Black Racism

[SunWuKong]

this is an old article that i found about black-on-asian racism.

http://www.theamericanenterprise.org/taend98c.htm


Black Racism
The hate that dare not speak its name

In what passes for discussions on race these days, small problems are often blown up large, while real traumas are completely ignored. For instance, despite what President Clinton’s "Race Initiative" panel has said, the very rawest racial conflicts in present-day America don’t even fit into the tidy mold of white-majority-oppressing-colored-minority that activists constantly promote. Though civil rights groups and most of the media studiously ignore this fact, the nation’s most fractious racial battles are now conflicts between minority populations. Particularly horrific is the animosity directed at Asian Americans by blacks in low-income areas of urban America.

At age ten, I immigrated from China to Oakland, California, a city filled with crime, poverty, and racial tension. In elementary school, I didn’t wear name-brand clothing or speak English. My name soon became "Ching Chong," "Chinagirl," and "Chow Mein." Other children laughed at my language, my culture, my ethnicity, and my race. I said nothing.

After a few years, I began to speak English, but not well enough to trade racial insults. On rides home from school I avoided the back of the bus so as not to be beaten up. But even when I sat in the front, fire crackers, paper balls, small rocks, and profanity were thrown at me and the other "stupid Chinamen." The label "Chinamen" was dished out indiscriminately to Vietnamese, Koreans, and other Asians. When I looked around, I saw that the other "Chinamen" tuned out the insults by eagerly discussing movies, friends, and school.

During my secondary school years, racism, and then the combination of outrage and bitterness that it fosters, accompanied me home on the bus every day. My English was by now more fluent than that of those who insulted me, but most of the time I still said nothing to avoid being beaten up. In addition to everything else thrown at me, a few times a week I was the target of sexual remarks vulgar enough to make Howard Stern blush. When I did respond to the insults, I immediately faced physical threats or attacks, along with the embarrassing fact that the other "Chinamen" around me simply continued their quiet personal conversations without intervening. The reality was that those who cursed my race and ethnicity were far bigger in size than most of the Asian children who sat silently.

The racial harassment wasn’t limited to bus rides. It surfaced in my high school cafeteria, where a middle-aged Chinese vendor who spoke broken English was told by rowdy students each day at lunch time to "Hurry up, you dumb Ching!" On the sidewalks, black teenagers and adults would creep up behind 80-year-old Asians and frighten them with sing-song nonsense: "Yee-ya, Ching-chong, ah-ee, un-yahhh!" At markets and in the streets of poor black neighborhoods, Asians would be told, "Why the hell don’t you just go back to where you came from!"

When it came time for college, I left this ugly world for a beautiful school far away. Finally, it was possible to pursue a life without racial harassment backed by the threat of violence. I chose not to return to my old neighborhood after college, but I am often reminded of the racial discrimination I endured there. On a bus not too long ago I saw a black woman curse at a Korean man, "You f---ing Chinese person! Didn’t you hear that I asked you to move yo’ ass? You too stupid to understand English or something?"

[rakovlam]

Yep, it seems today's biggest victims of racism are whites (especially if they are christian or Jewish) and asians. Some college's affirmative action include admitting non-asian minorities that are not qualified. There is always an outrage when a white cop shoots an unarmed black suspect or when a Republican says stuff Democrats get away with all the time (Trent "Dixiecrat" Lott gets in huge trouble while Robert "White N**ger" (phrase quoted from last year) Byrd continues to denounce his membership of the KKK).

Meanwhile there's more black on white, black on asian and black on black crimes than the stuff portrayed in the media constantly.

Did you know there was a 2nd race-related murder in Jasper, TX after the James Byrd incident? Of course, that wasn't big news because the victim this time was white and the murderer was black.

I think whites are the least racist people I know. As the matter of fact, my white friends constantly remind me that they're not offending me (I never get offended by anything) everytime they talk about Asians. This is termed "white guilt". It is guilt felt by whites who think they are still responsible of the racism of the past.

[YuheiCarreau]

Oh, boo hoo hoo. What a lame article. I can't tell if the author really does have a warped view of the world, or is just a bad writer. She begins with a personal history that's full of biases; moves on to condemn national Black and AA spokespeople; and completely sidesteps the issue of White-on-Black racism, the percieved favoritism towards Asians by Whites, or any other set of circumstances that might explain why those evil Black people might be lashing out at Asians. It's obvious why her concern would be for the Asian side of this conflict, but the author's point is basically "Blacks say they just recieve racism, but they also dish it out" and "AA leaders who don't condemn this are bourgeois wimps!". Pretty much the exact opposite of "Fight, not against or for any group, but against racial discrimination". Don't waste time fighting acts of racism, 'cause you'll never be able to stop them all; fight the ignorance that created that racism, and the power structure that condones it.

[wylin]

anyone can be racist, blackies too. reality is that everyone no matter how "progressive" or conservative that they point themselves out as, everyone has sum sort of racial biase. I think that will continue as long as we human being view our own cultures and racial composition as supperior, and as long as we create false distinictions between each other based on culture/ language/ location/ watever.

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Dec 31 2002, 01:37 AM
Oh, boo hoo hoo. What a lame article. I can't tell if the author really does have a warped view of the world, or is just a bad writer. She begins with a personal history that's full of biases; moves on to condemn national Black and AA spokespeople; and completely sidesteps the issue of White-on-Black racism, the percieved favoritism towards Asians by Whites, or any other set of circumstances that might explain why those evil Black people might be lashing out at Asians. It's obvious why her concern would be for the Asian side of this conflict, but the author's point is basically "Blacks say they just recieve racism, but they also dish it out" and "AA leaders who don't condemn this are bourgeois wimps!". Pretty much the exact opposite of "Fight, not against or for any group, but against racial discrimination". Don't waste time fighting acts of racism, 'cause you'll never be able to stop them all; fight the ignorance that created that racism, and the power structure that condones it.
well there are certainly many reasons that explain the existence of black-on-asian racism, but i have yet to find one that justifies it. i don't think the author's point was to explain away why blacks victimise asians. i thought her point was that it is too politically incorrect to suggest that black people can be racist against black people. her personal history actually mirrors that of friends and relatives i know who have grown up in urban areas. i thought her article was in line with the quote ""Fight, not against or for any group, but against racial discrimination" because i didn't think she was so much as pointing fingers at black people as she was saying how american society always seems to concentrate on how black people are victimised and completely ignore the fact black people are also capable of racial discrimination.

[Jenny]

She acknowledged an issue that has been on my mind for a while now... Glad someone noticed it and is brave enough to speak up about it.

[kasia]

i think that many blacks are racist yet take on this "victim" mentality, believing that they are incapable of racism.

oakland (exclusive of the white-infested oakland hills) is unique in that there are mostly asians (chinese and vietnamese) and blacks living there. the two groups rarely mix, though, and the racism goes both ways. many asians are covertly racist towards blacks. for example, they'll see a black person walking down the same street and would cross the street to avoid him/her. they stare. they'll end conversations or quiet down. and they'll show fear.

blacks, in turn, resent being seen as monsters or individuals who should be feared. they often respond by hurling insults or acting as bullies.

[DaBestSpooner]

Originally posted by kasia@Dec 31 2002, 04:40 AM

blacks, in turn, resent being seen as monsters or individuals who should be feared. they often respond by hurling insults or acting as bullies.
I guess reinforcing that stereotype is a smart move

[DaBestSpooner]

Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Dec 31 2002, 01:37 AM
Oh, boo hoo hoo. What a lame article. I can't tell if the author really does have a warped view of the world, or is just a bad writer. She begins with a personal history that's full of biases; moves on to condemn national Black and AA spokespeople; and completely sidesteps the issue of White-on-Black racism, the percieved favoritism towards Asians by Whites, or any other set of circumstances that might explain why those evil Black people might be lashing out at Asians. It's obvious why her concern would be for the Asian side of this conflict, but the author's point is basically "Blacks say they just recieve racism, but they also dish it out" and "AA leaders who don't condemn this are bourgeois wimps!". Pretty much the exact opposite of "Fight, not against or for any group, but against racial discrimination". Don't waste time fighting acts of racism, 'cause you'll never be able to stop them all; fight the ignorance that created that racism, and the power structure that condones it.
where the heck did you grow up?

[igcognito]

The main reasons, why blacks hate ANY group is a)feeling taken advantage of and B) feeling like "monsters". I am sure many of you do, and just don't know it. It comes out of habit. I am not saying black/asian racism is right. I am saying no matter what shit will always hit the fan. The sad thing is in the US, I don't care what anyone says, if it is one thing all racial groups can agree on is that they hate black people. Most blacks, will say something deragatory, out of ignorance or hate. I don't see it often, I see racism toward blacks andf asians from whites. But I rarely see, black on asian racism. But of course it is easy for a black person to play the victim role.

[deez nuts]

Originally posted by igcognito@Dec 31 2002, 09:19 AM
But I rarely see, black on asian racism.
Come to NYC.

[pfc beansprout]

man, u guys are brutal.............

[rakovlam]

What this article is trying to say is that black on asian racism is common in her community and the blacks get away with it in society. You'll never see blacks committing "hate crimes" (quoted because I don't think this should be a category of crime... murder is murder) against people of other races in national media outlets. Of course, if a black man is dragged to death by white supremacists, you got media outlets reporting the same story for weeks and the president (Clinton) calling for hate crime legislation.

The James Byrd incident was even used as an attack ad against then Governor Bush. It was the daughter of James Byrd saying that because Governor Bush refused to pass hate crime legislation, it felt like he was lynched all over again. The perpetrators DID get the death sentence.

Think about it. While the Sharptons and the Jacksons of the world accuse whites of being racists, blacks have some of the highest crime rates in the nation (all in the stats) and the highest rate of children born out of wedlock (thus contributing to hte crime rate, I'll explain)

The majority of black children, especially in urban areas, are born without their fathers present. Statistics show that lack of a father figure in the family would make children more likely to take drugs, commit crimes, go into prostitution, etc. Make sense since the mother is usually busy working thus leaving children unsupervised and bit too much freedom.

Think about it.

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by rakovlam@Dec 31 2002, 11:01 AM
The majority of black children, especially in urban areas, are born without their fathers present. Statistics show that lack of a father figure in the family would make children more likely to take drugs, commit crimes, go into prostitution, etc. Make sense since the mother is usually busy working thus leaving children unsupervised and bit too much freedom.
ok, but this is a correlational study at best. any causal effect that "experts" might be able to conjure can only go as far as speculation. there could be something that causes a high (relatively speaking) divorce rate as well as likelyhood of drug abuse, criminal activities, etc etc, and that it's not the case that single parenthood causes such things.

[pfc beansprout]

Originally posted by rakovlam@Dec 31 2002, 11:01 AM
What this article is trying to say is that black on asian racism is common in her community and the blacks get away with it in society. You'll never see blacks committing "hate crimes" (quoted because I don't think this should be a category of crime... murder is murder) against people of other races in national media outlets. Of course, if a black man is dragged to death by white supremacists, you got media outlets reporting the same story for weeks and the president (Clinton) calling for hate crime legislation.

The James Byrd incident was even used as an attack ad against then Governor Bush. It was the daughter of James Byrd saying that because Governor Bush refused to pass hate crime legislation, it felt like he was lynched all over again. The perpetrators DID get the death sentence.

Think about it. While the Sharptons and the Jacksons of the world accuse whites of being racists, blacks have some of the highest crime rates in the nation (all in the stats) and the highest rate of children born out of wedlock (thus contributing to hte crime rate, I'll explain)

The majority of black children, especially in urban areas, are born without their fathers present. Statistics show that lack of a father figure in the family would make children more likely to take drugs, commit crimes, go into prostitution, etc. Make sense since the mother is usually busy working thus leaving children unsupervised and bit too much freedom.

Think about it.
and the blacks get away with it in society.




not the same...whites hold the power....
-white on black racism effects: employment, income dispartiy, wealth disparity, health care, criminal justice system....

-black on white racism effects: seen on the courts/fields (sports), music industry (heh...maybe this is why i don't dig eminem), double dutch jump rope (disparity), and jail/prison treatment (well...if u are a white dude in jail, statistically speaking, you are the minority).....


---->these are examples of the differences of the effects racism..it's resources and power issue here...blacks-minorities in general do not have the power as whites...you've got to understand yes, blacks can be racists and whatnot..but whites, still get the last laugh.... :angry:

[rakovlam]

Originally posted by pfc beansprout@Dec 31 2002, 12:28 PM


and the blacks get away with it in society.




not the same...whites hold the power....
-white on black racism effects: employment, income dispartiy, wealth disparity, health care, criminal justice system....

-black on white racism effects: seen on the courts/fields (sports), music industry (heh...maybe this is why i don't dig eminem), double dutch jump rope (disparity), and jail/prison treatment (well...if u are a white dude in jail, statistically speaking, you are the minority).....


---->these are examples of the differences of the effects racism..it's resources and power issue here...blacks-minorities in general do not have the power as whites...you've got to understand yes, blacks can be racists and whatnot..but whites, still get the last laugh.... :angry:
income disparity cannot be controlled. There is a huge rise in the black middle class that's not being acknowledged in the media. To many, blacks are viewed as poor victims of white society, which is no longer true. If African-Americans have their own country, they would be the richest African nation in the world. I just heard that the state of Mississippi (37% black population and the poorest state in the union) has a higher GDP than Sweden.

Employment, have you heard of affirmative action? It seems like a good program, but in reality it was turned into a system which favors blacks.

As for criminal justice system, many people cannot accept the fact that blacks commit more crimes despite the minority status. Deal with it. The black community has its own issues (like having children out of wedlock) and doesn't need to blame white people or any other group.

One may think most of our tax dollars go to the rich, in reality most of it goes to welfare programs such as Medicare and housing projects. Most of these recipients are minorities who barely pay any taxes.

Whites do NOT hold all the power. I can give you hundreds of black Congressmen, Senators, Mayors of major cities, CEO's, billionaires (for those who think the rich hold all the power), cabinet members, and even black "leaders".

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by rakovlam@Dec 31 2002, 11:45 AM
income disparity cannot be controlled.  There is a huge rise in the black middle class that's not being acknowledged in the media.  To many, blacks are viewed as poor victims of white society, which is no longer true.  If African-Americans have their own country, they would be the richest African nation in the world.  I just heard that the state of Mississippi (37% black population and the poorest state in the union) has a higher GDP than Sweden.

this is not exactly a correct assessment. yeah i read that supposedly, african americans as a group is the 10th richest "nation" in the world. but this 10th richest nation is also within the 1st richest nation in the world. so you've people with the purchasing power of the 10th richest nation in the world, living in the country that is the richest nation in the world. that's actually pretty bad.


Originally posted by rakovlam@Dec 31 2002, 11:45 AM

One may think most of our tax dollars go to the rich, in reality most of it goes to welfare programs such as Medicare and housing projects.  Most of these recipients are minorities who barely pay any taxes.

hmm.... it's not really that tax dollars go to the rich, it's the fact that the rich gets rich by finding tax loopholes through their corporations.... but er... anyway i don't want to go on a tangent about that :P


Originally posted by rakovlam@Dec 31 2002, 11:45 AM

Whites do NOT hold all the power.  I can give you hundreds of black Congressmen, Senators, Mayors of major cities, CEO's, billionaires (for those who think the rich hold all the power), cabinet members, and even black "leaders".

well, whites do disproportionally hold more seats of power in america actually. but sure, they don't occupy literally all the positions of power.

[pfc beansprout]

income disparity IS related to racism...and that disparity is decreasing....BUT in wealth, the disparity is greatest...there is a difference b/w income and wealth (amount made vs. amount "passed on"-cars, houses, assets, etc)...

[deez nuts]

So is this how the hierarchy goes since blacks hold more political power and have a greater voice than Asians?

Whites------>Blacks----->Asians

Sure would explain a lot.

[pfc beansprout]

Originally posted by Chasiubao_Boy@Dec 31 2002, 12:07 PM
So is this how the hierarchy goes since blacks hold more political and have a greater voice than Asians?

Whites------>Blacks----->Asians

Sure would explain a lot.
honestly...i would say so..(maybe this is why many asians here seem to bash blacks..~shrug)..but u gotta understand, relative in numbers, our voice is smaller (yet growing)...we are still growing and-like all, re-inventing ourselves...i guess we just gotta pay our dues, and only time will tell if shit changes... :huh:

[deez nuts]

Originally posted by pfc beansprout@Dec 31 2002, 12:09 PM
Originally posted by Chasiubao_Boy@Dec 31 2002, 12:07 PM
So is this how the hierarchy goes since blacks hold more political and have a greater voice than Asians?

Whites------>Blacks----->Asians

Sure would explain a lot.
honestly...i would say so..(maybe this is why many asians here seem to bash blacks..~shrug)..but u gotta understand, relative in numbers, our voice is smaller (yet growing)...we are still growing and-like all, re-inventing ourselves...i guess we just gotta pay our dues, and only time will tell if shit changes... :huh:
Nah if I come across as bashing, my bad. I'm pretty neutral. I've stood up for blacks on this board. But I can't turn a blind eye to some of the shit going on around me here either.

[VV o n g B a]

Originally posted by rakovlam@Dec 31 2002, 10:45 AM
income disparity cannot be controlled. There is a huge rise in the black middle class that's not being acknowledged in the media. To many, blacks are viewed as poor victims of white society, which is no longer true. If African-Americans have their own country, they would be the richest African nation in the world. I just heard that the state of Mississippi (37% black population and the poorest state in the union) has a higher GDP than Sweden.

Employment, have you heard of affirmative action? It seems like a good program, but in reality it was turned into a system which favors blacks.

As for criminal justice system, many people cannot accept the fact that blacks commit more crimes despite the minority status. Deal with it. The black community has its own issues (like having children out of wedlock) and doesn't need to blame white people or any other group.

One may think most of our tax dollars go to the rich, in reality most of it goes to welfare programs such as Medicare and housing projects. Most of these recipients are minorities who barely pay any taxes.

Whites do NOT hold all the power. I can give you hundreds of black Congressmen, Senators, Mayors of major cities, CEO's, billionaires (for those who think the rich hold all the power), cabinet members, and even black "leaders".
AA only tries to even the field. did u read the forum post about the experiment where they sent out resumes with black or white names on it? the blacks are discriminated against period.

having children out of wedlock is heavily related to poverty. ppl don't often TRY to have children out of wedlock. its a cycle. they do it cuz they're poor, but they're poor b/c they had a single parent childhood and a poor education.

yes, a lot of taxes go to minorities that pay fewer taxes, but thats b/c they are poorer. why would anyone think that tax dollars go to the rich? rich ppl wouldn't complain about high taxes so much if the money came back to them in some form.

what would happen without aid to the poor? we would see many more beggars on the streets and the crime rate would be higher and as a result new prisons would have to be built. would u rather see people on welfare who might contribute to society in some small way, or people in prison who live completely off of taxes?

[pfc beansprout]

Originally posted by Chasiubao_Boy@Dec 31 2002, 12:15 PM
Originally posted by pfc beansprout@Dec 31 2002, 12:09 PM
Originally posted by Chasiubao_Boy@Dec 31 2002, 12:07 PM
So is this how the hierarchy goes since blacks hold more political and have a greater voice than Asians?

Whites------>Blacks----->Asians

Sure would explain a lot.
honestly...i would say so..(maybe this is why many asians here seem to bash blacks..~shrug)..but u gotta understand, relative in numbers, our voice is smaller (yet growing)...we are still growing and-like all, re-inventing ourselves...i guess we just gotta pay our dues, and only time will tell if shit changes... :huh:
Nah if I come across as bashing, my bad. I'm pretty neutral. I've stood up for blacks on this board. But I can't turn a blind eye to some of the shit going on around me here either.
all good..that's why we got debates :D heh, i know i'm very 'pro-minority' ...soc and poly sci major here, gotta spread the word!!! hehe, jk! :P

[VV o n g B a]

Originally posted by Chasiubao_Boy@Dec 31 2002, 11:07 AM
So is this how the hierarchy goes since blacks hold more political power and have a greater voice than Asians?

Whites------>Blacks----->Asians

Sure would explain a lot.
i wouldn't say thats necessarily true. since whites have the most power, what they do matters most. whites tend to discriminate less against asians than blacks in my experience.

but yea, i've experienced some very uncomfortable moments myself with blacks who had NEVER met an asian that spoke english well. its just that black discrimination doesn't tend to affect my job status or things of that nature.

[537]

The only black on asian racism experience (maybe) I've ever felt was at Knott's Berry Farm when I was 6 years old. I was in line for one of the rides with my 7 year old sister (at the time), and two black kids started blurting out, "mama di'nt raise no foo." while staring at us.

He startled me and my little 6 year old fist came out and popped his nose. My sister and I just stared at the black kids and then they ran off. To this day I don't know what the fuck they were trying to say. I wanted to say sorry, but I was too scared to say anything.

I thought if the black kid started beating me up, the white kids would join in.

[Hito]

In my experience Blacks & Hispanics (usually underprivileged) feel that Asians occupy a higher social rung in society because of there nearness of skin tone with whites; and that in fact Asians go out of there way to try and be or act white.
Especially in respect to there treatment of dark skinned people, and so are in league with whites to hold them back.

The idea of Asians as the “Good coloreds” also plays into the frustrations of Black and Hispanic communities who constantly hear “Why cant blacks and Mexicans be more like the Asians, they are all smart, successful and don’t complain about discrimination.”

If you have ever had your parents tell you "why can’t you be more like such and such, they never get in trouble"? You know a little of that frustration.
Add to that the economic presence Asian Americans have in poor urban communities in the way of small Mom & Pop grocery & liquor stores and the lack of a reciprocal presence in China Town, Korea Town or Little Tokyo of Blacks or Hispanic businesses.

So lacking any real economic/political power base to retaliate from this frustration manifests itself as violence and harassment.


And even though I know it doesn’t keep us from acting out in ways harmful to each other, I also subscribe to the idea that racism “stemming from white supremacy” equals "prejudice plus power"

It is also my personal belief that light skinned Asians are becoming a “buffer” class the same as mulattos or mixed-race people are used in the Indian cast system.
So as long as we are battling each other in the bottom and the middle it frees up the elite from worrying about us as it does as it pleases.

But that’s just my opinion...
I could be wrong :unsure:

[YuheiCarreau]

Originally posted by rakovlam@Dec 31 2002, 10:01 AM
What this article is trying to say is that black on asian racism is common in her community and the blacks get away with it in society.  You'll never see blacks committing "hate crimes" (quoted because I don't think this should be a category of crime... murder is murder) against people of other races in national media outlets.  Of course, if a black man is dragged to death by white supremacists, you got media outlets reporting the same story for weeks and the president (Clinton) calling for hate crime legislation.  

The James Byrd incident was even used as an attack ad against then Governor Bush.  It was the daughter of James Byrd saying that because Governor Bush refused to pass hate crime legislation, it felt like he was lynched all over again.  The perpetrators DID get the death sentence.

Think about it.  While the Sharptons and the Jacksons of the world accuse whites of being racists, blacks have some of the highest crime rates in the nation (all in the stats) and the highest rate of children born out of wedlock (thus contributing to hte crime rate, I'll explain)

The majority of black children, especially in urban areas, are born without their fathers present.  Statistics show that lack of a father figure in the family would make children more likely to take drugs, commit crimes, go into prostitution, etc.  Make sense since the mother is usually busy working thus leaving children unsupervised and bit too much freedom.

Think about it.
The difference between White racism (against Asians or Blacks) is that it can result in the Asian or Black not getting a job, being raped, getting maimed or killed and then the White perpatrators getting away with it; whereas Black on Asian racism is mostly in the form of ignorant comments, nasty glances, etc. (not trying to justify it, just saying it's a lesser manifestation of hate). If a Black man beats up or kills an Asian man and gets caught? He's going to jail. And probably for a longer, harder sentence than if he were White. Yeah, there is a problem with Blacks not mixing with Asians. But you know what, a good deal of that is simply the result of two different cultures being stuffed into a small area; all through the history of New York, you have English vs. Irish immigrants, Irish vs. Italian, Italian vs. Puerto Rican, etc. And another part of it is racism being handed down by the majority culture (in this case, Whites) to minority cultures which are gaining economic and political power. In Westchester, where I grew up, my working class / middle class town is looked down upon by WASPs from Greenwich and upper Westchester - because it's mostly Italian. And the Italians (and other Whites) look down on the Blacks in the neighboring towns. Although I sympathize with the author of the article, and anyone who's been on the recieving end of racism, I think it's ignorant of her (and you) to not recognize the fact that the stereotypes and patterns of discrimination she encountered were not created by Blacks but handed down to them. The tragedy here is not "Blacks are getting away with racism" as much as it is "Blacks are perpetuating the same kind of stereotypes that are used to insult and disparage them". Your naive, grossly inaccurate comments about Blacks are simply more of the same.

[wylin]

i personally never had issues w/ the brothers, around where i live, because i spent a summer doing a educational summer recreation program in a inner city park, and got meet the children who lived in the surrounding housing communities, even the various gang members would come by and talk to us and play basket ball w/ us. I think it was a good experience, overall just getting to know those 16-25 year old black kids and seeing what they go through. The adversarial role was there and they were pretty happy that i wasnt korean, but still...overall they were realy nice they'd come everyday and play and my coworker would bring his brother and sisters to come play w/ us, alot of the gangster would bring their families and sisters. And i got a view of what life is in the inner city...basically sums it up as "we wont do nothing to you as long as you do nothing foul to us"

Then again, i dont get along w/ mexicans, out here where i live we had alota squables between us taiwanese and the mexicans, just the mexicans vs. asians in general is all i can remember. One time one of them rear ended my older car and then tried to attack me because i was going to report his rearending me and damaging my car to the cops, he fallowed me home and tried to threaten my family. till we just banded together and showed him who really owned the school and that he was fucking w/ the wrong group of asian guyz. Then that same yr the same group of mexicans started grabbing my friend and that ensued into a school wide conflict between all the koreans gangster wannabes and the cholo's and a major food fight. I just dont have a good view of our border brothers from then, and think that atleast in socal the mexicans have an adversarial role to asians.
That the conflict between asians and mexicans is especially fierce in parts such as the san gabriel valley and hacienda heights where chinese/ taiwanese and mexicans live in close proximaty. Some of my friends uses to get attacked by cholo's all the time in rosemead and san gabriel, they banded together and started fighting back attacking the mexicans and fighting w/ them on the same level. It culminated w/ a huge fight in front of my friends house, where the chinese guyz showed them whats up and guns were involved... Another interesting side note is that those guyz would go outside and drive around and go fishing for cholo's on bikes and hit them off their bikes.

[VV o n g B a]

Another interesting side note is that those guyz would go outside and drive around and go fishing for cholo's on bikes and hit them off their bikes.

vice-city as life. :lol: thats hilarious.

[YuheiCarreau]

Originally posted by Hito@Dec 31 2002, 01:06 PM
It is also my personal belief that light skinned Asians are becoming a “buffer” class the same as mulattos or mixed-race people are used in the Indian cast system.
So as long as we are battling each other in the bottom and the middle it frees up the elite from worrying about us as it does as it pleases.

But that’s just my opinion...
I could be wrong  :unsure:
The racial caste system in the US is determined by more than just skin color. Although Blacks are stereotyped as violent and aggressive (what I call an 'Inhuman' stereotype), Asians are also stereotyped as Inhuman when they are said to be dog eaters, foot binders, etc. (I should say for the record that I do not someone less human if he eats a dog, and although I'm against foot binding it's almost never compared to the Western practice of corseting, which is just as Inhuman). And while 'Ignorant' stereotypes usually favor Asians over Blacks (Asians are better than math, Asians are better workers) there's still the fact that a Black person is assumed to speak English and assumed to have been raised in the US, yet an Asian is assumed to be a foreigner. I also have never believed in this 'buffer' idea that a person of partial White heritage is a middle ground between being White and being whatever minority makes up the rest of their heritage, because the only way for a mixed person to get more privileges from Whites is for him to forsake his non-White side entirely (therefor, in my opinion, forsaking his identity as a person of mixed race and becoming a White wannabe), and even then he'll still be percieved as that minority by Whites (and then treated either as that minority or just as 'other, not like us').

[wylin]

Originally posted by VV o n g B a@Dec 31 2002, 12:05 PM

vice-city as life. :lol: thats hilarious.
yep they'd first go watch this then weave toward the cholo and hit him off his lowrider bike w/ a small impact.

[kasia]

Originally posted by rakovlam@Dec 31 2002, 08:01 AM
What this article is trying to say is that black on asian racism is common in her community and the blacks get away with it in society.  You'll never see blacks committing "hate crimes" (quoted because I don't think this should be a category of crime... murder is murder) against people of other races in national media outlets.  Of course, if a black man is dragged to death by white supremacists, you got media outlets reporting the same story for weeks and the president (Clinton) calling for hate crime legislation.
sure, they do. blacks commit hate crimes all the time. they often specifically target asians when committing robberies because of their belief that asians are passive or are not familiar with the law.

[MellowDrama]

Um... guys, it's written by the AEI.

Nuff fucking said.

(And I'm republican, just not a neo-con nutcase)

[loserbutt]

you know what pisses me off? blacks get away with racism all the time in film and music. of course when they taste that medicine they run off yelling racism

[DaBestSpooner]

Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Dec 31 2002, 02:45 PM

The difference between White racism (against Asians or Blacks) is that it can result in the Asian or Black not getting a job, being raped, getting maimed or killed and then the White perpatrators getting away with it; whereas Black on Asian racism is mostly in the form of ignorant comments, nasty glances, etc. (not trying to justify it, just saying it's a lesser manifestation of hate). If a Black man beats up or kills an Asian man and gets caught? He's going to jail. And probably for a longer, harder sentence than if he were White. Yeah, there is a problem with Blacks not mixing with Asians. But you know what, a good deal of that is simply the result of two different cultures being stuffed into a small area; all through the history of New York, you have English vs. Irish immigrants, Irish vs. Italian, Italian vs. Puerto Rican, etc. And another part of it is racism being handed down by the majority culture (in this case, Whites) to minority cultures which are gaining economic and political power. In Westchester, where I grew up, my working class / middle class town is looked down upon by WASPs from Greenwich and upper Westchester - because it's mostly Italian. And the Italians (and other Whites) look down on the Blacks in the neighboring towns. Although I sympathize with the author of the article, and anyone who's been on the recieving end of racism, I think it's ignorant of her (and you) to not recognize the fact that the stereotypes and patterns of discrimination she encountered were not created by Blacks but handed down to them. The tragedy here is not "Blacks are getting away with racism" as much as it is "Blacks are perpetuating the same kind of stereotypes that are used to insult and disparage them". Your naive, grossly inaccurate comments about Blacks are simply more of the same.
what are you smoking?

You're from westchester county, dont you watch the local news?

-Black serial rapist targets asian women in the east village
-Valedictorian harrassed in brooklyn high schoool everyday because he's a model student
-Black kids kill a chinese delivery man with a brick because they thought it was fun.
-Jay-Z's former barber goes on a shooting rampage in the east village, attempts to set white folk on fire and shoots an elderly japanese man.
-Chinese killed while trying to stop a fight outside his liqour store, they stop fighting and ransack his store while he lays dying.
-Black mugger/rapist targeting japanese women in west harlem.

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Dec 31 2002, 02:45 PM
Originally posted by rakovlam@Dec 31 2002, 10:01 AM
What this article is trying to say is that black on asian racism is common in her community and the blacks get away with it in society. You'll never see blacks committing "hate crimes" (quoted because I don't think this should be a category of crime... murder is murder) against people of other races in national media outlets. Of course, if a black man is dragged to death by white supremacists, you got media outlets reporting the same story for weeks and the president (Clinton) calling for hate crime legislation.

The James Byrd incident was even used as an attack ad against then Governor Bush. It was the daughter of James Byrd saying that because Governor Bush refused to pass hate crime legislation, it felt like he was lynched all over again. The perpetrators DID get the death sentence.

Think about it. While the Sharptons and the Jacksons of the world accuse whites of being racists, blacks have some of the highest crime rates in the nation (all in the stats) and the highest rate of children born out of wedlock (thus contributing to hte crime rate, I'll explain)

The majority of black children, especially in urban areas, are born without their fathers present. Statistics show that lack of a father figure in the family would make children more likely to take drugs, commit crimes, go into prostitution, etc. Make sense since the mother is usually busy working thus leaving children unsupervised and bit too much freedom.

Think about it.
The difference between White racism (against Asians or Blacks) is that it can result in the Asian or Black not getting a job, being raped, getting maimed or killed and then the White perpatrators getting away with it; whereas Black on Asian racism is mostly in the form of ignorant comments, nasty glances, etc. (not trying to justify it, just saying it's a lesser manifestation of hate). If a Black man beats up or kills an Asian man and gets caught? He's going to jail. And probably for a longer, harder sentence than if he were White. Yeah, there is a problem with Blacks not mixing with Asians. But you know what, a good deal of that is simply the result of two different cultures being stuffed into a small area; all through the history of New York, you have English vs. Irish immigrants, Irish vs. Italian, Italian vs. Puerto Rican, etc. And another part of it is racism being handed down by the majority culture (in this case, Whites) to minority cultures which are gaining economic and political power. In Westchester, where I grew up, my working class / middle class town is looked down upon by WASPs from Greenwich and upper Westchester - because it's mostly Italian. And the Italians (and other Whites) look down on the Blacks in the neighboring towns. Although I sympathize with the author of the article, and anyone who's been on the recieving end of racism, I think it's ignorant of her (and you) to not recognize the fact that the stereotypes and patterns of discrimination she encountered were not created by Blacks but handed down to them. The tragedy here is not "Blacks are getting away with racism" as much as it is "Blacks are perpetuating the same kind of stereotypes that are used to insult and disparage them". Your naive, grossly inaccurate comments about Blacks are simply more of the same.
with all due respect, you sound like you are just being apolegetic and trying to excuse black-on-asian racism and victimisation. blacks do get a lot of leeway, especially in the media, when it comes to them being racist. it's simply politically incorrect in american society to even suggest that blacks can be racist.

yeah, white-on-black racism is pretty bad. but call me selfish, i'm more concerned with black-on-asian racism than white-on-black racism. hell, i'm probably more concerned with black-on-asian racism than white-on-asian racism. the fact that, for whatever reason, many blacks are perpetuating the stereotypes branded onto them certainly is one of the explanations for why they can be racist and discriminatory, but it's certainly no justification. sure, we should work on rooting out the cause of why some blacks may target asian people, but in my opinion, we need to first actually expose the fact that, yes, many black people victimise asian people and are racist toward asian people, because you know what, the white-washed media and certainly most black people don't believe that is even a possibility.

[wylin]

Originally posted by DaBestSpooner@Dec 31 2002, 01:52 PM
Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Dec 31 2002, 02:45 PM

The difference between White racism (against Asians or Blacks) is that it can result in the Asian or Black not getting a job, being raped, getting maimed or killed and then the White perpatrators getting away with it; whereas Black on Asian racism is mostly in the form of ignorant comments, nasty glances, etc. (not trying to justify it, just saying it's a lesser manifestation of hate). If a Black man beats up or kills an Asian man and gets caught? He's going to jail. And probably for a longer, harder sentence than if he were White. Yeah, there is a problem with Blacks not mixing with Asians. But you know what, a good deal of that is simply the result of two different cultures being stuffed into a small area; all through the history of New York, you have English vs. Irish immigrants, Irish vs. Italian, Italian vs. Puerto Rican, etc. And another part of it is racism being handed down by the majority culture (in this case, Whites) to minority cultures which are gaining economic and political power. In Westchester, where I grew up, my working class / middle class town is looked down upon by WASPs from Greenwich and upper Westchester - because it's mostly Italian. And the Italians (and other Whites) look down on the Blacks in the neighboring towns. Although I sympathize with the author of the article, and anyone who's been on the recieving end of racism, I think it's ignorant of her (and you) to not recognize the fact that the stereotypes and patterns of discrimination she encountered were not created by Blacks but handed down to them. The tragedy here is not "Blacks are getting away with racism" as much as it is "Blacks are perpetuating the same kind of stereotypes that are used to insult and disparage them". Your naive, grossly inaccurate comments about Blacks are simply more of the same.
what are you smoking?

You're from westchester county, dont you watch the local news?

-Black serial rapist targets asian women in the east village
-Valedictorian harrassed in brooklyn high schoool everyday because he's a model student
-Black kids kill a chinese delivery man with a brick because they thought it was fun.
-Jay-Z's former barber goes on a shooting rampage in the east village, attempts to set white folk on fire and shoots an elderly japanese man.
-Chinese killed while trying to stop a fight outside his liqour store, they stop fighting and ransack his store while he lays dying.
-Black mugger/rapist targeting japanese women in west harlem.
its time for the community stand up, and teach them bout respect. Maybe the community should either goto the police more or form a coalition for black and asian brotherhood. Or just face the eventual outcome of this type of racism asians moving away and trying not to live among blacks (as they do here in socal) and just letting the black communities become even more didapitated. That or lets make a yellow clan and fight for our rights, gangland style! Hit em w/ cars! GTA!

[Hiroshi2]

Let me just say that as a black/asian person, when I first read this article a year ago, it disturbed me highly. I know it exists; I've seen it myself; I've been the victim of racist asian comments from other black people before, so I know this isn't BS. Mind you, it was never quite as bad as what the woman in the article described, but similar nonetheless.

I do not condone this at all, the fact that some blacks would even try to justify it sickens me. Wrong is wrong, period.

I think I'll add on to this in a little bit.

[igcognito]

Black on asian racism, happens often a lot, because why should you attack the "stronger" when you can get the "weaker". Most blacks that live in the "inner-city" ("ghettos"), will choose a "weaker", which asians are percieved to be. Racism from Asians toward blacks, happens just as much. The music industry and entertainment, who owns those means of communication, it is SURELY not a black person. It is honestly not the fault of "50-Cent" that he is an easily marketable. You can't say that blacks are the cause of racism toward asians, in the music industry, when "Scott White" owns the label. And sports, I know this may sounds REALLY REALLY odd, during the slave trade, blacks were bout on certain aspects, strength and build. Now over the years, it has been thought that we have been "superhuman" (too an extent), it is honestly because of the work we were brought here to be put through. In Africa, blacks (not "Feed the Children" areas of Africa) are smaller and not as strong. Well, except for in small tribes of course.

Racism toward asians from blacks, I have seen it sometimes, and heard it also, "hey baby let me get some of that sucky sucky 2 dolla" and "cook me some of the chop-suey shit". I have heard that kind of stuff. I know it exist, and I sympathize with Asians, for having to deal with the ignorant of my race, but it come the same both sides

RACIAL HIEARCHY

->Whites --->blacks<--->Asians<--->Hispanics

Not in any specific order and white gets a shorter line, because they don't feel racism as much.

[Chi]

I dunno how it is with other asian ethnicitys but,

I think chinese in particular people are the most racist towards blacks... black people try to go eat at a chinese restaurant in chinatown and are greeted by dirty looks, and rude service... a white family eats in chinatown and they are greeted with an enthusiastic "Hello! Welcome!"... you guys know what i'm talking about.

And, countless times I hear chinese people calling blacks "hak guai's"... what's that about?

I grew up in the Fillmore/Western Addition in San Francisco... I grew up with black people, and pretty much all my friends growing up until high school were blacks. I couldn't make any chinese friends because they all looked down on me for hanging out with black people, and not being able to speak chinese fluently... but i could make friends fine, with other asians.

In my observations... blacks are among the most tolerant people. I even got a bunch of my friends, supposedly from the "ghetto"... 15 in all, to come with me to join a ymca kung fu club in San francisco chinatown... they loved it. Local rappers ( san quinn, sky baller) even ask me put some vocals down on their music... and many give me shout outs on CD covers... and im a pretty dorky guy too.

I think as long as you are cool with black people or any race, and don't prejudge, you'll be fine.

[Hiroshi2]

Originally posted by igcognito@Dec 31 2002, 05:16 PM
Black on asian racism, happens often a lot, because why should you attack the "stronger" when you can get the "weaker". Most blacks that live in the "inner-city" ("ghettos"), will choose a "weaker", which asians are percieved to be. Racism from Asians toward blacks, happens just as much. The music industry and entertainment, who owns those means of communication, it is SURELY not a black person. It is honestly not the fault of "50-Cent" that he is an easily marketable. You can't say that blacks are the cause of racism toward asians, in the music industry, when "Scott White" owns the label. And sports, I know this may sounds REALLY REALLY odd, during the slave trade, blacks were bout on certain aspects, strength and build. Now over the years, it has been thought that we have been "superhuman" (too an extent), it is honestly because of the work we were brought here to be put through. In Africa, blacks (not "Feed the Children" areas of Africa) are smaller and not as strong. Well, except for in small tribes of course.

Racism toward asians from blacks, I have seen it sometimes, and heard it also, "hey baby let me get some of that sucky sucky 2 dolla" and "cook me some of the chop-suey shit". I have heard that kind of stuff. I know it exist, and I sympathize with Asians, for having to deal with the ignorant of my race, but it come the same both sides

RACIAL HIEARCHY

->Whites --->blacks<--->Asians<--->Hispanics

Not in any specific order and white gets a shorter line, because they don't feel racism as much.
First of all, about the racial hierachy, here's my take on it:

WHITE----->ASIANS-->HISPANICS--->BLACKS/NATIVE AMERICANS

As for blacks in africa not being percieved as stong, that's not true i don't think. It goes back to the "mandingo" stereotype.

I realize that asians practice racism towards blacks as well. But i have to admit there is some truth in what is being said about blacks complaining about racism from whites but not addressing it's own racist beliefs and actions. i firmly believe in "an eye for an eye, what goes around comes around" and so on.

[DaBestSpooner]

Originally posted by Chi@Dec 31 2002, 08:41 PM
I dunno how it is with other asian ethnicitys but,

I think chinese in particular people are the most racist towards blacks... black people try to go eat at a chinese restaurant in chinatown and are greeted by dirty looks, and rude service... a white family eats in chinatown and they are greeted with an enthusiastic "Hello! Welcome!"... you guys know what i'm talking about.

And, countless times I hear chinese people calling blacks "hak guai's"... what's that about?

I grew up in the Fillmore/Western Addition in San Francisco... I grew up with black people, and pretty much all my friends growing up until high school were blacks. I couldn't make any chinese friends because they all looked down on me for hanging out with black people, and not being able to speak chinese fluently... but i could make friends fine, with other asians.

In my observations... blacks are among the most tolerant people. I even got a bunch of my friends, supposedly from the "ghetto"... 15 in all, to come with me to join a ymca kung fu club in San francisco chinatown... they loved it. Local rappers ( san quinn, sky baller) even ask me put some vocals down on their music... and many give me shout outs on CD covers... and im a pretty dorky guy too.

I think as long as you are cool with black people or any race, and don't prejudge, you'll be fine.
sounds like you're down with a bunch of backpackers.

[YuheiCarreau]

Originally posted by DaBestSpooner@Dec 31 2002, 03:52 PM
what are you smoking? &nbsp;

You're from westchester county, dont you watch the local news?

-Black serial rapist targets asian women in the east village
-Valedictorian harrassed in brooklyn high schoool everyday because he's a model student
-Black kids kill a chinese delivery man with a brick because they thought it was fun.
-Jay-Z's former barber goes on a shooting rampage in the east village, attempts to set white folk on fire and shoots an elderly japanese man.
-Chinese killed while trying to stop a fight outside his liqour store, they stop fighting and ransack his store while he lays dying.
-Black mugger/rapist targeting japanese women in west harlem.
My point is not that there is no such thing as Black-on-Asian racism; my point is that the severity of Black-on-Asian racism is not as great as White-on-Asian or White-on-Black racism, two issues the author dismisses as irrelevant. Making a list of Black-on-Asian crimes is pointless and one-sided; you make it sound as if Blacks are especially racist against Asians, when really anyone who commits an act of racism is being ignorant and hateful. I could point to a number of Asian-on-Black incidents, White-on-Asian incidents, Black-on-White incidents, etc. but does that make Asians or Whites or Blacks especially hateful towards Blacks or Asians or Whites? No. The only thing that changes the severity of an act of racism is the relative power the bully wields over his victim. The 'freedom' a Black person has to say "Ching chong chong" to an Asian is also held by Whites; the difference is, a White person can also say "Ching chong chong, I'm turning down your application for a loan!", which he can also say to a Black person - and get away with it (in both cases). Even in the most severe incidents of Black-on-Asian racism, a Black person is, on average, not in a position to make that comment to an Asian. He doesn't have that amount of power. Harassment of Asians by Blacks in most certainly a problem, but the author's assertion that those acts of racism are the real problem, and White-on-Minority racism is a myth, is bullshit. She then goes on to compare Blacks to Nazis, despite the fact that Blacks are not in a position of cultural, economic, and legislative superiority in the US (even relative to Asians) as the Nazis were in Germany; her prejudices seem quite clear to me.

I am not apologizing for Black-on-Asian racism. I am not saying that Blacks do not commit hate crimes. I am not criticizing this woman's article because I think this problem does not exist. I am criticizing it because she's only attacking Blacks for being racist - she's not attacking Whites for being racist (towards Asians or Blacks), she's not mentioning Asian prejudices against Blacks, and she isn't promoting any kind of solution to the problem. She is completely ignoring the full hierarchy of racism in this country and boiling a very complex issue down to two points: "Black people say they aren't racist, but in fact they're doing more damage than Whites people" - how Blacks are capable of routinely denying Asians jobs and subverting the justice system the way Whites do when interacting with both Asians and Blacks is never explained - and "hey, those bougie assholes that are fighting White-on-Asian racism should start targeting Blacks!". Her article is poorly written and she backs up her claims with anecdotal evidence. Do I think there's a problem between Blacks and Asians living in low-income areas, especially those with a lot of immigrant Asians? Yes. Is there a problem with AA leaders being from middle class, mostly White suburbs and not interacting these immigrants and poorer Asians? Yes, but the author doesn't do much more than whine about this fact, does she? Do many Black leaders deny the possibility of Black-perpatrated racism? Yes. But are Blacks, as a group, capable of doing more damage to Asians than Whites? No. And more importantly; as the person calling attention to this friction between two minorities, is the author trying to help Asians understand Blacks, help Blacks understand Asians, or do anything but blame Blacks and only Blacks for this problem? No.

The author has identified a number of real problems, between both Blacks and Asians and between AA activists and the community they're supposed to represent; but her shallow analysis of the situation turns my stomach, and I'm not going to stand behind all of her words just because I can identify with some of them.

[deez nuts]

Wow I liked to live in both your worlds.

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Jan 1 2003, 03:59 AM
Originally posted by DaBestSpooner@Dec 31 2002, 03:52 PM
what are you smoking?

You're from westchester county, dont you watch the local news?

-Black serial rapist targets asian women in the east village
-Valedictorian harrassed in brooklyn high schoool everyday because he's a model student
-Black kids kill a chinese delivery man with a brick because they thought it was fun.
-Jay-Z's former barber goes on a shooting rampage in the east village, attempts to set white folk on fire and shoots an elderly japanese man.
-Chinese killed while trying to stop a fight outside his liqour store, they stop fighting and ransack his store while he lays dying.
-Black mugger/rapist targeting japanese women in west harlem.
My point is not that there is no such thing as Black-on-Asian racism; my point is that the severity of Black-on-Asian racism is not as great as White-on-Asian or White-on-Black racism, two issues the author dismisses as irrelevant. Making a list of Black-on-Asian crimes is pointless and one-sided; you make it sound as if Blacks are especially racist against Asians, when really anyone who commits an act of racism is being ignorant and hateful. I could point to a number of Asian-on-Black incidents, White-on-Asian incidents, Black-on-White incidents, etc. but does that make Asians or Whites or Blacks especially hateful towards Blacks or Asians or Whites? No. The only thing that changes the severity of an act of racism is the relative power the bully wields over his victim. The 'freedom' a Black person has to say "Ching chong chong" to an Asian is also held by Whites; the difference is, a White person can also say "Ching chong chong, I'm turning down your application for a loan!", which he can also say to a Black person - and get away with it (in both cases). Even in the most severe incidents of Black-on-Asian racism, a Black person is, on average, not in a position to make that comment to an Asian. He doesn't have that amount of power. Harassment of Asians by Blacks in most certainly a problem, but the author's assertion that those acts of racism are the real problem, and White-on-Minority racism is a myth, is bullshit. She then goes on to compare Blacks to Nazis, despite the fact that Blacks are not in a position of cultural, economic, and legislative superiority in the US (even relative to Asians) as the Nazis were in Germany; her prejudices seem quite clear to me.

I am not apologizing for Black-on-Asian racism. I am not saying that Blacks do not commit hate crimes. I am not criticizing this woman's article because I think this problem does not exist. I am criticizing it because she's only attacking Blacks for being racist - she's not attacking Whites for being racist (towards Asians or Blacks), she's not mentioning Asian prejudices against Blacks, and she isn't promoting any kind of solution to the problem. She is completely ignoring the full hierarchy of racism in this country and boiling a very complex issue down to two points: "Black people say they aren't racist, but in fact they're doing more damage than Whites people" - how Blacks are capable of routinely denying Asians jobs and subverting the justice system the way Whites do when interacting with both Asians and Blacks is never explained - and "hey, those bougie assholes that are fighting White-on-Asian racism should start targeting Blacks!". Her article is poorly written and she backs up her claims with anecdotal evidence. Do I think there's a problem between Blacks and Asians living in low-income areas, especially those with a lot of immigrant Asians? Yes. Is there a problem with AA leaders being from middle class, mostly White suburbs and not interacting these immigrants and poorer Asians? Yes, but the author doesn't do much more than whine about this fact, does she? Do many Black leaders deny the possibility of Black-perpatrated racism? Yes. But are Blacks, as a group, capable of doing more damage to Asians than Whites? No. And more importantly; as the person calling attention to this friction between two minorities, is the author trying to help Asians understand Blacks, help Blacks understand Asians, or do anything but blame Blacks and only Blacks for this problem? No.

The author has identified a number of real problems, between both Blacks and Asians and between AA activists and the community they're supposed to represent; but her shallow analysis of the situation turns my stomach, and I'm not going to stand behind all of her words just because I can identify with some of them.
i understand what you're saying, but seriously that's a pretty naive view of things.

and the author was never out to write an article about racism. her whole entire point was to write about black-on-asian racism, and how that is an unacknowledged problem. everybody knows that white-on-black racism exists, and probably even asian-on-black racism. but nobody ever talks about black-on-asian racism, even though that is the everyday reality of many asian people living in urban areas - and the point of her article, in case you didn't notice, was to talk about that. i don't feel that she must talk about racism in all its forms and entirety in order to talk about a specific kind of racism.

is she attacking blacks for being racist? sure it could certainly be interpretted it that way. and here's what i'll say about that - so what? it's the truth. i don't feel that she must also attack everybody else for being racist in order to validate her point. she is more concerned with protecting asian people than everybody else - and i feel the same.

[Green_Circle]

OK, let's just say that we all live in the projects or deep in the hood. It's acknowledged that there is crime and harassment perpetrated upon us by the Blacks. So what now? How should we tackle/approach this problem? It's clear to me that if the crime were of an economic nature, that is ripping off your money, valuables, new sneakers, new coat(Christmas presents), these crimes aren't clearly defineable as racist. It's may be more like you got, I want. Unless of course you are clearly targeted as an easy victim. I know in the big picture, we are all in the same boat to a degree. Meanwhile how can I keep my brand new AIR FORCE 1's ??

:frown:

[YuheiCarreau]

Originally posted by SunWuKung@Jan 1 2003, 09:59 AM
i understand what you're saying, but seriously that's a pretty naive view of things.

and the author was never out to write an article about racism. her whole entire point was to write about black-on-asian racism, and how that is an unacknowledged problem. everybody knows that white-on-black racism exists, and probably even asian-on-black racism. but nobody ever talks about black-on-asian racism, even though that is the everyday reality of many asian people living in urban areas - and the point of her article, in case you didn't notice, was to talk about that. i don't feel that she must talk about racism in all its forms and entirety in order to talk about a specific kind of racism.

is she attacking blacks for being racist? sure it could certainly be interpretted it that way. and here's what i'll say about that - so what? it's the truth. i don't feel that she must also attack everybody else for being racist in order to validate her point. she is more concerned with protecting asian people than everybody else - and i feel the same.
I don't understand what you mean. It's naive of me to think this woman is racist, when she makes a number of biased and inaccurate comments in her article? I don't care that she's talking about "the hate that dare not speak its name"; she's going about it in the wrong way. Black civil rights leaders didn't accomplish their work by sitting around telling stories, saying "One time I saw a White guy call a black lady nigger when I was riding the bus"; they went to Whites, sat in their stores and their bus seats, and said "You cannot treat us this way. We cannot live as two segregated populations when we both occupy the same nation". They showed their suffering to Whites, and showed them that they would not tolerate that treatment anymore. This woman is not attempting to tell Blacks her problems with the way they treat her and she's not offering any solutions to the problem; she's just whining and stirring up resentment. That was the point of her article. I do not see a single positive remark in that entire piece; do you? If the problem is that no one is talking about Black-on-Asian racism, why don't you talk about it? Or would you rather this woman do all the talking for you - because I certainly don't want that. Supporting Asian issues over Black issues makes perfect sense, but you're the naive one if you think Black-on-Asian racism will go away without Asians and Blacks working together.

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Posted on Jan 1 2003, 01:06 PM
I don't understand what you mean. It's naive of me to think this woman is racist, when she makes a number of biased and inaccurate comments in her article?

i say your opinions are naive because you pretty much ignore the fact that black racists are responsible for their own actions, that while they may feel inclined to be racist, nobody is forcing them to be racist.

how do you think the author's comments are inaccurate and biased?


Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Posted on Jan 1 2003, 01:06 PM
Black civil rights leaders didn't accomplish their work by sitting around telling stories, saying "One time I saw a White guy call a black lady nigger when I was riding the bus"; they went to Whites, sat in their stores and their bus seats, and said "You cannot treat us this way. We cannot live as two segregated populations when we both occupy the same nation". They showed their suffering to Whites, and showed them that they would not tolerate that treatment anymore.

the difference between what civil rights leaders did and what anybody talking about racism does today is that civil rights leaders were trying to do away with racist laws, but there are hardly any laws that can be considered racist today. you've made a grossly inaccurate comparison if you want to compare the work of civil rights leaders and writers who simply want to bring to light problems that mainstream american society deems to be non-existent or wants to ignore.


Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Posted on Jan 1 2003, 01:06 PM
This woman is not attempting to tell Blacks her problems with the way they treat her and she's not offering any solutions to the problem; she's just whining and stirring up resentment. That was the point of her article.

yeah isn't that a kick in the nuts? that's probably the same thing that record executives were thinking when they refused to put Billie Holiday's Strange Fruit on a record. it's a song about lynching.


Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Posted on Jan 1 2003, 01:06 PM
I do not see a single positive remark in that entire piece; do you? If the problem is that no one is talking about Black-on-Asian racism, why don't you talk about it? Or would you rather this woman do all the talking for you - because I certainly don't want that.

browse through some old posts. this is not the first time i've talked about this problem on YW. i've also posted on other boards about this. and if i was a writer, i'd write about it too.


Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Posted on Jan 1 2003, 01:06 PM
Supporting Asian issues over Black issues makes perfect sense, but you're the naive one if you think Black-on-Asian racism will go away without Asians and Blacks working together.

have i ever said that this is what i think? if so then please quote me.

[rakovlam]

So far you blamed white people for all the problems in society. Now, without getting into way back in history, I like to know any actual white on minority racism recently. Now, don't be stupid and tell me that "whitey is causing me to do this this this and this". How about a little responsibility from "the victims of white society". For every case you give me, I can give you three.

[angel nympho]

How about everybody just get over themselves and quit blaming everybody else. Point is, racism exists, and unless people stop pointing fingers and start TRYING TO GET OVER IT, nothing's ever going to change.

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by angel nympho@Jan 1 2003, 05:03 PM
How about everybody just get over themselves and quit blaming everybody else. Point is, racism exists, and unless people stop pointing fingers and start TRYING TO GET OVER IT, nothing's ever going to change.
that would imply that the people at the top of the "racial hierarchy" - white people, are not racist (generalisation of course), but that is not true.

[DaBestSpooner]

I love white people! :)

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by DaBestSpooner@Jan 1 2003, 06:29 PM
I love white people! :)
:lol:

http://www.blackpeopleloveus.com/

[YuheiCarreau]

Originally posted by SunWuKung@Jan 1 2003, 12:44 PM
i say your opinions are naive because you pretty much ignore the fact that black racists are responsible for their own actions, that while they may feel inclined to be racist, nobody is forcing them to be racist.

how do you think the author's comments are inaccurate and biased?


the difference between what civil rights leaders did and what anybody talking about racism does today is that civil rights leaders were trying to do away with racist laws, but there are hardly any laws that can be considered racist today. you've made a grossly inaccurate comparison if you want to compare the work of civil rights leaders and writers who simply want to bring to light problems that mainstream american society deems to be non-existent or wants to ignore.


yeah isn't that a kick in the nuts? that's probably the same thing that record executives were thinking when they refused to put Billie Holiday's Strange Fruit on a record. it's a song about lynching.


browse through some old posts. this is not the first time i've talked about this problem on YW. i've also posted on other boards about this. and if i was a writer, i'd write about it too.


have i ever said that this is what i think? if so then please quote me.
If I ever gave the impression that I think Black racists should be excused for their actions, I'm sorry. I do believe that individuals are responsible for acts of racism they commit - I just don't believ you can blame an entire group for being racist or you can say racism is somehow inherent to that group. I think the author making comments like "In what passes for discussions on race these days, small problems are often blown up large, while real traumas are completely ignored... the very rawest racial conflicts in present-day America don’t even fit into the tidy mold of white-majority-oppressing-colored-minority that activists constantly promote." sounds like she's saying White racism is less powerful than Black racism. The first five paragraphs of this article are all anecdotes about the author's experiences with Black-on-Asian racism; which is fair enough, but where the hell are the police reports? The statistics? The hard data showing that Black-on-Asian racism is a significant problem compared to all other forms of anti-Asian racism (I do believe Black-on-Asian racism is a significant problem, by the way, I just don't thing the author properly establishes her case)? The facts that this woman has suffered unjustly and that she's talking about a very real problem do not change the fact that she's using secondhand stories and generalizations to make her point; rather than point to specific incidences of racism where there is a clear record of what happened, she mentions general experiences and never names a specific victim or a specific bully. To me that sounds like she's painting all Asians as innocent victims and all Blacks as bullies. Saying "The excuse of economic disparities fails miserably to justify violence and harassment, however. For some observers, it also brings up memories of Nazi persecution of Jews" sounds pretty damn vindictive to me. It's not you or the idea of Black-on-Asian racism that I'm disagreeing with; there's just something about this woman's writing that really gets my hackles up. It bothers me that she tosses in " Recognizing the complex issues between blacks and Asians, Philip Nguyen of the Southeast Asian Community Center has a simple proposal: "Fight, not against or for any group, but against racial discrimination."" at the end, when the whole rest of her article has not been about fighting discrimination, but about fighting Blacks specifically and their power to say "We suffer from racism, therefor we cannot be racist".

[rakovlam]

Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Jan 1 2003, 11:02 PM

have i ever said that this is what i think? if so then please quote me.
If I ever gave the impression that I think Black racists should be excused for their actions, I'm sorry. I do believe that individuals are responsible for acts of racism they commit - I just don't believ you can blame an entire group for being racist or you can say racism is somehow inherent to that group. I think the author making comments like "In what passes for discussions on race these days, small problems are often blown up large, while real traumas are completely ignored... the very rawest racial conflicts in present-day America don’t even fit into the tidy mold of white-majority-oppressing-colored-minority that activists constantly promote." sounds like she's saying White racism is less powerful than Black racism. The first five paragraphs of this article are all anecdotes about the author's experiences with Black-on-Asian racism; which is fair enough, but where the hell are the police reports? The statistics? The hard data showing that Black-on-Asian racism is a significant problem compared to all other forms of anti-Asian racism (I do believe Black-on-Asian racism is a significant problem, by the way, I just don't thing the author properly establishes her case)? The facts that this woman has suffered unjustly and that she's talking about a very real problem do not change the fact that she's using secondhand stories and generalizations to make her point; rather than point to specific incidences of racism where there is a clear record of what happened, she mentions general experiences and never names a specific victim or a specific bully. To me that sounds like she's painting all Asians as innocent victims and all Blacks as bullies. Saying "The excuse of economic disparities fails miserably to justify violence and harassment, however. For some observers, it also brings up memories of Nazi persecution of Jews" sounds pretty damn vindictive to me. It's not you or the idea of Black-on-Asian racism that I'm disagreeing with; there's just something about this woman's writing that really gets my hackles up. It bothers me that she tosses in " Recognizing the complex issues between blacks and Asians, Philip Nguyen of the Southeast Asian Community Center has a simple proposal: "Fight, not against or for any group, but against racial discrimination."" at the end, when the whole rest of her article has not been about fighting discrimination, but about fighting Blacks specifically and their power to say "We suffer from racism, therefor we cannot be racist".[/quote]
It's a friggin individual account. Are you trying to say that black people hurl insults at her or physically abuse her because of something she or her people did that caused the resentment? She was an easy target because she was an immigrant from a very foreign place and people are stuck to the notion that race is identity. If all her life every black person she meets ends up hurling racial slurs and objects at her, it's hard to believe that blacks could be tolerant towards her. If it wasn't a Muslim friend of mine, I could conclude that Muslims are either blowing something up (or planning) or whining about being oppress by the the Jews or US government. Technically, Islam is peaceful religion.

This reminds me of a story by a columnist in Norway. It seems that Norwegian women are raped mostly by foreign immigrants. This Norway's case, it was entirely Muslim men. This columnist emphasized that we live in a "multicultural society". There the women being raped by foreigner must "understand" their culture as if Sharia (Islamic law enforced in certain countries and parts of countries) is the moral equivalent of the 19th amendment (women's suffrage).

Like I said, what exactly do you guys mean by white racism today? Want to give me some current examples?

[DaBestSpooner]

Originally posted by rakovlam@Jan 1 2003, 10:55 PM


Like I said, what exactly do you guys mean by white racism today? Want to give me some current examples?
After I got robbed by gunpoint by some random blackguy accross the street from my office last september, my white supremecist millionaire ceo and one of the white honkey cracka opressionist members of the board of directors, came to me after I came back from filing a police report to offer me a few days off and a to file an expense report for the money I lost. Racist bastards!

[igcognito]

Uhh I didn't deny it. Derf, I just don't see it. In the group I hang with, I hear of it though.

[DaBestSpooner]

Originally posted by KuroBishounen@Jan 3 2003, 07:52 AM
Instead of pointing the finger, why don't we try to find some way to break down the barriers and have the Asian/Asian-American and African-American community get to understand one another?

There's isnt really much to understand about each other. we just want to be left alone, goto work, earn our keep, go home to our families in one piece. why do we have to put up with this bullshit at all?

[igcognito]

Blacks, can be racist towards whites, asians and hispanics. But like Chi said through my growing up, it has always been whites, asian and hispanics. Who have been pre-judging blacks. I have heard of some racism from blacks, to asians. But I see, racism towards blacks from all other groups. I know this sounds wrong, but who do you think will be more excepting, a black family of a asian in-law, or an asian family of a black in-law?

[igcognito]

because you have to understand everyone. Best example in Ohio, is a little black girl was called "dirty", because she does not was her hair everyday. If she did her hair will fall out. Now that is 100% ignorance on the other kids sides, due to their parents, not teaching them. Parma is one of the top racist cities in the US. It is pretty bad, there.

[DaBestSpooner]

Originally posted by KuroBishounen@Jan 3 2003, 09:09 AM
Originally posted by DaBestSpooner@Jan 3 2003, 02:03 PM
Originally posted by KuroBishounen@Jan 3 2003, 07:52 AM
Instead of pointing the finger, why don't we try to find some way to break down the barriers and have the Asian/Asian-American and African-American community get to understand one another?

There's isnt really much to understand about each other. we just want to be left alone, goto work, earn our keep, go home to our families in one piece. why do we have to put up with this bullshit at all?
Cool with me....

That sounds like everyone else in this country...(earn their keep, be left alone, etc...)

Why should we (Blacks)have to put up with bullshit?

If no one wants to learn about one another why is there a fuss?

I'm not holding you back from earning your keep...

Yet, I'm wondering why you're holding all Blacks responsible for "a small minority" of idiots...
I guess new york city is where the majority of the "minority" are.

[blkazngirl]

I don't like it, but it does exist. My siblings and I were taught not to hate because of the color of someone's skin, hate the dumb thinking that's on the inside.

As a kid it really hurt me when someone Black would say mean things about my Asian half and vice a versa. All I could think is how can you say that when I'm just like you.

[SunWuKong]

hey i'm not about to treat a black person in my work place or in my social circles differently. i don't hate any black people and definitely not black people as a whole. i also know that it's only a small minority of black people that victimise asian people. but as experiences would dictate, since my relatives have been repeatedly victimised by black people, i'm definitely going to be more careful if i come across random black guys on the streets. many asian people who grew up in the city have this similar experiences with black people as the author of the article above. i'm not going to treat them like criminals and i'm not going to harass them. hell black dudes keep bumming cigarettes from me in chinatown DC and i always give them out. but would i be more careful around random black dude as opposed to random non-black dude? sorry to say, the answer is yes.

[igcognito]

There will always be victimization of a group, racism is color blind. It will happen to you know matter who you are. You are taught to be racist and don't even know it. My friends and I can sit and watch TV and point out nearly every stereotype. Though we see it will still enjoy TV. I know blacks are racist towards, asian I just suppose the "groups" I hang with know better. I understand where sunwukung is saying, you have to feel people. I don't care who you are, but if you look threatening I am staying away from you.

[deez nuts]

Originally posted by KuroBishounen@Jan 3 2003, 07:37 PM

You New Yorkers have some issues....(Black, Asian, what have you)... :P
Yeah we need to ship Al Sharpton in a box to you Cali/west coast folks.

[BeTheReds]

I most certainly agree with this article. I may only be speaking because I had to deal with some of the same problems when I was growing up, and going to a High School that was more black than anything else (40% black) I and my white and Asian friends were victims of black-originated acts of racism all the time. I think hwever that the only reason anyone printed this article is because the author is Asian. Had she been white, the world would condemn her as a racist.

[RiceDaddy7]

Originally posted by SunWuKung@Dec 30 2002, 09:51 PM
this is an old article that i found about black-on-asian racism.

http://www.theamericanenterprise.org/taend98c.htm


Black Racism
The hate that dare not speak its name

In what passes for discussions on race these days, small problems are often blown up large, while real traumas are completely ignored. For instance, despite what President Clinton’s "Race Initiative" panel has said, the very rawest racial conflicts in present-day America don’t even fit into the tidy mold of white-majority-oppressing-colored-minority that activists constantly promote. Though civil rights groups and most of the media studiously ignore this fact, the nation’s most fractious racial battles are now conflicts between minority populations. Particularly horrific is the animosity directed at Asian Americans by blacks in low-income areas of urban America.

At age ten, I immigrated from China to Oakland, California, a city filled with crime, poverty, and racial tension. In elementary school, I didn’t wear name-brand clothing or speak English. My name soon became "Ching Chong," "Chinagirl," and "Chow Mein." Other children laughed at my language, my culture, my ethnicity, and my race. I said nothing.

After a few years, I began to speak English, but not well enough to trade racial insults. On rides home from school I avoided the back of the bus so as not to be beaten up. But even when I sat in the front, fire crackers, paper balls, small rocks, and profanity were thrown at me and the other "stupid Chinamen." The label "Chinamen" was dished out indiscriminately to Vietnamese, Koreans, and other Asians. When I looked around, I saw that the other "Chinamen" tuned out the insults by eagerly discussing movies, friends, and school.

During my secondary school years, racism, and then the combination of outrage and bitterness that it fosters, accompanied me home on the bus every day. My English was by now more fluent than that of those who insulted me, but most of the time I still said nothing to avoid being beaten up. In addition to everything else thrown at me, a few times a week I was the target of sexual remarks vulgar enough to make Howard Stern blush. When I did respond to the insults, I immediately faced physical threats or attacks, along with the embarrassing fact that the other "Chinamen" around me simply continued their quiet personal conversations without intervening. The reality was that those who cursed my race and ethnicity were far bigger in size than most of the Asian children who sat silently.

The racial harassment wasn’t limited to bus rides. It surfaced in my high school cafeteria, where a middle-aged Chinese vendor who spoke broken English was told by rowdy students each day at lunch time to "Hurry up, you dumb Ching!" On the sidewalks, black teenagers and adults would creep up behind 80-year-old Asians and frighten them with sing-song nonsense: "Yee-ya, Ching-chong, ah-ee, un-yahhh!" At markets and in the streets of poor black neighborhoods, Asians would be told, "Why the hell don’t you just go back to where you came from!"

When it came time for college, I left this ugly world for a beautiful school far away. Finally, it was possible to pursue a life without racial harassment backed by the threat of violence. I chose not to return to my old neighborhood after college, but I am often reminded of the racial discrimination I endured there. On a bus not too long ago I saw a black woman curse at a Korean man, "You f---ing Chinese person! Didn’t you hear that I asked you to move yo’ ass? You too stupid to understand English or something?"
Okay, I didn't read the rest of replies, 'cause of lack of time...

So just gonna reply to the main topic.

SunWuKang,

A lot of Asians went through what you went through. The reality of the situation is that a lot of black kids in America are not well educated or their parents were not well-educated. A lot of their parents grew up being racially attacked themselves in the 50's and 60's, and thus, they became racist toward others...this type of thinking was spread back to their kids. You have to understand that these kids are just kids, and that they know no better. They think what they do is right, even though it is wrong. Perhaps if they were taught better, they would think twice for their actions. I am sure most of those black kids making fun of you are now grown up and would probably shake your hand today. I can't say, I don't know them, but I think you should forgive them and let go because they didn't know right from wrong. Hey, kids are kids. Ignorant adults are ignorant adults.

The next generation and current generation of black adults who have grown up in the 80's and 90's seem to be different. A lot of black kids I see ( not all, but depends on areas ) are really nice. I have a 11 year old cousin with a lot of black friends in her school. They treat her very well. This is just one of many experiences I've seen presently that the US has been better. Perhaps a few generations later, this type of stuff will be completely eliminated, but it's unfortunate what you experience, we all have experienced it, it's easy to be mad...yet the right thing to do is just turn the other cheek, don't let this stuff affect your outlook towards black ( hopefully, it doesn't turn you into a racist ), and just learn to love them.

For instance, I remember I was sitting in a eyedoctor's office and a little black kid did the eye thing. Instead of whipping his ass or ignoring him, I turned around and calmly said hi. It really shocked the kid. He got a little scared of me at first, but then later opened up. We talked about various general things, and at the end of the conversation I said " Oh yeah, don't do that, okay? It's not right ". I don't know if it affected the kid, because I never saw him again, but I felt because I attempted to open up and comminicate, it eliminated that line that said " I'm Asian, you're black " and just put us two as human beings talking to each other.

Don't wait for others to change. Break the barrier yourself.

Take care,
RiceDaddy7 - Administrator of www.shinraonline.com

[RiceDaddy7]

Oh sorry. Someone else wrote it. Didn't know. Well...same applies to the author then.

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by RiceDaddy7@Jan 8 2003, 02:25 PM
For instance, I remember I was sitting in a eyedoctor's office and a little black kid did the eye thing. Instead of whipping his ass or ignoring him, I turned around and calmly said hi. It really shocked the kid. He got a little scared of me at first, but then later opened up. We talked about various general things, and at the end of the conversation I said " Oh yeah, don't do that, okay? It's not right ". I don't know if it affected the kid, because I never saw him again, but I felt because I attempted to open up and comminicate, it eliminated that line that said " I'm Asian, you're black " and just put us two as human beings talking to each other.
good point.

how would you handle a black crowd yelling "chink" and other asian racial slurs and then laughing when you go watch Rush Hour in the theater?

yeah i brush it off. but hey, it happens. most blacks aren't racist like that, but many still are.

[RiceDaddy7]

Depends on the age...depends on the age.

The last thing they expect is for you to keep your cool and eliminate that line. They'll expect you to run in fear or ignore them. Just smile and say a joke. You'll teach them something that day: grace and forgiveness.

Also, I mean, it's not just black people doing it. If you were black and you lived in, say, Hong Kong, I'm sure kids would make fun of you too. It's just human nature.

[deez nuts]

RD7..You need to bring your l33t peace keeping skillz to NYC!

[RiceDaddy7]

" Non-violence non-violence non-violence " ~ Martin Luther King

::drinks beer::

[RiceDaddy7]

That was a good movie. Loved that Bill the Butcher character.

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by RiceDaddy7@Jan 8 2003, 02:46 PM
Depends on the age...depends on the age.

The last thing they expect is for you to keep your cool and eliminate that line. They'll expect you to run in fear or ignore them. Just smile and say a joke. You'll teach them something that day: grace and forgiveness.

Also, I mean, it's not just black people doing it. If you were black and you lived in, say, Hong Kong, I'm sure kids would make fun of you too. It's just human nature.
no actually, i've lived in HK.
yeah many people in HK are racist. but hardly any of the locals would throw racial slurs out in public - like for example in the theaters.
HK media handles racism even worse than US media, but that's another topic altogether. :P
and yeah i agree with the age thing. but i don't agree that they'll really learn anything about "grace and forgiveness", especially if they're at least in their teenage years. you'll probably just end up encouraging them to continue with their behavior by showing acceptance of their actions.

[ronin]

Some of it is societal (like how black youth despise education), some of it is economics/envy (like seeing your parents struggle with bills while a 22-yr old asian buys the house next door with a type-r), and some of it is actual racism toward black people by older asians who try to pass it to their kids (mostly chinese against black from what i've seen). Not to mention that every asian male/youngsta I know (except one) has done something illegal. And when they do something wrong or offend you in any way, it's easy to get mad and form stereotypes about the whole culture.

From what I've experienced, black people don't learn the difference between the different asian cultures (cambodian, viet, mien, etc.) until after they've gotten a little older. by then, blacks usually have a circle of black friends, the chinese hang with chinese, vietnamese hang with vietnamese, etc. And usually people attack what they don't understand.

I have quite a few asian friends now, but my acceptance in the asian in asian community might have been greater if I had formed real friendships with the asians I went to elementary school with, especially since oakland seem to separate the asians (o-high), from the mexicans (fremont), from the white (skyline/montclair), etc. I'm sure there were japanese kids in oakland but i never saw them at fremont or castlemont (at least it used to be that way). I used to not know the difference between wong, saechao, nguyen, or jung. It's sad when people aren't even open to learning.

[RiceDaddy7]

Originally posted by SunWuKung@Jan 8 2003, 12:02 PM
Originally posted by RiceDaddy7@Jan 8 2003, 02:46 PM
Depends on the age...depends on the age.

The last thing they expect is for you to keep your cool and eliminate that line. They'll expect you to run in fear or ignore them. Just smile and say a joke. You'll teach them something that day: grace and forgiveness.

Also, I mean, it's not just black people doing it. If you were black and you lived in, say, Hong Kong, I'm sure kids would make fun of you too. It's just human nature.
no actually, i've lived in HK.
yeah many people in HK are racist. but hardly any of the locals would throw racial slurs out in public - like for example in the theaters.
HK media handles racism even worse than US media, but that's another topic altogether. :P
and yeah i agree with the age thing. but i don't agree that they'll really learn anything about "grace and forgiveness", especially if they're at least in their teenage years. you'll probably just end up encouraging them to continue with their behavior by showing acceptance of their actions.
I'm Cantonese myself, so while I haven't seen any violence in theaters, there is a lot of outlash. Have you seen 5 Cantonese guys verbally abusing a black person in a basketball court? I have in Hong Kong. But this is merely an example, the bigger picture I was trying to say is that people who grew up in one environment, doesn't matter where in the world, and are associated with people with the same race tend to be intolerant of differences. Keyword is differences. If it's not race it's religion, if it's not religion, it's cultural difference, if it's not cultural differences it's handicap or financial status. It's always going to be something.

About grace and forgiveness, I don't believe fighting fire with fire is the answer. I'm simpily saying if a bunch of black kids make sounds at you, don't let it stop you from being their friend even if it means demeaning yourself. Maybe they raised thinking that Asian people don't like them. Maybe they were raised thinking Asians get scared and run. Standing firm and keeping cool is the best form of courage. It's called passive resistance. The problem most Asians do is that they walk away and ignore the problem. That's bad. If someone treats you poorly, continue holding on to yourself and talk to them. Break that ice...they will see the light and error of their ways. Maybe not instantly, maybe not for a long time, but they will.

The only way you'll encourage their actions is by walking away scared or fighting them. The middle-road is the best road.

[RiceDaddy7]

Originally posted by ronin@Jan 8 2003, 12:56 PM
Some of it is societal (like how black youth despise education), some of it is economics/envy (like seeing your parents struggle with bills while a 22-yr old asian buys the house next door with a type-r), and some of it is actual racism toward black people by older asians who try to pass it to their kids (mostly chinese against black from what i've seen). Not to mention that every asian male/youngsta I know (except one) has done something illegal. And when they do something wrong or offend you in any way, it's easy to get mad and form stereotypes about the whole culture.

From what I've experienced, black people don't learn the difference between the different asian cultures (cambodian, viet, mien, etc.) until after they've gotten a little older. by then, blacks usually have a circle of black friends, the chinese hang with chinese, vietnamese hang with vietnamese, etc. And usually people attack what they don't understand.

I have quite a few asian friends now, but my acceptance in the asian in asian community might have been greater if I had formed real friendships with the asians I went to elementary school with, especially since oakland seem to separate the asians (o-high), from the mexicans (fremont), from the white (skyline/montclair), etc. I'm sure there were japanese kids in oakland but i never saw them at fremont or castlemont (at least it used to be that way). I used to not know the difference between wong, saechao, nguyen, or jung. It's sad when people aren't even open to learning.
This will be over in time. Things will get better...you have to understand that the current black culture is still fairly new. They were given equal citizenship only 40 years ago, and 40 years is not a long time, people. Give this country another half decade and you're going to see racial lines completely disappear.

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by RiceDaddy7@Jan 8 2003, 04:49 PM
Maybe they raised thinking that Asian people don't like them. Maybe they were raised thinking Asians get scared and run.
or maybe they're just ignorant assholes who don't give a shit?

hey and again, i am well aware that there are racists in every race. it just seems to me that people ignore racism and discrimination coming from blacks.

[RiceDaddy7]

Ignore? I just don't think people report them.

[Hiroshi2]

I wish some of you would stop trying to justify it. Sometimes people ought to be held accountable for their actions. Normally, I'd be the last person that would try *not* to provide an explaination, as opposed to pointing fingers, but this is a problem. I've experienced it myself and have seen it myself. Like I said, when I first read this article, I knew exactly what the girl was talking about, I could relate to it, and it disgusts me.

[Chi]

Damn, RD7... you're good!