Offensive Amex TV ad- Chinese sell baby girls

[syen]

Did you all see the ad by American Express last night about a caucasian couple using their Amex miles to fly to China to pick up their just born baby girl?

I found the ad offensive. It seemed to imply that the Chinese are selling their baby girls. It's one thing to save a girl from an orphanage, quite another to pick her up right after birth from her mom using your Amex.

i wrote a letter to amex using
http://www.planetfeedback.com/

here is the gist of it
---

Dear American Express

On 12/18/02, I saw your new advertisement regarding membership miles and using them to buy a ticket to China to pickup an adopted girl.

This advertisement is offensive to people of Asian descent. It implies that the Chinese are selling their baby girls and that American Express wants to facilitate this.

Whichever advertising company created this commerical should be publicly denounced as tasteless.

What you can do: A cessation of the commercial and a public apology is in order. Perhaps also a donation to mental health services for Asian adoptees would be a good gesture.

Thank you for your time. I look forward to your response and will be sure to share this concern with my family, my friends, the media, and the Asian-American community.

[Commando_turned_MD]

You are over analyzing this commerical........What if the roles were reverse? What if the American couple flew to Germany, Czech, or Russia instead? What if the American couple flew to a different state, e.g. California, to pick up their new baby..Would you say all Cali sell their babies.....Nope

Maybe the Chinese couple made arrangement w/ the American couple because they believe it is in the best interest of the baby...... There are other arguments that could be made regarding this issue;all in favor of the producer of this commerical

Stop trying to make everything into a political issue :P ......It's a commerical.....

:blink: :blink: :blink: :ph34r:

My .02

[tapestrybabe]

yeah, of course...
its typical that the commercial would have a caucasian couple adopting an asian baby tho! Not that i'm against inter racial adoption... but why can't they show an asian american couple adopting an asian baby instead??

[Chris]

I have slight mixed feeling about this. From one point of view. There are too many baby girls being abandoned and killed because no one wants girls under the one child rule. Families and couples that want to adopt them to give them a better life should all means do it. Other point that maybe an asian american couple would have been better. But don't overanalayze things. Nothing compares to the love a child will get with their new families. THAT is the main point that is most important.

[SunWuKong]

is the commercial online? i'd like to see it first.
and i have absolutely nothing against adopting baby girls from china. i might do that myself when/if i get married.

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by tazadar@Dec 20 2002, 11:30 AM
If they commercialize adoption of Russian babies, some Russians probably would have a few words about it too. It's like there aren't orphaned children in the United States. Why don't they make the commercial on the US adoption, instead?

A white couple adopting an abandoned baby from a savage Third World country back to the civilized United States. It's again whites are portrayed holier-than-thou. Saviors of the world.
i sort of both agree and disagree with that, with regards to that particular commercial (which by the way i still haven't seen).

well, for one thing, it's true. many americans do adopt from china and other developing countries. and in the case of china, it's usually little girls that are being adopted because the little boys are usually snatched up from the orphanages. visit an orphanage in mainland china and i'll bet that there are overwhelmingly more girls than boys, maybe there wouldn't even be any boys. and i'll also bet that the conditions in a mainland china orphanage makes an orphanage in the US look like paradise. so, well, yeah in my opinion orphans in mainland china and other developing countries are in much more need of adoption than orphans in the US.

on the other hand this is a commercial. most people in the US actually do not adopt, especially if we're talking about adoption from a developing country. so it would be ridiculous to think that the company is actually targetting a market of people who would adopt from a developing country because well, there simply aren't many people like that. it's a credit card commercial, they're trying to appeal to everybody, so yeah, in a sense i can see how that is boosting america's ego that they're out to rescue everybody from their own misery.

[deez nuts]

Since when was adopting an orphan a bad thing?

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by tazadar@Dec 20 2002, 12:20 PM
SunWuKung,

I saw the commercial last weekend. I think it was about earning flight milage or maybe like Visa's "everywhere you go." If I remember correctly they didn't say whether it's a boy or girl, just romanize Chinese name. I know there are more orphaned girls than boys and I am not saying that there are no white American couples adopting children from China.

What strokes me about this commercial is that the American Express Card is targetted for businesses. Why not have a commercial of business travellers flying to Honk Kong, London, or Moscow? This is something most of American Express cardholders can relate to.

Chasiubao_Boy,

I don't think anyone is against adopting orphans or that is a bad thing. It's the presentation.
well american express has been running a series of commercials that have a "human touch". and business travels don't really convey that. but i mean yeah i do think there's a bit of self-congratulatory thing with the theme of that commercial.

[angel nympho]

A lot of people adopt Chinese kids. Since when was the woman in the commercial the baby's mother? It didn't seem that way to me. If I worked for AMX, I'd be pissed. It seems like there isn't ANY situation you can put an interaction with white people and Asian people that won't piss somebody off.

[Hanuman]

Not too long ago a hasidic jew driving a car in NY accidentally hit and killed a small black child. That became a huge race issue, even though it was nothing more than a crappy tragic accident. Could have happened to anyone, including you or I. I got mad then, seeing how people played off the race issue. I hope we here don't ever become that politically conscious, where we start looking for issues that aren't there.

I haven't seen the commercial yet. So I honestly can't say if this is the case or not, but thats the angle I take on these ambiguous issues.

[angel nympho]

A company, through the use of a television commercial, has about 10 seconds to capture your attention and, like, 30 more to play out a storyline. I forgive American Express for using their 40 seconds to play out a storyline as opposed to using it for explaining to the American public that the Chinese do not sell babies as a commodity.

[MellowDrama]

I haven't seen the commercial, so I'm not gonna slam it (yet?) but what is the nexus between AMEX and adoptions? Can you buy Chinese babies w/ AMEX? Is that what they're implying? If so, yeah, that's kinda fucked up.

[rakovlam]

whatcha talking about? China doesn't sell baby girls, they abort them. Population control, duh!

check this out More on China's 'gender-cide' (http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=14380)

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by rakovlam@Dec 21 2002, 09:08 AM
whatcha talking about? China doesn't sell baby girls, they abort them. Population control, duh!

check this out More on China's 'gender-cide' (http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=14380)
yeah ever since the ultra-sound was introduced to china, there had been a sharp increase in abortion of female fetuses. but...

1) that article is nearly 6 years old

2) the article discussed female fetuses as if they were human beings, nevermind the never-ending disagreements on whether or not they can really be considered so. and most people in china do not consider human fetuses to be human beings.

3) this happens mostly if not entirely in the country-side, where people are largely uneducated. and in fact, the one-child policy is only loosely upheld in the country-side.

4) before the ultra-sound was introduced to china, population control in china was actually causing more girls than boys to be born, because people would keep having babies until they have a boy. so some families might have 2 or 3 girls and then a youngest son.

[deez nuts]

The whole unwanted female baby population going on in China. We have no one to blame but ourselves (ourselves being the Chinese people in China). It's about time we own up to it.

I saw the commercial last nite. In a way, yes it was glorifying the whole white savior motif, but we bought it on ourselves. The Chinese people started it by not wanting baby girls. I rather have white people in the US adopt a Chinese baby girl and allowing her to have a better opportunity than to live out her life as an orphan in an orphanage.

Deal with it. Chinese families in China don't want a baby girl for one reason or another and it's very rare if at all they go and adopt one.

I think some viewed this commerical as a "losing face" (Bu gai mien zhi) by revealing this dark side of China fueled by the fact that it was a white couple adopting the baby girl.

Losing face or providing an unwanted child with a family(white, black or asian) and an opportunity. Weigh em both and see which is more important.

[angel nympho]

Originally posted by MellowDrama@Dec 21 2002, 02:09 AM
I haven't seen the commercial, so I'm not gonna slam it (yet?) but what is the nexus between AMEX and adoptions? Can you buy Chinese babies w/ AMEX? Is that what they're implying? If so, yeah, that's kinda fucked up.
No, they were saying that you can get points using your AMX card that is good for redemption for flights all around the world... so you can do things such as visit the child you are planning to adopt, etc...

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by Chasiubao_Boy@Dec 21 2002, 12:01 PM
The whole unwanted female baby population going on in China. We have no one to blame but ourselves (ourselves being the Chinese people). It's about time we own up to it.

I saw the commercial last nite. In a way, yes it was glorifying the whole white savior motif, but we bought it on ourselves. The Chinese people started it by not wanting baby girls. I rather have white people in the US adopt a Chinese baby girl and allowing her to have a better opportunity than to live out her life as an orphan in an orphanage.

Deal with it. Chinese families in China don't want a baby girl for one reason or another and it's very rare if at all they go and adopt one.

I think some viewed this commerical as a "losing face" (Bu gai mien zhi) by revealing this dark side of China fueled by the fact that it was a white couple adopting the baby girl.

Losing face or providing an unwanted child with a family(white, black or asian) and an opportunity. Weigh em both and see which is more important.
well... i haven't seen the commercial yet, and just from reading this thread, it doesn't seem like i'd have a problem with it.

but i think they only people that would conceivably have a problem with this is asian americans or chinese americans - but they really didn't "bring it on" themselves. it's chinese people in china who have been doing this, and i don't really imagine people in china having a particularly positive or negative opinion about a commercial like this. they'd probably just think of it as a curious theme.

[deez nuts]

Originally posted by SunWuKung@Dec 21 2002, 12:38 PM
Originally posted by Chasiubao_Boy@Dec 21 2002, 12:01 PM
The whole unwanted female baby population going on in China. We have no one to blame but ourselves (ourselves being the Chinese people). It's about time we own up to it.

I saw the commercial last nite. In a way, yes it was glorifying the whole white savior motif, but we bought it on ourselves. The Chinese people started it by not wanting baby girls. I rather have white people in the US adopt a Chinese baby girl and allowing her to have a better opportunity than to live out her life as an orphan in an orphanage.

Deal with it. Chinese families in China don't want a baby girl for one reason or another and it's very rare if at all they go and adopt one.

I think some viewed this commerical as a "losing face" (Bu gai mien zhi) by revealing this dark side of China fueled by the fact that it was a white couple adopting the baby girl.

Losing face or providing an unwanted child with a family(white, black or asian) and an opportunity. Weigh em both and see which is more important.
well... i haven't seen the commercial yet, and just from reading this thread, it doesn't seem like i'd have a problem with it.

but i think they only people that would conceivably have a problem with this is asian americans or chinese americans - but they really didn't "bring it on" themselves. it's chinese people in china who have been doing this, and i don't really imagine people in china having a particularly positive or negative opinion about a commercial like this. they'd probably just think of it as a curious theme.
I meant Chinese people in China.

Sorry went B.O.B. on all of ya's. Thanks for the heads up, MK.

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by Chasiubao_Boy@Dec 21 2002, 12:40 PM
Originally posted by SunWuKung@Dec 21 2002, 12:38 PM
Originally posted by Chasiubao_Boy@Dec 21 2002, 12:01 PM
The whole unwanted female baby population going on in China. We have no one to blame but ourselves (ourselves being the Chinese people). It's about time we own up to it.

I saw the commercial last nite. In a way, yes it was glorifying the whole white savior motif, but we bought it on ourselves. The Chinese people started it by not wanting baby girls. I rather have white people in the US adopt a Chinese baby girl and allowing her to have a better opportunity than to live out her life as an orphan in an orphanage.

Deal with it. Chinese families in China don't want a baby girl for one reason or another and it's very rare if at all they go and adopt one.

I think some viewed this commerical as a "losing face" (Bu gai mien zhi) by revealing this dark side of China fueled by the fact that it was a white couple adopting the baby girl.

Losing face or providing an unwanted child with a family(white, black or asian) and an opportunity. Weigh em both and see which is more important.
well... i haven't seen the commercial yet, and just from reading this thread, it doesn't seem like i'd have a problem with it.

but i think they only people that would conceivably have a problem with this is asian americans or chinese americans - but they really didn't "bring it on" themselves. it's chinese people in china who have been doing this, and i don't really imagine people in china having a particularly positive or negative opinion about a commercial like this. they'd probably just think of it as a curious theme.
I meant Chinese people in China.

Sorry went B.O.B. on all of ya's. Thanks for the heads up, MK.
but what i'm saying is, your point is kind of moot, since chinese people in china wouldn't really care about a commercial like this (in my opinion), and it's not chinese americans that are aborting female fetuses left and right, they're the ones that might possibly complain about a commercial like this, but they have nothing to own up to.

[deez nuts]

Originally posted by SunWuKung@Dec 21 2002, 01:09 PM

but what i'm saying is, your point is kind of moot, since chinese people in china wouldn't really care about a commercial like this (in my opinion), and it's not chinese americans that are aborting female fetuses left and right, they're the ones that might possibly complain about a commercial like this, but they have nothing to own up to.
You sure you know that the Chinese people in China wouldn't care about the commercial? Have you taken a formal survey on it?

As a matter of fact my uncle and aunt whom are visiting from Shanghai (for my big day) saw the commercial and were kinda disturbed by it (more of a loss of face and airing of dirty laundry than a white savior thing), after I explained it to them. After criticizing the commercial, what I said to them was almost the same effect as what I posted previously.

So you're saying the Chinese people in China, their hands are clean and don't have to own up to it? I don't get it. I'm not saying Chinese-Americans has to own up to this problem. But the people in China aren't exactly hands clean (government, civilians etc etc) of the whole problem, either. I know my grandma was guilty of it. My dad and his brothers are still looking for their sister for the last 20 or so years, after she was left outside an orphanage or something.

That's the target audience in China that may find the commercial disturbing. The ones that had an abortion because the fetus was female or those that gave up their baby girl for adoption. But the way how people in China may find the commercial offensive (like airing of dirty laundry and losing face) to how Chinese Americans in the US might find the commercial offensive (the whole white savior bit). Is prolly a whole separate issue.

[ChairmanMah]

Originally posted by Chasiubao_Boy@Dec 21 2002, 06:54 PM
Originally posted by SunWuKung@Dec 21 2002, 01:09 PM

but what i'm saying is, your point is kind of moot, since chinese people in china wouldn't really care about a commercial like this (in my opinion), and it's not chinese americans that are aborting female fetuses left and right, they're the ones that might possibly complain about a commercial like this, but they have nothing to own up to.
You sure you know that the Chinese people in China wouldn't care about the commercial? Have you taken a formal survey on it? And view it as airing of dirty laundry and losing face?

As a matter of fact my uncle and aunt whom are visiting from Shanghai (for my big day) saw the commercial and were kinda disturbed by it (more like loss of face and airing of dirty laundry than a white savior thing), after I explained it to them. What I said to them was almost the same effect as what I posted.

So you're saying the Chinese people in China, their hands are clean and don't have to own up to it? I don't get it. I'm not saying Chinese-Americans has to own up to this problem. But the people in China aren't exactly hands clean (government, civilians etc etc) of the whole problem. I know my grandma was guilty of it. My dad and his brothers are still looking for their sister for the last 20 or so years.
My grandma too. I think Chinese ppl can be so heartless toward their children.

My mother was sent to a boarding school when she was baby. She had no guidance and was somehow back w/ her mother but the damage was done. I think my mom is quite emotionally disturbed. Somewhat similar to how a ghetto child would feel.

I think that in places like China and Vietnam, children are like workers. The more you have, the more farming and food you can accomplish.

I think that there is not enough emotional attachment.

My gf told me her mother would tell other relatives that she wouldn't listen or do what she was told.

Now don't you think that is a stupid thing for asian parents to do is diss their children to other ppl.

Don't you think that as a child you'd even hate your parents even more now if your parents did that.

I think that if your parent's praised you instead then you'd be happy and be a better child.

I think Asian parents can be so counter productive at times.

That's why i stop living w/ them at 18 years old.

Y'know i envy those families that can work together and learn to agree on things.

My parents and i can barely agree on anything.

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by Chasiubao_Boy@Dec 21 2002, 01:54 PM
So you're saying the Chinese people in China, their hands are clean and don't have to own up to it? I don't get it. I'm not saying Chinese-Americans has to own up to this problem. But the people in China aren't exactly hands clean (government, civilians etc etc) of the whole problem, either. I know my grandma was guilty of it. My dad and his brothers are still looking for their sister for the last 20 or so years, after she was left outside an orphanage or something.
no no, i'm saying that (at least in my opinion) chinese people in china wouldn't have as much a problem with a commercial like this as chinese americans, and they wouldn't complain about it like chinese americans possibly would, so it's pointless to say "deal with it" concerning the commercial - because the people complaining about it aren't the cause of the problem.

race relations in china is practically non-existent. but hey i could be wrong about whether or not chinese people in china would take offense to that commercial. it's just my best guess. maybe cantonese people would differ in opinion with shanghainese people on this.

[deez nuts]

Originally posted by SunWuKung@Dec 21 2002, 02:27 PM
no no, i'm saying that (at least in my opinion) chinese people in china wouldn't have as much a problem with a commercial like this as chinese americans, and they wouldn't complain about it like chinese americans possibly would, so it's pointless to say "deal with it" concerning the commercial - because the people complaining about it aren't the cause of the problem.

race relations in china is practically non-existent. but hey i could be wrong about whether or not chinese people in china would take offense to that commercial. it's just my best guess. maybe cantonese people would differ in opinion with shanghainese people on this.
Ok I agree. We're on the same wavelength now. I doubt those in China will even see the AMEX commercial unless they happen to see it while visiting the US.

Actually dad's older brother and my grandparents were raised in Fujian. Fled to Taiwan. My uncle moved to Shanghai since he doen't like Taiwan anymore.

Like I said earlier I don't argue the commercial as a white savior thing rather than an airing of dirty laundry and losing of face thing (which was the first thing that popped into my mind).

I guess I was continuing the argument/debate I had with my uncle, aunt and my dad from last nite not taking the Chinese American viewpoint.

Edit: Sorry for deviating from the original issue. :ph34r:

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by ChairmanMah@Dec 21 2002, 02:14 PM
My gf told me her mother would tell other relatives that she wouldn't listen or do what she was told.

Now don't you think that is a stupid thing for asian parents to do is diss their children to other ppl.

Don't you think that as a child you'd even hate your parents even more now if your parents did that.

I think that if your parent's praised you instead then you'd be happy and be a better child.

I think Asian parents can be so counter productive at times.
i think that's a pretty white-washed view of things. you're expecting immigrant parents to behave like they're parents that were american born and raised. it's just natural for people in chinese society (probably other east asian societies as well) to show humility by criticising yourself and your own in front of others. i mean it's pretty much done unconsciously.

and chinese/asian parents criticise their kids because they expect their kids to be compliant instead of rebellious, and that the criticising would convey to the kids that they should do better. but what they don't realise is that american raised kids would become rebellious with criticism instead of striving to be better because of the criticism.

[ModernLogic]

The parents get to have a baby and the Chinese baby gets to have a better life in America. It's a win-win situation. No complaints here.