Tiger Woods... [Archive] - Yellowworld Forums

SunWuKong

09-25-2002, 07:52 PM

Originally posted by blkazngirl@Sep 25 2002, 10:49 PM
He may consider himself asian, his parents, family, friends and the world may also. But the law that was pasted down from slavery says he's black. Just a drop will do it. I know dumb law.

Lets take it one farther. If he wasn't "famous", he would be viewed as just another black man.
does he really consider himself asian? so does he consider his definition of "cablinasian" as "asian, as well as etc etc", or "not asian, but a mixture of asian, etc etc"?

kimpossible

09-25-2002, 07:56 PM

Even if he wasn't famous I think he may still be considered mixed Asian by ppl not his family. He at least acknowledges his Asian roots/blood/whatever. I think that makes a big difference.

I just consider him godawful rich.

SunWuKong

09-25-2002, 07:58 PM

Originally posted by Hello_Hapa@Sep 25 2002, 10:56 PM
Even if he wasn't famous I think he may still be considered mixed Asian by ppl not his family. He at least acknowledges his Asian roots/blood/whatever. I think that makes a big difference.

I just consider him godawful rich.
yeah... he got annoyed that people kept going to the lots next to his mansion to try to watch him, that he bought those lots just so people won't go there. he's not doing a damn thing with those lots but let them sit there.

ChinaLama

09-25-2002, 09:04 PM

like i've said elsewhere, everyone is Asian, so doesn't really matter what Tiger Woods himself thinks. ;)

Craig

09-27-2002, 04:14 PM

I don't consider him Asian.

* he doesn't look Asian
* he doesn't act Asian in any way
* he does have an Asian name, or anything to indicate to the outside world that he's Asian (although Tiger as a nickname might be considered, it's not a definitive indicator)
* he doesn't see himself or promote himself as Asian
* his future kids likely will be even less Asian

Why are so many Asians rushing to embrace people like Tiger Woods and Keanu Reeves, while many of them will so quickly ostracize an Asian-looking and Asian-acting Eurasian when they find out about his ancestry ?

SunWuKong

09-27-2002, 07:17 PM

Originally posted by Craig@Sep 27 2002, 07:14 PM
* he doesn't act Asian in any way
i agree with most of your points, but... how does one "act asian"? and how do you know he does not carry on any thai traditions at home?

Reinhard H.

09-27-2002, 10:25 PM

I don't understand why some dumb athletes get so much attention, maybe I'm just jealous, but I never understood what's so great about being able to hit a ball with a stick; as if there were no better things to spend money on.

amietron

09-28-2002, 12:09 AM

Originally posted by Reinhard H.@Sep 27 2002, 10:25 PM
I don't understand why some dumb athletes get so much attention, maybe I'm just jealous, but I never understood what's so great about being able to hit a ball with a stick; as if there were no better things to spend money on.
don't gimme that. it does take some level of skill. must admit at least that. it's not easy to hit a sonuvabitch golf ball into a small hole hundreds of meters away, not to mention all of the different little traps and such along the way, in just a few strokes.

aww. come on, reinhard. keanu reeves is hot. i'd boink him.

yeah. i don't like it either. why is it that being good at throwing a goddamn leather sack really far is gonna get you not only a ticket into the school, but also a free ride? pisses me off. think of all of those thousands of dollars they don't have to pay that you do. <_<

(sorry, MK. i'm going off on a tangent, i know.)

tiger is whatever he says he is.

Reinhard H.

09-28-2002, 12:33 AM

Originally posted by amietron@Sep 28 2002, 08:09 AM
Originally posted by Reinhard H.@Sep 27 2002, 10:25 PM
I don't understand why some dumb athletes get so much attention, maybe I'm just jealous, but I never understood what's so great about being able to hit a ball with a stick; as if there were no better things to spend money on.
don't gimme that. it does take some level of skill. must admit at least that. it's not easy to hit a sonuvabitch golf ball into a small hole hundreds of meters away, not to mention all of the different little traps and such along the way, in just a few strokes.

aww. come on, reinhard. keanu reeves is hot. i'd boink him.

yeah. i don't like it either. why is it that being good at throwing a goddamn leather sack really far is gonna get you not only a ticket into the school, but also a free ride? pisses me off. think of all of those thousands of dollars they don't have to pay that you do. <_<

(sorry, MK. i'm going off on a tangent, i know.)

tiger is whatever he says he is.
Yeah, and probably some research scientist who invents an AIDS vaccine will only get a pat on the back for his efforts.

SunWuKong

09-28-2002, 12:37 AM

Originally posted by Reinhard H.@Sep 28 2002, 01:25 AM
I don't understand why some dumb athletes get so much attention, maybe I'm just jealous, but I never understood what's so great about being able to hit a ball with a stick; as if there were no better things to spend money on.
they get so much attention because the way the sports industry makes money is by marketting itself to the public. AIDS drugs have no such necessity.

Reinhard H.

09-28-2002, 12:46 AM

I read somewhere that Tiger Woods was paid 2 million USD for appearing in some weekend tournament in Shenzhen, China, rather interesting considering that a Chinese university professor working in the same city probably earns about 500 USD a month and many college students in China are struggling to pay 1000 USD in tuition fees a year. Now whose "work" is of greater value to Chinese society?

kimpossible

09-28-2002, 09:13 AM

Originally posted by KuroBishounen@Sep 28 2002, 01:51 AM
I read somewhere that Tiger Woods was paid 2 million USD for appearing in some weekend tournament in Shenzhen, China, rather interesting considering that a Chinese university professor working in the same city probably earns about 500 USD a month and many college students in China are struggling to pay 1000 USD in tuition fees a year. Now whose "work" is of greater value to Chinese society?

Both...

Tiger is giving the young Chinese someone "unique"(someone is part-Asian/part-Black)breaking some stereotypes, and giving a presence in Asia....and the Chinese university professor is preparing his students for "life," and acting as a temporary role-model.....
My guess is that he would be viewed primarily as an American in China. I'm not convinced he'd be viewed as an Asian.

But I agree he has a global appeal and he's accessible to many races - makes him all the more marketable for Nike.

edit: To his credit, I think this is the type of thing that Tiger Woods is trying to avoid. He's not claiming to be of only one ethnicity and he's tired of his identity being dissected by the public. The guy even had to release a press release about it.

SunWuKong

09-28-2002, 09:31 AM

Originally posted by Hello_Hapa@Sep 28 2002, 12:13 PM
Originally posted by KuroBishounen@Sep 28 2002, 01:51 AM
I read somewhere that Tiger Woods was paid 2 million USD for appearing in some weekend tournament in Shenzhen, China, rather interesting considering that a Chinese university professor working in the same city probably earns about 500 USD a month and many college students in China are struggling to pay 1000 USD in tuition fees a year. Now whose "work" is of greater value to Chinese society?

Both...

Tiger is giving the young Chinese someone "unique"(someone is part-Asian/part-Black)breaking some stereotypes, and giving a presence in Asia....and the Chinese university professor is preparing his students for "life," and acting as a temporary role-model.....
My guess is that he would be viewed primarily as an American in China. I'm not convinced he'd be viewed as an Asian.

But I agree he has a global appeal and he's accessible to many races - makes him all the more marketable for Nike.

edit: To his credit, I think this is the type of thing that Tiger Woods is trying to avoid. He's not claiming to be of only one ethnicity and he's tired of his identity being dissected by the public. The guy even had to release a press release about it.
it's kind of moot wondering how he's perceived in china, because the concept of "asian" doesn't really exist in asia. you're chinese, or japanese, or korean, or vietnamese, etc etc. there is not really a feeling of pan-asian racial or ethnic unity in the minds of the people in asia. that being said, yes, in china tiger is viewed more as an american than anything else.

the better question would be to ask how he's perceived in thailand.

kimpossible

09-28-2002, 10:01 AM

Originally posted by SunWuKung@Sep 28 2002, 09:31 AM
Both...

Tiger is giving the young Chinese someone "unique"(someone is part-Asian/part-Black)breaking some stereotypes, and giving a presence in Asia....and the Chinese university professor is preparing his students for "life," and acting as a temporary role-model.....
My guess is that he would be viewed primarily as an American in China. I'm not convinced he'd be viewed as an Asian.

But I agree he has a global appeal and he's accessible to many races - makes him all the more marketable for Nike.

edit: To his credit, I think this is the type of thing that Tiger Woods is trying to avoid. He's not claiming to be of only one ethnicity and he's tired of his identity being dissected by the public. The guy even had to release a press release about it.[/QUOTE]
it's kind of moot wondering how he's perceived in china, because the concept of "asian" doesn't really exist in asia. you're chinese, or japanese, or korean, or vietnamese, etc etc. there is not really a feeling of pan-asian racial or ethnic unity in the minds of the people in asia. that being said, yes, in china tiger is viewed more as an american than anything else.

the better question would be to ask how he's perceived in thailand.[/quote]
*nods* I know what you're saying, but having talked with KB before - I'm structuring my response and word usage so that he understands. He's kind of new to some of the concepts. And I know your explanation was necessary, I'm just verbalizing it so we don't have to go a few rounds of restating what we each meant.

On another note... I read that Tiger isn't just Thai, but a bit Chinese as well. Weird, cuz I thought he was just Thai. Didn't the Thai government give him some sort of award? I think that has to do solely with his celebrity status.

kasia

09-28-2002, 12:17 PM

tiger = half thai, half 'ger.

racist joke. hasn't anyone else heard it before?

amietron

09-28-2002, 12:36 PM

haha, kasia. :lol:

;x

in thailand, they have phuket island, famous for performing lots of cheap sex changes. heaven for the transexuals of the world.

Hito

09-28-2002, 12:40 PM

Originally posted by kasia@Sep 28 2002, 01:17 PM
tiger = half thai, half 'ger.

racist joke.  hasn't anyone else heard it before?
:blink:
Oh i just got it!

I even laughed... <img src='http://www.darkervisions.com/bp/laugh.gif[/img]

i'm am so ashamedhttp://www.darkervisions.com/bp/uhdrop.gif

digiaks

10-31-2002, 04:30 PM

I consider Tiger part Asian (hapa). He might not act Asian, but he does not act black either. All his friends in High school were white. Strictly based on personality I would say he is plain old American and that is how he wants to be viewed.

Tiger does not want to be forced into any category and people should respect that. It is true that because of his skin color he will experience hatred not felt by non blacks.

I know many half Asians/whites that do not look Asian to me either yet we call them mixed Asians. Tiger is no different.

angel nympho

10-31-2002, 04:43 PM

Originally posted by digiaks@Nov 1 2002, 12:30 AM
I consider Tiger part Asian (hapa). He might not act Asian, but he does not act black either. All his friends in High school were white. Strictly based on personality I would say he is plain old American and that is how he wants to be viewed.

Tiger does not want to be forced into any category and people should respect that. It is true that because of his skin color he will experience hatred not felt by non blacks.

I know many half Asians/whites that do not look Asian to me either yet we call them mixed Asians. Tiger is no different.
How, exactly, does one act "Asian" or "Black"? I'm curious.

digiaks

11-01-2002, 03:00 AM

How, exactly, does one act "Asian" or "Black"? I'm curious.

Your culture determines how you act. So when I say someone acts a certain way then I am saying that the persons culture is this way or that way. Whatever way I am talking about.

Black culture does exist. Same with Asian culture. Technically even at work you have a culture. I am sorry if it is confusing, next time I will not just say 'act' and instead say that Tiger Woods does not live up to the cultural stereotype of black people.

If you want to really know what black culture is then I recommend you pick up a book by Earl Ofari Huchinsen. Great author. He can explain it 100X better then me. If you want Asian culture, I don't know any good authors off hand. Though schools offer great classes on it (which I have taken a few of)

angel nympho

11-01-2002, 01:09 PM

Originally posted by digiaks@Nov 1 2002, 11:00 AM
How, exactly, does one act "Asian" or "Black"? I'm curious.

Your culture determines how you act. So when I say someone acts a certain way then I am saying that the persons culture is this way or that way. Whatever way I am talking about.

Black culture does exist. Same with Asian culture. Technically even at work you have a culture. I am sorry if it is confusing, next time I will not just say 'act' and instead say that Tiger Woods does not live up to the cultural stereotype of black people.

If you want to really know what black culture is then I recommend you pick up a book by Earl Ofari Huchinsen. Great author. He can explain it 100X better then me. If you want Asian culture, I don't know any good authors off hand. Though schools offer great classes on it (which I have taken a few of)
My culture has nothing to do with the way I act. Am I not acting "Asian"?

I mean, we all talk about breaking stereotypes here... does "living up to the cultural stereotype" of certain ethnicities have anything to do with what ethnicity you actually are considered?

Sorry, I hope I'm not coming off as rude, but the way your previous post was worded, it sounded like you were saying that you accept Tiger Woods as part Asian despite the fact that he doesn't act like one, and the fact that he doesnt act black either makes up for it, somehow.

igcognito

11-01-2002, 02:40 PM

angel nympho

11-01-2002, 02:43 PM

Originally posted by igcognito@Nov 1 2002, 10:40 PM
Originally posted by digiaks@Nov 1 2002, 11:00 AM
How, exactly, does one act "Asian" or "Black"? I'm curious.

Your culture determines how you act. So when I say someone acts a certain way then I am saying that the persons culture is this way or that way. Whatever way I am talking about.

Black culture does exist. Same with Asian culture. Technically even at work you have a culture. I am sorry if it is confusing, next time I will not just say 'act' and instead say that Tiger Woods does not live up to the cultural stereotype of black people.

If you want to really know what black culture is then I recommend you pick up a book by Earl Ofari Huchinsen. Great author. He can explain it 100X better then me. If you want Asian culture, I don't know any good authors off hand. Though schools offer great classes on it (which I have taken a few of)
Tell me what acting black is?
Besides, how do you really know if he *acts* accoding to whatever culture he chooses to identify with? The most anybody's seen of him, unless you know him personally, is playing golf.

Craig

11-01-2002, 04:30 PM

Originally posted by angel nympho@Nov 1 2002, 05:43 PM
Besides, how do you really know if he *acts* accoding to whatever culture he chooses to identify with? The most anybody's seen of him, unless you know him personally, is playing golf.
If you look up a few posts, you'll see that Dijiaks mentioned that he went to high school with Tiger Woods.

angel nympho

11-01-2002, 04:33 PM

Originally posted by Craig@Nov 2 2002, 12:30 AM
Originally posted by angel nympho@Nov 1 2002, 05:43 PM
Besides, how do you really know if he *acts* accoding to whatever culture he chooses to identify with?  The most anybody's seen of him, unless you know him personally, is playing golf.
If you look up a few posts, you'll see that Dijiaks mentioned that he went to high school with Tiger Woods.
Unless Dijiaks was a friend or acquaintance of Tiger Woods, he doesn't know him any more than I do.

Now, in the case that he DOES know him. My bad. But my original statements stand.

hormiga

11-02-2002, 04:08 PM

Who cares?

digiaks

11-04-2002, 01:22 AM

Unless Dijiaks was a friend or acquaintance of Tiger Woods, he doesn't know him any more than I do.

Now, in the case that he DOES know him. My bad. But my original statements stand.

Yes, I knew him well enough to know that he was culturally what we would classify as a regular american white person. Though we were by no means best friends and I never thought he would be where he is today (I had a low opinion of golf in my high school days).

My culture has nothing to do with the way I act. Am I not acting "Asian"?

Culture has everything to do with the way you act. Maybe we have different definitions for culture. I am using the one found in the dictionary (below).

cul·ture Pronunciation Key (klchr) n.
1. The totality of socially transmitted behavior patterns, arts, beliefs, institutions, and all other products of human work and thought.
2. The predominating attitudes and behavior that characterize the functioning of a group or organization.

I will not claim to know what Tiger feels or not. Everything I say is strictly my opinion and could be wrong. So, peace!

Hiroshi2

11-04-2002, 02:50 PM

Originally posted by amietron@Sep 27 2002, 11:09 PM

tiger is whatever he says he is.
After giving this some deep thought, I'd have to say that this is the best way to classify Tiger. And everyone else for that matter. Let people define themselves.

angel nympho

11-04-2002, 05:43 PM

Originally posted by Hiroshi2@Nov 4 2002, 10:50 PM
Originally posted by amietron@Sep 27 2002, 11:09 PM

tiger is whatever he says he is.
After giving this some deep thought, I'd have to say that this is the best way to classify Tiger. And everyone else for that matter. Let people define themselves.
Werd. That was deep.

AliBabaIncorporated

11-04-2002, 10:06 PM

Originally posted by Hiroshi2@Nov 5 2002, 06:50 AM
Originally posted by amietron@Sep 27 2002, 11:09 PM

tiger is whatever he says he is.
After giving this some deep thought, I'd have to say that this is the best way to classify Tiger. And everyone else for that matter. Let people define themselves.
letting people define themselves leads to lots of ridiculous definitions. Suppose I'd like to define myself as an international rugby star, a lesbian, or an Afghan rebel?

Defining yourself as a member of a group requires that group accept you, or at least that you recognizably share behavioral and cultural traits with that group so that you could function as one of its members. Which is why, if I said I was an international rugby star, a lesbian, or an Afghan rebel, people would laugh at me. In each of those cases, I'm missing something rather important which would allow me to make good on my claim of being a member of one of those groups - incredible rugby skills, female genitalia, desire to commit terrorist activity against Americans. Digiaks said, Tiger is pretty much a mainstream-cultured American. I believe it. I see this phenomenon in mixed-race kids all the time - they can only function in mainstream culture, but wanna claim they're this and that and something else to make themselves more exotic and more interesting than the other poor unmixed mainstream Joes.

Hiroshi2

11-05-2002, 04:29 AM

Well, you can't call him black, cause he doesn't have a black mother and isn't completely or even mostly black speaking in terms of genetics. You can't call him Asian because many will see him as black because of his skin color. So since "we" (meaning everyone else in the world besides Tiger) can't seem to agree upon a definition of what he is, then I say let Tiger do it himself. He knows himself better than any of us ever could.

Like Tiger, I am a black/asian mix. In many cases, I didn't feel quite "black" enough, because I knew the culture in which I grew up in my household was not the same as the other black kids. The other black kids didn't have their mother speaking Japanese to a cousin on the phone, or get served home-made tofu. And I knew I wasn't quite "Japanese" or "Asian" enough, cause I was too dark-skinned, and my hair's too nappy :P

But seriously, yes, I still stand by what I said. Let him (us) define himself (ourselves).

AliBabaIncorporated

11-05-2002, 05:01 AM

Originally posted by Hiroshi2@Nov 5 2002, 08:29 PM
Well, you can't call him black, cause he doesn't have a black mother and isn't completely or even mostly black speaking in terms of genetics. You can't call him Asian because many will see him as black because of his skin color.
why to base it on something as shallow as genetics or appearance?

Originally posted by Hiroshi2@Nov 5 2002, 08:29 PM
So since "we" (meaning everyone else in the world besides Tiger) can't seem to agree upon a definition of what he is, then I say let Tiger do it himself. He knows himself better than any of us ever could.

maybe. or maybe like lots of other people, he's deluded about what it really means to claim an identity.

seryb

11-05-2002, 06:49 AM

I don't understand how there is confusion over whether he's Thai or not. Culturally, he may or may not be Thai/African-American, but ethnically, he is.

All I know is that he's phenomenal at the world's most boring sport. More power to my Southeast Asian brother.

seryb

11-05-2002, 06:57 AM

Would it help if he were a championship Muay Thai prizefighter instead of a golfer? :huh:

angel nympho

11-05-2002, 09:10 AM

Originally posted by AliBabaIncorporated@Nov 5 2002, 06:06 AM
Originally posted by Hiroshi2@Nov 5 2002, 06:50 AM
Originally posted by amietron@Sep 27 2002, 11:09 PM

tiger is whatever he says he is.
After giving this some deep thought, I'd have to say that this is the best way to classify Tiger. And everyone else for that matter. Let people define themselves.
letting people define themselves leads to lots of ridiculous definitions. Suppose I'd like to define myself as an international rugby star, a lesbian, or an Afghan rebel?

Defining yourself as a member of a group requires that group accept you, or at least that you recognizably share behavioral and cultural traits with that group so that you could function as one of its members. Which is why, if I said I was an international rugby star, a lesbian, or an Afghan rebel, people would laugh at me. In each of those cases, I'm missing something rather important which would allow me to make good on my claim of being a member of one of those groups - incredible rugby skills, female genitalia, desire to commit terrorist activity against Americans. Digiaks said, Tiger is pretty much a mainstream-cultured American. I believe it. I see this phenomenon in mixed-race kids all the time - they can only function in mainstream culture, but wanna claim they're this and that and something else to make themselves more exotic and more interesting than the other poor unmixed mainstream Joes.
Well.. defining yourself is a good thing, assuming that you define yourself with something that, um, actually makes sense. I don't think identifying yourself with a certain group means that they have to accept you.

maldito

11-05-2002, 09:46 AM

Originally posted by AliBabaIncorporated@Nov 5 2002, 06:06 AM
incredible rugby skills, female genitalia, desire to commit terrorist activity against Americans.

:confused: Ok, so you're still young. Hmm, not sure if it's your Asian or non-Asian side that's making you believe this.

I see this phenomenon in mixed-race kids all the time - they can only function in mainstream culture, but wanna claim they're this and that and something else to make themselves more exotic and more interesting than the other poor unmixed mainstream Joes.

I think some people think it's "exotic" when they name all these various ethnicities which prompts people to say the ignorant - "well, we're all mixed" response. But ah...where I grew up, there's a reason why they teach us to say all the various ethnicities. It's like not acknowledging one of your parents or grandparents.

AliBabaIncorporated

11-05-2002, 10:17 AM

Originally posted by maldito@Nov 6 2002, 01:46 AM
Originally posted by AliBabaIncorporated@Nov 5 2002, 06:06 AM
incredible rugby skills, female genitalia, desire to commit terrorist activity against Americans.

:confused: Ok, so you're still young. Hmm, not sure if it's your Asian or non-Asian side that's making you believe this.

"making me believe?" thanks, but I choose my views freely. don't assume that those who disagree with you only do so because of some untoward outside influence. what exactly are you referring to anyway? and why do you assume I'll grow out of it someday? and why is it a racial issue automatically pertaining to Asian or non-Asian? maybe it's a cultural thing, or a political thing, or a thing with people from my high school.

Originally posted by maldito@Nov 6 2002, 01:46 AM

I think some people think it's "exotic" when they name all these various ethnicities which prompts people to say the ignorant - "well, we're all mixed" response. But ah...where I grew up, there's a reason why they teach us to say all the various ethnicities. It's like not acknowledging one of your parents or grandparents.
there's a difference between, when asked "so what ethnicities are your parents," running off the laundry list, and responding to "what are you?" or claiming "I am Thai," "I'm an Armenian," "I am [insert your ethnicity here]." The first question is about genetics. The second relates to identity. And it's a bit difficult to assert that identifying with a different culture than one of your parents or grandparents is tantamount to failing to acknowledge their existence.

SunWuKong

11-05-2002, 11:14 AM

i can't believe we have a 3-page long thread discussing what tiger woods is or should be. :P

Hiroshi2

11-05-2002, 03:26 PM

Originally posted by AliBabaIncorporated@Nov 5 2002, 05:01 AM
Originally posted by Hiroshi2@Nov 5 2002, 08:29 PM
Well, you can't call him black, cause he doesn't have a black mother and isn't completely or even mostly black speaking in terms of genetics. You can't call him Asian because many will see him as black because of his skin color.
why to base it on something as shallow as genetics or appearance?

Originally posted by Hiroshi2@Nov 5 2002, 08:29 PM
So since "we" (meaning everyone else in the world besides Tiger) can't seem to agree upon a definition of what he is, then I say let Tiger do it himself. He knows himself better than any of us ever could.

maybe. or maybe like lots of other people, he's deluded about what it really means to claim an identity.
All I was saying was that people often do this, base your race on what you "look like". When filling out forms at school that asked for my race, I can't count how many times teachers would say something like, "just put your 'dominant' race", or "whatever race your father is", or even just plain, "what you look like." That's reality, and what I'm saying is as old as the cliche is, it still is true in many cases: looks can be decieving.

maldito

11-05-2002, 06:48 PM

Originally posted by AliBabaIncorporated@Nov 5 2002, 06:17 PM
what exactly are you referring to anyway? and why do you assume I'll grow out of it someday? and why is it a racial issue automatically pertaining to Asian or non-Asian? maybe it's a cultural thing, or a political thing, or a thing with people from my high school.

Regardless of age, we all learn things throughout life. Whether good or bad, we learn. Learning never ceases, hence the saying, "I learned something new today."

I was referring to your comment about Afganis and "terrorists" racist remark. My Afgani friends are not racists and it is wrong for you to think that. If you can think that, I can think or assume (like you have) that you are young and just haven't experienced varied groups of people yet.

there's a difference between, when asked "so what ethnicities are your parents," running off the laundry list, and responding to "what are you?" or claiming "I am Thai," "I'm an Armenian," "I am [insert your ethnicity here]." The first question is about genetics. The second relates to identity. And it's a bit difficult to assert that identifying with a different culture than one of your parents or grandparents is tantamount to failing to acknowledge their existence.

When people ask what you are, they're asking b/c they want to know how you identify yourself or b/c they want to know your ethnicity? In my case, and I have yet to assume incorrectly, they've asked b/c of ethnicity. Which is why now I give my family mixing history which basically covers everything and they usually reply with, "wow...".

But people expect you to use one word to identify yourself with. Ok, so why not just "human" if you're looking for one classification. Regardless, not all answers will satisfy everyone. I'm telling you my own experiences and why I reply the way I do. Because that's how I was taught to answer, not to answer that I am one ethnicity which I'm not. That's how I identify myself, as all my ethnicities. Always have, always will. And I'm not the odd ball, practically everyone in Hawai'i does the same thing.

maldito

11-05-2002, 06:49 PM

Originally posted by SunWuKung@Nov 5 2002, 07:14 PM
i can't believe we have a 3-page long thread discussing what tiger woods is or should be. :P
:lol:

More like some people are getting racists about it.

BeTheReds

11-05-2002, 07:06 PM

Well I can see your point, Maldito, I think that what people are trying to say is that claiming an ethnicity from such a little portion of your genepool (say portuguese for instance) when you have very few ties to Portugal or other Portuguese-Americans means nothing. If I wanted to I could say I am Irish, Dutch, German and Italian. But I don't speak any of those languages, nor do I know anyone who lives in any of those countries, nor do I feel any kind of ethnic or cultural bond with any people that would claim to be such. Therefore claiming to be any of those by me is rediculous, even tho I may look like people from there.

Meanwhile my father is 1st gen Korean, I speak a little Korean, I am used to many Korean culural norms, I have Korean friends, I eat Korean food and can easily identify fake American or Japanese attempts at making Korean food (something that I could never do with Italian food.)

So I can claim to be a Korean, or at least a Korean-American, because I have such strong affinites to the place.

If you had to choose which part of your bloodline that you most identify with, then judging from the majority of your posts I'd have to say you are Filipino or Hawaiian. But I can't decide for you, so I won't.

If you are talking about your race, then going into your history like that is however understandable.

Craig

11-05-2002, 07:33 PM

I think part of the issue is that somebody like "Tiger Woods" would never be remotely accepted by most of the "Asian" community if he wasn't famous. However, because he is a celebrity, many of the stupid moronic Asian assholes are bending over backwards to claim his as one of his own.

Also, self-identification, is not realistic because even if I act like I'm a member of a certain group, hold the beliefs and cultural values of a certain group and possible even look like a member of most East Asian groups, ...

If I were mixed (and not rich or famous), I would never be accepted, granted some individuals may accept me, heck if I looked like the group, even if the vast majority initially accepted me, that acceptance would be fleeting.

Many people talk behind other peoples back and all it takes is an innocent comment about somebody "mixed" ancestry for the majority of the group to look at you differently and correspondingly treat you differently. It's not really hard to put a comment about somebody's ancestry into an Asian group and see it spread quickly.

Also, for people like Tiger Woods, and others that don't look "Asian", if they were to be 100% immersed in the culture of their Asian ancestor, they would still not experience life in America as their Asian relatives do. They would not deal to a fraction of the same extent with the differential treatment, opportunities, prejudices, etc. So, somebody like Mr. Woods has no good reference point on what it is like to be treated as a Thai (or Asian) person in the USA.

angel nympho

11-05-2002, 08:21 PM

I sure hope you guys realize that it seems more like you're HOPING he'd identify himself with Asians over any other race. I don't think he himself really cares. I think the fact that we're debating who he should be identified with doesn't make any sense. SELF-identification would require him to do it himself.

maldito

11-05-2002, 10:15 PM

Originally posted by BeTheReds@Nov 6 2002, 03:06 AM
judging from the majority of your posts I'd have to say you are Filipino or Hawaiian.
And those are the 2 that I culturally connect to the most. Without any effort I talk about those 2 cultures b/c that's what makes me who I am basically. Genetically, you can add in Portg. and Chinese. I think I've said this before, unlike my other cousins who are more culturally Chinese than I am b/c their particular families kept up the Chinese traditions, I don't connect to that side as much but know that we come from the same great-grandmother, or more specifically 2nd great-grandfather who was from China. Also, my mom thinks I look more Portuguese than any of my other siblings. And I'm one of the few in the entire family that speaks the language, but that was my way of trying to connect to that side, unlike my mother who is more connected to that side of the family.

If you are talking about your race, then going into your history like that is however understandable.

It's like the cinematographer, I paint the picture so that people can get the whole idea versus selecting certain ethnicities which usually prompts more questions.

AliBabaIncorporated

11-05-2002, 11:22 PM

Originally posted by maldito@Nov 6 2002, 10:48 AM
I was referring to your comment about Afganis and "terrorists" racist remark. My Afgani friends are not racists and it is wrong for you to think that.
Three fucking cheers for them. :pissed: I don't believe that they are racists and never state any such thing, so there's no particular need for you to be so condescending. My "Afghani rebels" comment I believe fairly obviously refers to Taliban etc. partisans performing actions such as, say, rebelling against the central government in Afghanistan because they dislike its pro-Americanism. Try throwing around that "racist" label a little less lightly. If you are prone to take such comment and blow it out of proportion as you seem to be, my apologies.

AliBabaIncorporated

11-05-2002, 11:26 PM

Originally posted by Craig@Nov 6 2002, 11:33 AM
Also, for people like Tiger Woods, and others that don't look "Asian", if they were to be 100% immersed in the culture of their Asian ancestor, they would still not experience life in America as their Asian relatives do. They would not deal to a fraction of the same extent with the differential treatment, opportunities, prejudices, etc. So, somebody like Mr. Woods has no good reference point on what it is like to be treated as a Thai (or Asian) person in the USA.
You do realize, though, that if you were to choose to base your identity based on how strangers and vague acquaintances treated you by looking at your appearance, basically means you'd be leaving his identity open to the decision of the lowest common denominator - the idiots who know nothing about your culture anyway and aren't qualified to make a judgment whether you're a member of it or not. Different treatment, opportunities, and prejudice are only a small part of what it actually means to be Asian, and people who are blowing it up to the extent of saying "those who don't experience such prejudice don't know what it means to be Asian" are missing out on a lot of fun :dance: