, you're a minority. such is the lot of your life. boo-hoo.

but hey, go ahead and complain. you have a constitutional right to it, after all.

Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Jun 16 2003, 05:18 PM
but until someone builds an island for hapas

i think it's called Hawaii.

[achtungbaby]

Moving to Rant...

[achtungbaby]

Originally posted by SunWuKung@Jun 16 2003, 10:30 AM
i think it's kind of fucked up. everytime an Asian woman gets a role in Hollywood, she steps on people's toes for being "stereotypical". it's as if an Asian woman must play a boringly average character in order to be accepted by Asian Americans.

1. can't kungfu
2. can't be booksmart, that's a model minority myth
3. can't be dumb, that's negative portrayal
4. can't be the object of sexual desire
5. can't be evil
6. can't play classical music (that's a stereotype... even though you know as well as i do that most asian people in our generation play at least one classical instrument)
7. can't speak english with an accent
8. etc etc etc

and the most ridiculous thing about it is, after the character passes all those tests, the acceptability of her choice of roles then depends on whether or not the character is matched up with an asian male character.
It's not when someone appears as a kung-fu master, smart or whatever Asian stereotype, it's when these roles have been created to deliberately lampoon or ridicule a culture. It's this pattern that people get annoyed with.

[Faithless]

Originally posted by chunglove@Jun 16 2003, 12:54 PM
I have to agree completely with blue hoodie. Unfortunately, there ARE people out there that will believe that it's okay to call an Asian Ching Chong or Mr. Wong (the portrayal of a pathetic and weak Asian male) http://icebox.allcharge.com/shows/show_won...g/showpage.html (http://icebox.allcharge.com/shows/show_wong/showpage.html)

Most of the time, people know that it's not okay to do so because it's racist but their defense will be that they saw it in the movies or on the internet etc, therefore making it seem acceptable when it's NOT.
Usually, the people yelling ching chong, in the first place, are pre-disposed to doing so -- usually, your typically trailor trash of all races.

[achtungbaby]

My two cents:

I haven't seen the movie and would prefer to see it myself before judging it, but...if you're talking about taking specific actions against the movie, forget about boycotting it. That's precisely what they want. Boycott their fucking sponsors.

[Faithless]

Originally posted by achtungbaby@Jun 16 2003, 02:23 PM
My two cents:

I haven't seen the movie and would prefer to see it myself before judging it, but...if you're talking about taking specific actions against the movie, forget about boycotting it. That's precisely what they want. Boycott their fucking sponsors.
And what you end up doing is giving air-time to idiotic defenders like those who defend the Mr. Wong character.

[AliBabaIncorporated]

Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Jun 16 2003, 04:18 PM
For a lot of AAs, being a minority in the US isn't a choice, it's a certainty, because realistically they have no other options. For me, going back to Japan doesn't better my situation at all; the only difference would be that over there, instead of being a Chink or a Jap I'll be a haafu or Americajin. I don't want to be a minority and I'm not trying to exaggerate my victimhood, but until someone builds an island for hapas I have to accept that no matter where I live I'll be surrounded by people who are not like me and have no vested interest in respectfully representing me, my characteristics, my circumstances, and those of people like me. "Be more like a FOB" to me just means "Be a White person with Yellow skin", because the only thing that sets FOBs apart from AAs is that they still act as if they're members of the majority, and they can easily avoid any people, magazines, TV shows, etc. that might show them otherwise.
You seem to be making a bunch of unfair generalizations of FOBs which at best might be a good description of some expatriate Japanese businessmen who intend to return to Japan ASAP.

I hardly see any real immigrant FOBs deliberately avoiding US culture. People like me and SWK read so many Chinese newspapers not cuz our written Chinese is good, but cuz it needs improvement. Most FOBs, unless they already had an insanely expensive English-language education (*cough* international school brats *cough*), are instead trying to soak up a bit of the English language and figure out their way around the new country they're in, and one way they do that is by watching American TV.

The reason behind not caring about some movie role is not that they fool themselves into believing they're members of the majority --- that is far more difficult for foreigners in the US than for Americans overseas simply cuz you are gonna encounter the language barrier every time you walk to the store to buy a pack of smokes --- or are ignorant of the fact that the movie role exists in the first place, but because they don't see that it has any effect on anything they care about, such as work, family, etc. And they don't see their coworkers or their kids shouting "ching chong" at them.

In contrast to your stereotype of the clueless FOB who wouldn't notice anything about American society if it came up and shook his hand, actually, most foreigners in a foreign society observe more than the natives --- natives are used to all the stimuli around them and filter out everything except the wildly exceptional because they are so familiar. Foreigners, on the other hand, see everything, cuz none of it fits patterns they are used to back from home. And unlike a native, one thing they notice includes thousands of white people who pass them on the street and don't yell "hey ching chong," but instead walk straight by without noticing, or nod, ask if the seat next to them on the bus is taken, or say "excuse me" as they bump into him, or whatever. Because, of course, back at home there are no white people dressed in American fashion and walking like Americans doing any of those things.

It's hardly impossible for an AA to take mental notice of all those white people who treat them normally, in place of of the typical pattern of losing sleep because somewhere out there, horror of horrors, there are still white people who don't accept them.

And as for Joe Redneck, he's gonna go on shouting ching-chong at Asians and never having a thought about the moral ramifications of it not cuz the media tell him it's okay, but cuz his peer group in his little cowtown in the middle of nowhere have no one they give a fuck about telling them it's not okay. People they give a fuck about do not include some whiners boycotting a movie. They would go on with their ching-chong comments even if the protests drove all of Hollywood out of business.

In fact people they give a fuck about does not appear to include most of their surrounding society, because at some point in their lives their schoolteachers have told them about the negative effects of racism, they've seen the shows in the popular media which make fun of racists and shows the negative effects of racism (and of their own small-town culture), their big-city friends have rebuked them for saying stupid things about this group or that group, and they simply didn't give two shits.

In the mean time, protesting a movie like "Dumb and Dumberer" just promotes a new stereotype of Asian-Americans --- that of the people who whine every time one of their own shows up in the media in any context that isn't 100% Asian ... what's the headline gonna be, "Asian-American Groups Protest Movie; Claim "Dumb and Dumberer" Lacks Intelligent Message"? Come on people, this is a comedy film which most people will have forgotten about 5 minutes after they get in the car, not an all-time classic.

And finally, as SWK pointed out, if some people are really that paranoid about being around white people in the first place, they can go to Hawaii where instead it's the Asians being racist against the whites and yelling "Haole go home!"

[Tao]

obviously adults, well intelligent ones, who do go see the movie will realize that calling the girl ching chong might just be looked down upon and be considered racist. However, what I'm really afraid of here is that the large number of children who will see this movie and think it's fun to say that to the asian kid at their school and taunt them, cause they saw their idol do it, and apparently got a good laugh out of it. This movie, no matter how silly and easily dismissed by adults, is very influential amongst young children. That's why I want to protest this movie, cause it's teaching a new generation to think it's cool to hate.

[SunWuKong]

Asian Americans have an identity based on being stigmatised and discriminated against for being Asian in America. it's sort of like people that cut themselves.

[deez nuts]

i can't believe we're ranting about the political correctness of a movie called dumb and dumberer.

hi, got too much time on your hands?

a&f i stood by and was vocal about.

kung fool i stood by and was vocal about.

this is just fucking stupid to the point of being embarrassing for me.

it's like the old fook yu and fook mi austin powers thread awhile ago.

we're bordering on black whining and moaning activism here.

someone call korean hunk so he can live out his asian al sharpton martyr fantasy.

[deez nuts]

it has nothing to do with being a fob, abc etc etc.

it has to do with not having common sense, having too much time on your hands and just bitching for the sake of bitching.

[kasia]

Originally posted by Chasiubao_Boy@Jun 16 2003, 03:33 PM
i can't believe we're ranting about the political correctness of a movie called dumb and dumberer.
that was my first thought. that it's just 'dumb and dumberer' and nobody's going to watch it. kinda like 'kung pao'?

but i wonder if we would expect blacks to be offended if there was a portrayal of an ignorant black slave named 'nigger'....would we think that they're whiners if they are offended? because it's a stupid movie?

what about hollywood? should we hold it to any standards of decency? sure, the movie's lame, but what about the industry? by allowing such a movie to be produced, are they acquiescing to the use of such stereotypes? or encouraging? turning a blind eye? which is it?

can a minority ever be in a comedy without having to be the butt of each joke?

[tommyhtown]

Originally posted by Chasiubao_Boy@Jun 16 2003, 03:33 PM
i can't believe we're ranting about the political correctness of a movie called dumb and dumberer.

Agreed.

I never plan to see this movie anyway and I prolly won't rent it in the future. I am glad chunglove brought it up though.

[deez nuts]

Originally posted by kasia@Jun 16 2003, 06:41 PM
but i wonder if we would expect blacks to be offended if there was a portrayal of an ignorant black slave named 'nigger'....would we think that they're whiners if they are offended? because it's a stupid movie?


i don't know what the black reaction would be. and nor do i care.

i, personally, would find it mad funny.

[deez nuts]

Originally posted by tommyhtown@Jun 16 2003, 06:45 PM
Originally posted by Chasiubao_Boy@Jun 16 2003, 03:33 PM
i can't believe we're ranting about the political correctness of a movie called dumb and dumberer.

Agreed.

I never plan to see this movie anyway and I prolly won't rent it in the future. I am glad chunglove brought it up though.
exactly.

boycott it. i can respect that. since we all have differing opinions and thresholds of tolerance.

but crazy talk about calling the asian actress a traitor and murdering her? gimme a break.

[SunWuKong]

anyway, my original statement that brought up FOBs was in response to Jaley's comment that with a 4% Asian population in the US, there really won't be much backlash for an Asian actor to pick a stereotypical role. i was commenting on the fact that 4% isn't even an accurate estimate since much of the 4% is fobby.

[achtungbaby]

Originally posted by Chasiubao_Boy@Jun 16 2003, 04:33 PM
kung fool i stood by and was vocal about.
i didn't read the prior posts about murdering the actress or anything like that - so i'm not sure what some of you are responding to...

but with regards to just the movie itself, how does it differ from kung fool? weren't we against kung fool because of its portrayal of asian men and the fear that such portrayals would influence younger children and the not-so-bright public? shouldn't we have the same fear with regards to dumb and dumberer?

maybe i'm missing something. what's the difference, in your opinion?

**edit** - this post was not from ab

[deez nuts]

Originally posted by achtungbaby@Jun 16 2003, 07:44 PM
i didn't read the prior posts about murdering the actress or anything like that - so i'm not sure what some of you are responding to...

but with regards to just the movie itself, how does it differ from kung fool? weren't we against kung fool because of its portrayal of asian men and the fear that such portrayals would influence younger children and the not-so-bright public? shouldn't we have the same fear with regards to dumb and dumberer?

maybe i'm missing something. what's the difference, in your opinion?
the movie is called dumb and dumberer.

[achtungbaby]

the costume was called 'kung fool'.

*edit -- this post was not from ab*

[deez nuts]

Originally posted by achtungbaby@Jun 16 2003, 07:48 PM
the costume was called 'kung fool'.
are you playing devil's advocate or do you not really see the difference?

if not, i'm not gonna debate it.

i'm too tired to go through an explanation. i'm on call been doing consultations and procedures with another 20 hrs to go.

not worth my time and brain strain right now, sorry.

maybe someone else that sees the difference will explain it. if not, c'est la vie.

i'll ask you this: you found nothing wrong or wasn't really bothered with the fook yu and fook mi twins from austin powers. what makes this different for you, if you are offended by dumb and dumberer?

here's the link: http://forums.yellowworld.org/index.php?ac...l=austin+powers (http://forums.yellowworld.org/index.php?act=ST&f=36&t=102&st=0&hl=austin+powers)

[kasia]

Originally posted by Chasiubao_Boy@Jun 16 2003, 04:51 PM
are you playing devil's advocate or do you not really see the difference?

if not, i'm not gonna debate it.

i'm too tired to go through an explanation. i'm on call been doing consultations and procedures with another 20 hrs to go.

not worth my time and brain strain right now, sorry.

maybe someone else that sees the difference will explain it. if not, c'est la vie.

i'll ask you this: you found nothing wrong or wasn't really bothered with the fook yu and fook mi twins from austin powers. what makes this different for you, if you are offended by dumb and dumberer?

here's the link: http://forums.yellowworld.org/index.php?ac...l=austin+powers (http://forums.yellowworld.org/index.php?act=ST&f=36&t=102&st=0&hl=austin+powers)
i just want to hear somebody articulate the difference....to see if it can be done...to see how reasonable it sounds.

[YuheiCarreau]

Originally posted by SunWuKung@Jun 16 2003, 06:10 PM
well, i'd have to disagree with you on this.&nbsp; i don't think it'll cause anybody in this day and age to start screaming "ching chong" unless they already have it in them to be ignorant like that, or if they're already growing up in an environment that tells them it's ok to do so.&nbsp; i don't think a movie like this will change non-ching-chong-screaming people into ching-chong-screaming people, especially since movies with this kind of blatant racist stupidity no longer saturates hollywood.
I don't think this and other stereotypes teach people who aren't racist to become racist. I think they teach people who are already racist that their ideas and behavior are not just permissible, they're what everyone else believes, and therefore they must be right.


and a lot of non-Asian people can manage to stay away from consuming mainstream popular media. i don't see how Asian people in this country who only speak English cannot do the same, especially since most Asian films nowadays have English subtitles. how the hell have i been enjoying Korean cinema since i don't speak Korean?

But why should I watch only Korean movies, when I've spent my whole life speaking English, learning American idioms, watching American movies, and making friends with other Americans? Why should I have to avoid American media when logically it should be my first choice (or at least among the first)? You're saying that the correct response to racism is to ignore what's happening in a movie that hey, maybe some of my coworkers, classmates, and neighbors - people who have a direct influence on my environment - will go see and possibly parrot back to me, and I just don't think that's a good idea (admittedly, this would be a much better argument if it hadn't been instigated by Dumb and Dumberer, but it applies to a lot of other situations).


and nobody is forcing anyone to watch movies like Dumb and Dumberer. 99% of all other movies from hollywood in recent years have not been this blatantly racist. people can whine about movies like this all they want, i myself make sarcastic remarks now and then about them, but why do you want to give a fuck about a movie like Dumb and Dumberer. this is not some "critically acclaimed" movie.

It's a shitty movie, but it's also a movie that's getting a lot more advertising and a lot wider distribution than movies with more realistic depictions of Asians. People were saying that this kind of thing was outrageous back when 16 Candles came out, and it's still happening today. I'm not angry about this one single film; I'm angry that a blantant stereotype keeps showing up, and every time it does I hear the words "things aren't really like that now. People don't really think that" - well, evidently someone does, because even though it's just the same joke over and over, there's a new person writing 'em each time, and new butts in the seats to see them.


99.9% of all American music is not racist against Asians
i have honestly never read any book that would encourage ching-chong-screaming
most TV programs nowadays are not racist against Asians, and most of them are pure stupidity anyway.
most hollywood movies nowadays are also not racist, even though they have unrealistic portrayals of Asian people. and like i've mentioned before, if you don't like hollywood, there are Asian films in subtitles. or maybe you don't like Asian films. well, sorry, you're a minority. such is the lot of your life. boo-hoo.

but hey, go ahead and complain. you have a constitutional right to it, after all.

Now you're talking out of both sides of your face. How do you know what American media is like, when you're avoiding it?


i think it's called Hawaii.

Ha very ha.


And this:
Asian Americans have an identity based on being stigmatised and discriminated against for being Asian in America. it's sort of like people that cut themselves.

is just being pissy and mean. Call yourself whatever you want, but don't spite other people just 'cause you think you're better than they are.

[chunglove]

AMEN Brotha!!

[mr. x]

Originally posted by Chasiubao_Boy@Jun 16 2003, 03:33 PM
i can't believe we're ranting about the political correctness of a movie called dumb and dumberer.

hi, got too much time on your hands?

a&f i stood by and was vocal about.

kung fool i stood by and was vocal about.

this is just fucking stupid to the point of being embarrassing for me.

it's like the old fook yu and fook mi austin powers thread awhile ago.

we're bordering on black whining and moaning activism here.

someone call korean hunk so he can live out his asian al sharpton martyr fantasy.
yeah but like Tao said, a lot of kids might watch and get a kick out of it.

i mean looking back people would probly say the kung fool mask incident was bitching for the sake of bitching

"oh shut up u whiny asian people its haloween for krissakes"

[deez nuts]

Originally posted by kasia@Jun 16 2003, 08:00 PM
Originally posted by Chasiubao_Boy@Jun 16 2003, 04:51 PM
are you playing devil's advocate or do you not really see the difference?

if not, i'm not gonna debate it.

i'm too tired to go through an explanation. i'm on call been doing consultations and procedures with another 20 hrs to go.

not worth my time and brain strain right now, sorry.

maybe someone else that sees the difference will explain it. if not, c'est la vie.

i'll ask you this: you found nothing wrong or wasn't really bothered with the fook yu and fook mi twins from austin powers. what makes this different for you, if you are offended by dumb and dumberer?

here's the link: http://forums.yellowworld.org/index.php?ac...l=austin+powers (http://forums.yellowworld.org/index.php?act=ST&f=36&t=102&st=0&hl=austin+powers)
i just want to hear somebody articulate the difference....to see if it can be done...to see how reasonable it sounds.
who the hell am i even debating with. ab or you?

gimme a break.

i'll keep it brief:

it's a personal opinion.

i don't take movies especially movies like dumb and dumberer seriously. therefore, i don't hold it in the same light as the others.

reference previous thread (about six posts up) about personal opinions and personal thresholds for racism.

and if the post seemed harsh. i was merely trying to spit venom with all that mumbo jumbo talk about treason and first degree murder.

[Azn Retribution]

this movie is stupid anyway.

the original was stupid and kind of inane..
this sounds even worse.

[nonamerasian]

I didn't see the movie yet, but I read one of those analytical sites.

Wasn't the stereotypical Asian role a joke? Like somewhere within the movie Ching Chong is shown to have been pretending or something or another?

I'm not sure if it is true, but if it were, would that change your opinions?

[kasia]

Originally posted by mr. x@Jun 16 2003, 05:09 PM
yeah but like Tao said, a lot of kids might watch and get a kick out of it.

i mean looking back people would probly say the kung fool mask incident was bitching for the sake of bitching

"oh shut up u whiny asian people its haloween for krissakes"
right. i want to know if anyone can articulate the difference. and if not, why take the stance that there is clearly a difference?

[chunglove]

We shouldn't be getting all piqued about what the darn movie is called. We need to justify the matter at hand which is, should Whites and Blacks Always be allowed the right to stereotype Asians in movie roles in which WILL influence the media at large into thinking that ALL Asians can't speak English, know kung fu, have slanty eyes, etc. If you don't believe that over the years the issue with Shaq, Abercrombie and Fitch, and Chinky halloween masks and many others that I am not aware of has affected your life as an Asian individual. Then, I sincerely advise you to just not comment about this subject matter here.

[Tao]

i personally don't see the difference between kung fool and this. The main target is suburban white kids, who might not know any better to begin with. Couple this with Ching Chong, you get a brood of ignorant fools.

[deez nuts]

Originally posted by kasia@Jun 16 2003, 08:21 PM

right. i want to know if anyone can articulate the difference. and if not, why take the stance that there is clearly a difference?
are you implying we can't pick and choose our issues based on our personal perceptions and ideals?

that it's always gonna be either one way or the highway?

is it that hard to fathom that sometimes the smallest of variables and intangibles can influence whether one is "for" or "against" on a particular issue?

if so,

i guess, call me picky then.

[deez nuts]

Originally posted by chunglove@Jun 16 2003, 08:27 PM
Then, I sincerely advise you to just not comment about this subject matter here.
actually it's a public forum with very reasonable rules and guidelines.

so long as you abide by house rules, anybody is entitled to post their opinion. on the flip side, people are also entitled to question and disagree with your opinion.

if you can't handle differing opinions, then maybe you shouldn't be posting.

and who are you to judge who can or cannot post what and where? last time i checked it was achtungbaby and kasia's that started this site.

you already violated a rule by posting in all caps and in all bold. notice the:

This post has been edited by achtungbaby on Jun 16 2003, 05:10 PM

at the bottom of your very first post that started the thread?

don't hate the messenger. hate the message.

[kasia]

Originally posted by Chasiubao_Boy@Jun 16 2003, 05:29 PM
Originally posted by kasia@Jun 16 2003, 08:21 PM

right. i want to know if anyone can articulate the difference. and if not, why take the stance that there is clearly a difference?
are you implying we can't pick and choose our issues based on our personal perceptions and ideals?

that it's always gonna be either one way or the highway?

is it that hard to fathom that sometimes the smallest of variables and intangibles can influence whether one is "for" or "against" on a particular issue?

if so,

i guess, call me picky then.
of course you can choose. as can anybody else. but it's not wrong for me to ask you why you don't find it offensive or why you think it isn't like kung fool. and if there is no real reason - i.e., if you just feel like thinking the way you do just because - then that's fine, too.

[chunglove]

I haven't judged anybody nor did I purposely violate any rules set up in this site. You are entitled to say what you want to say. Therefore, I'll just repeat what I said before,"If you don't believe that over the years the issue with Shaq, Abercrombie and Fitch, and Chinky halloween masks and many others that I am not aware of has affected your life as an Asian individual. Then, I sincerely advise you to just not comment about this subject matter here."

[deez nuts]

Originally posted by chunglove@Jun 16 2003, 09:03 PM
I haven't judged anybody nor did I purposely violate any rules set up in this site. You are entitled to say what you want to say. Therefore, I'll just repeat what I said before,"If you don't believe that over the years the issue with Shaq, Abercrombie and Fitch, and Chinky halloween masks and many others that I am not aware of has affected your life as an Asian individual. Then, I sincerely advise you to just not comment about this subject matter here."
then i repeat myself again.

with a don't get your panties in a bunch.

[deez nuts]

Originally posted by kasia@Jun 16 2003, 08:48 PM
Originally posted by Chasiubao_Boy@Jun 16 2003, 05:29 PM
Originally posted by kasia@Jun 16 2003, 08:21 PM

right. i want to know if anyone can articulate the difference. and if not, why take the stance that there is clearly a difference?
are you implying we can't pick and choose our issues based on our personal perceptions and ideals?

that it's always gonna be either one way or the highway?

is it that hard to fathom that sometimes the smallest of variables and intangibles can influence whether one is "for" or "against" on a particular issue?

if so,

i guess, call me picky then.
of course you can choose. as can anybody else. but it's not wrong for me to ask you why you don't find it offensive or why you think it isn't like kung fool. and if there is no real reason - i.e., if you just feel like thinking the way you do just because - then that's fine, too.
just making sure

tis'all

[kasia]

Originally posted by chunglove@Jun 16 2003, 06:03 PM
I haven't judged anybody nor did I purposely violate any rules set up in this site.
it's a strict liability rule. there is no mens rea element in our forum guidelines. thus, you are wrong regardless of whether you acted purposely or not.

j/k. back to studying.

also...if this film does offend you, have you thought about organizing a boycott against the sponsors? maybe that's something that can be organized or discussed here? (this is our webmaster's idea, btw.)

can anyone find out who the sponsors are?

[achtungbaby]

Originally posted by chunglove@Jun 16 2003, 07:03 PM
Then, I sincerely advise you to just not comment about this subject matter here.
YW is what it is because of its openness and tolerance to differing opinions. Our ideals certainly won't be solidified by having everyone in the forum spout the same thing back to one another.

[YuheiCarreau]

Originally posted by nonamerasian@Jun 16 2003, 09:19 PM
I didn't see the movie yet, but I read one of those analytical sites.

Wasn't the stereotypical Asian role a joke? Like somewhere within the movie Ching Chong is shown to have been pretending or something or another?

I'm not sure if it is true, but if it were, would that change your opinions?
It wouldn't change my opinion, because making a joke about the status quo does very little to actually change it. I've seen two or three parodies of popular movies that make jokes about how "the Black guy" is often only there to spout clichéd slang and provide comedic relief (or die early, if it's a horror movie). But I can't see how those jokes have done anything to change the roles that Blacks typically play in a lot of romantic comedies, action movies, or horror flicks.

Besides, it has to be a good joke for me to even consider it as social commentary.

[applehead]

Originally posted by chunglove@Jun 16 2003, 05:27 PM
We shouldn't be getting all piqued about what the darn movie is called. We need to justify the matter at hand which is, should Whites and Blacks Always be allowed the right to stereotype Asians in movie roles in which WILL influence the media at large into thinking that ALL Asians can't speak English, know kung fu, have slanty eyes, etc. If you don't believe that over the years the issue with Shaq, Abercrombie and Fitch, and Chinky halloween masks and many others that I am not aware of has affected your life as an Asian individual. Then, I sincerely advise you to just not comment about this subject matter here.
would you be offended still if it weren't whites
and blacks but fellow asians.
what if the writers/producers and the director
were asian?

and i think most poster are not getting "piqued" about
what the movie is called. it's just that the title is
representative of the content of the movie itself.

[Emperor_Mike]

We are looking too deeply into something that's obviously meant to inspire humour, albeit in a way that's touchy (and dubious) to say the least. While I am all for changing the attitudes of the general population toward Asians, I find it difficult to find commonality with an issue that's not so much a social commentary than it is a crudely written and politically incorrect jab at the Asian Community. It's a film that's meant to be idiotic; it's not a documentary intended to promote negative issues on race relations. The name of the character is unfortunate, but it's hardly worth getting into an uproar over.

We are crying wolf and this sort of thing has to stop before our credibility is jeopardised by the incessant splitting of hairs over matters like this (and the Verizon debate a month and a half back.) Activism is a good thing but misguided activism not only serves to make those involved look foolish, it can also have a ruinous effect on what we're campaining for. The aim is to destroy racial barriers in society so that our Community can gain greater influence over social and political affairs. The last time I checked, crying over spilt milk is not on top of the "To-Do List." Ask yourself how condemning "Dumb & Dumberer" will serve to aid our Cause. Even if we're successful in our endeavour and the film company offers a statement of apology what benefits do we gain from it? Acknowledgement that what they did was wrong and misguided? Bear in mind that much of society already knows that these types of jokes and commentaries are frowned upon. So what do we have now? A reaffirmation of the status quo that stereotypes are a "bad thing?" How does a rehash like that advance our agenda?

Rather than get all riled up over something like this, we should be focussing on positive things like building a solid foundation for future plans. Awareness should be an ongoing thing, but it should not be the primary cause of our efforts. If we continue harbouring the mentality that everyone's out to smear our good name we will NEVER get anywhere. We can protest all we want and in the end it'll amount to nothing because by that point we'll be so overexposed that people who use to care will no longer look upon us as a force that confronts important issues. If the new face of Asian Activism places greater importance on public perception to the mutual exclusion of tangible influence and power, I will have no part of it. I honestly don't want to be viewed as being part of a cause that's will ultimately amount to little more than fire and fury. After all, what's the point of wiping out stereotypes and the like if we're just as weak politically later on as we are now?

[Green_Circle]

Originally posted by Tao@Jun 16 2003, 11:14 PM
obviously adults, well intelligent ones, who do go see the movie will realize that calling the girl ching chong might just be looked down upon and be considered racist. However, what I'm really afraid of here is that the large number of children who will see this movie and think it's fun to say that to the asian kid at their school and taunt them, cause they saw their idol do it, and apparently got a good laugh out of it. This movie, no matter how silly and easily dismissed by adults, is very influential amongst young children. That's why I want to protest this movie, cause it's teaching a new generation to think it's cool to hate.
Good point Tao. I've been reading all of the very good replies and opinions but your's really struck a raw nerve. Sure we as adults could probably shrug it off on the one hand and on the other we ask, why should we? However our defenseless little ones aren't as steeley equipped as we have become. So now it pisses me off all over again.

[Faithless]

Can't find any e-mail addresses to send a rant to at newline.com other than the webmaster@newline.com:


To whom it may concern,

I wonder if you can have someone explain this to me: what was the bright thought that went into naming the Asian female character in your movie Ching Chong?

Were you all being deliberately racist for the laughs or for your hatred of Asians in general?&nbsp; Last time I checked, Ching Chong is what racist people call Asians when they want to taunt them or make fun of them.&nbsp; Ching Chong is what racist people yell-out to Asians when they want them to make fun of Asians.&nbsp; And Ching Chong is what racist people name their Asian characters when they want other racists to share in their laughter.

You all are sad.

[Emperor_Mike]

Well, if you must I suppose a petition can be created at "petitiononline.com."

[blue hoodie]

Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Jun 16 2003, 08:15 PM
Originally posted by nonamerasian@Jun 16 2003, 09:19 PM
I didn't see the movie yet, but I read one of those analytical sites.

Wasn't the stereotypical Asian role a joke? Like somewhere within the movie Ching Chong is shown to have been pretending or something or another?

I'm not sure if it is true, but if it were, would that change your opinions?
It wouldn't change my opinion, because making a joke about the status quo does very little to actually change it. I've seen two or three parodies of popular movies that make jokes about how "the Black guy" is often only there to spout clichéd slang and provide comedic relief (or die early, if it's a horror movie). But I can't see how those jokes have done anything to change the roles that Blacks typically play in a lot of romantic comedies, action movies, or horror flicks.

Besides, it has to be a good joke for me to even consider it as social commentary.
She used that fake accent in order to get the white punk guy cuz he's into that. Thats what I've been told.

[kasia]

Originally posted by Emperor_Mike@Jun 16 2003, 09:36 PM
We are looking too deeply into something that's obviously meant to inspire humour, albeit in a way that's touchy (and dubious) to say the least. While I am all for changing the attitudes of the general population toward Asians, I find it difficult to find commonality with an issue that's not so much a social commentary than it is a crudely written and politically incorrect jab at the Asian Community. It's a film that's meant to be idiotic; it's not a documentary intended to promote negative issues on race relations. The name of the character is unfortunate, but it's hardly worth getting into an uproar over.

We are crying wolf and this sort of thing has to stop before our credibility is jeopardised by the incessant splitting of hairs over matters like this (and the Verizon debate a month and a half back.) Activism is a good thing but misguided activism not only serves to make those involved look foolish, it can also have a ruinous effect on what we're campaining for. The aim is to destroy racial barriers in society so that our Community can gain greater influence over social and political affairs. The last time I checked, crying over spilt milk is not on top of the "To-Do List." Ask yourself how condemning "Dumb & Dumberer" will serve to aid our Cause. Even if we're successful in our endeavour and the film company offers a statement of apology what benefits do we gain from it? Acknowledgement that what they did was wrong and misguided? Bear in mind that much of society already knows that these types of jokes and commentaries are frowned upon. So what do we have now? A reaffirmation of the status quo that stereotypes are a "bad thing?" How does a rehash like that advance our agenda?

Rather than get all riled up over something like this, we should be focussing on positive things like building a solid foundation for future plans. Awareness should be an ongoing thing, but it should not be the primary cause of our efforts. If we continue harbouring the mentality that everyone's out to smear our good name we will NEVER get anywhere. We can protest all we want and in the end it'll amount to nothing because by that point we'll be so overexposed that people who use to care will no longer look upon us as a force that confronts important issues. If the new face of Asian Activism places greater importance on public perception to the mutual exclusion of tangible influence and power, I will have no part of it. I honestly don't want to be viewed as being part of a cause that's will ultimately amount to little more than fire and fury. After all, what's the point of wiping out stereotypes and the like if we're just as weak politically later on as we are now?
it's humor at the expense of one group's identity. and it seems, during these times, that asians are the targets of such racist jokes more often than other groups. a possible reason is that asians are passive and will quietly sit by while their identity and ancestry are attacked. other groups have demonstrated in the past that they will not be as tolerant.

it's one thing for an individual to make racist comments or poke fun at asians. it's quite different when hollywood does it. any guys on this board feel the effects of long duk dong? why would this be any different? the image of long duk dong as the typical asian male has lasted in the minds of many White Americans for decades...and continues to survive.

the benefit sought to be obtained is not pecuniary, but rather symbolic. this was the same result that we sought after during Project Anti-Disguise (a.k.a. Kung Fool). it puts the rest of society on notice of what the Asian community will and will not tolerate.

i guess, then, at this point, we are still hashing out where we, as a community, stand on this issue.

btw, while i know others on this board may not feel the same, i believe that group solidarity is very important. and every asian stands to benefit from the work of the asian community - even if they don't think so or would like to deny it. when the kung fool costumes were taken off the shelves, it most likely served to prevent many children from forming racist beliefs about asian americans. thus, even those asians who claimed that they were not offended by the costume benefited indirectly from our work.

re: meena's question about whether we might be as offended if the cast was all-asian as opposed to white or black, i would say - it depends. it depends on whether the target audience is the white community, in which case i would be more offended, or whether the target community is the asian community, in which case i would think that it is not that big of a deal (e.g., tie my shoe.)

[kasia]

three questions:

1) how supportive (i.e., how much work/time are you all willing to volunteer) if YW sets up a petition to boycott the sponsors of the movie? (boycotting the movie itself won't do very much).

2) if so, what would the actual goal be?

3) who are the sponsors?

[AliBabaIncorporated]

Originally posted by Jun 17 2003@ 02:20 AM
it's humor at the expense of one group's identity. and it seems, during these times, that the asians are the targets of such racist jokes more often than other groups. a possible reason is that asians are passive and will quietly sit by while their identity and ancestry is attacked. other groups have demonstrated in the past that they will not be as tolerant.
Or maybe other groups have simply demonstrated that most of their members aren't going to sweat the ridiculously small shit, e.g. a movie about a black guy who commits drug crimes (training day), or a movie which consists entirely of a black cop making a happy-go-lucky joke when his white partner is down (every cop buddy film ever made), or whatever. When was the last time you heard a black person whine about Rush Hour? Whereas AAs will cry "racism" every time anytime they run across something they don't like, such as an Asian guy driving a taxi, or an Asian girl with a white guy, or a guy doing martial arts, or whatnot. If you were a schoolyard bully, which kind of victim would you find more fun?
Originally posted by Jun 17 2003@ 02:20 AM
any guys on this board feel the effects of long duk dong? why would this be any different? the image of long duk dong as the typical asian male has lasted in the minds of many White Americans for decades...and continues to survive.
It has, has it ... any real-life examples of how a real live white guy expected his Chinese friend to bust out like Long Duk Dong? Or just vague generalizations about the media and dating problems?

[Emperor_Mike]

Originally posted by kasia@Jun 16 2003, 11:20 PM
Originally posted by Emperor_Mike@Jun 16 2003, 09:36 PM
We are looking too deeply into something that's obviously meant to inspire humour, albeit in a way that's touchy (and dubious) to say the least. While I am all for changing the attitudes of the general population toward Asians, I find it difficult to find commonality with an issue that's not so much a social commentary than it is a crudely written and politically incorrect jab at the Asian Community. It's a film that's meant to be idiotic; it's not a documentary intended to promote negative issues on race relations. The name of the character is unfortunate, but it's hardly worth getting into an uproar over.

We are crying wolf and this sort of thing has to stop before our credibility is jeopardised by the incessant splitting of hairs over matters like this (and the Verizon debate a month and a half back.) Activism is a good thing but misguided activism not only serves to make those involved look foolish, it can also have a ruinous effect on what we're campaining for. The aim is to destroy racial barriers in society so that our Community can gain greater influence over social and political affairs. The last time I checked, crying over spilt milk is not on top of the "To-Do List." Ask yourself how condemning "Dumb & Dumberer" will serve to aid our Cause. Even if we're successful in our endeavour and the film company offers a statement of apology what benefits do we gain from it? Acknowledgement that what they did was wrong and misguided? Bear in mind that much of society already knows that these types of jokes and commentaries are frowned upon. So what do we have now? A reaffirmation of the status quo that stereotypes are a "bad thing?" How does a rehash like that advance our agenda?

Rather than get all riled up over something like this, we should be focussing on positive things like building a solid foundation for future plans. Awareness should be an ongoing thing, but it should not be the primary cause of our efforts. If we continue harbouring the mentality that everyone's out to smear our good name we will NEVER get anywhere. We can protest all we want and in the end it'll amount to nothing because by that point we'll be so overexposed that people who use to care will no longer look upon us as a force that confronts important issues. If the new face of Asian Activism places greater importance on public perception to the mutual exclusion of tangible influence and power, I will have no part of it. I honestly don't want to be viewed as being part of a cause that's will ultimately amount to little more than fire and fury. After all, what's the point of wiping out stereotypes and the like if we're just as weak politically later on as we are now?
it's humor at the expense of one group's identity. and it seems, during these times, that the asians are the targets of such racist jokes more often than other groups. a possible reason is that asians are passive and will quietly sit by while their identity and ancestry is attacked. other groups have demonstrated in the past that they will not be as tolerant.

it's one thing for an individual to make racist comments or poke fun at asians. it's quite different when hollywood does it. any guys on this board feel the effects of long duk dong? why would this be any different? the image of long duk dong as the typical asian male has lasted in the minds of many White Americans for decades...and continues to survive.

the benefit sought to be obtained is not pecuniary, but rather symbolic. this was the same result that we sought after during Project Anti-Disguise (a.k.a. Kung Fool). it puts the rest of society on notice of what the Asian community will and will not tolerate.

i guess, then, at this point, we are still hashing out where we, as a community, stand on this issue.

btw, while i know others on this board may not feel the same, i believe that group solidarity is very important. and every asian stands to benefit from the work of the asian community - even if they don't think so or would like to deny it. when the kung fool costumes were taken off the shelves, it most likely served to prevent many children from forming racist beliefs about asian americans. thus, even those asians who claimed that they were not offended by the costume benefited indirectly from our work.
There is nothing wrong with promoting good values and "correcting" wayward perceptions, but to find faults at every turn and using those issues to express outrage on the account that we can is not the way approach these matters, in my opinion. I agree with the actions taken/currently being pursued with regard to the "Kung Fool" costume and the A&F apparel, but what I refuse to condone is arbitrary activism where even the slightest mis-step can result in allegations of racial insensitivity and political incorrectness. After all, we're dealing with a film with foolish/idiotic undertones that should immediately be evident by watching the trailer. Added to the equation is the fact that this is one argument that will not yield any tangible results. We'll win in principle, yes, but it won't mean a thing since NewLine is certainly not going to withdraw the movie. In effect we'll be making a lot of noise for nothing that hasn't already been confronted that can be used to further our agenda. Will people care? The company will, but a good portion of the public won't because rampant activism for what others perceive to be insignificant causes is more or less the norm nowadays. Too much of a good thing (or bad thing depending on your point of view) will cause indifference, which is the last thing we want to heap on John Q. Public.

All I'm