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BillBlythe
06-13-2008, 12:17 AM
I watched him last week at the Prefontaine classic where he looked completely nervous and even disqualified himself on a second false start. I really don't see him winning the title at Beijing either unfortunately, cause that would absolutely be huge. He's probably already a huge star in China but to win Gold at the Olympics in China would elevate him to God status. Oh well.

Dayron Robles of Cuba set a world record of 12.87 seconds in the 110-meter hurdles Thursday, eclipsing the mark previously held by China’s most celebrated Olympic star and setting the stage for a potential upset in the country’s most eagerly awaited event at the Summer Games in Beijing.

Robles, 21, set his record at a meet in Ostrava, the Czech Republic, shaving by one-hundredth of a second the record time of Liu Xiang of China, the 2004 Olympic champion and the favorite in Beijing this August.

Liu, who set his record in 2006 and has become highly visible in China as a star athlete and corporate pitchman, did not participate in Thursday’s race. His outdoor season has been brief and disappointing. A hamstring injury kept Liu from participating in the Reebok Grand Prix meet in New York on May 31. Last weekend, a false start disqualified him from the Prefontaine Classic in Eugene, Ore.

And now, Liu’s record has been surpassed by Robles, who defeated the Chinese champion twice outdoors last season but has struggled to perform to his capabilities in major championship races.

As it prepares to host the Olympics, China has been dealing with a devastating earthquake and has been facing criticism over the issues of human rights and news media freedoms. On a competitive level, it now faces questions about its two most renowned Olympic stars — Liu and the N.B.A. player Yao Ming, who had foot surgery in March and whose availability for the Beijing Games remains uncertain.

“It’s such a good time; I wasn’t expecting that. Wow!” Robles, who wore glasses and a cross around his neck, told reporters after his record race. “I do not know if I can beat Liu Xiang in Beijing now. But we will see.”

Liu was scheduled to return to China after the Prefontaine meet and has said he would not compete again until the Beijing Olympics, which will be held from Aug. 8 to 24. But his American-based agent, Mark Wetmore, said the chances were better than 50-50 that Liu would run in a meet on the European circuit in July, perhaps in Madrid, Rome or Athens.

“He said he wanted to go home to make sure his hamstring was O.K.,” Wetmore said. “It’s his decision about running. But if he’s going to come back, a Golden League meet would make the most sense, where he’d have the best possible competition.”

Robles has clearly gained top form as Liu tries to restore his health. On Thursday, Robles shaved five-hundredths of a second — a considerable amount — from his previous best, 12.92 seconds, run last September.

In the clouded world of track and field, where doping has been rampant, Robles is sure to face some skepticism about his performance. He has not failed a drug test.

Thursday’s performance by Robles, who is 6 feet 3 ˝ inches, was the second stunning record effort in two weeks. Usain Bolt of Jamaica ran 9.72 seconds to set the world record in the 100 meters at the Reebok Grand Prix meet.

Robles is no newcomer to the hurdles the way Bolt is to the 100. Last year, Robles defeated Liu twice, at a meet in Paris and again at a race in Shanghai. Cuba has long been known for the technical skill of its hurdlers and coaches. Anier Garcia of Cuba won the 110 hurdles at the 2000 Olympics in Sydney, Australia.

“He’s a tall guy with quick feet who is very efficient over the top of the hurdles,” Renaldo Nehemiah of the United States, a former world-record holder and the first man to run the event in less than 13 seconds, said of Robles in a recent interview. “Obviously, the road to Beijing travels through Liu. He’s not going to give it to him. But in a one-race environment, all it takes is one mistake and anything can happen.”

Liu seems to have one advantage: he seems to be at his best in major championships, and Robles does not. Robles finished a disappointing fourth to Liu last August at the world track and field championships in Osaka, Japan.

Then, after a dominant indoor season in 2008 in the 60 hurdles, Robles mistakenly believed a false start had been called on Liu in the first round of the indoor world championships in March in Valencia, Spain. Robles stopped running and was eliminated from the competition, which Liu eventually won. They are considered friends, and Liu offered his condolences.

The next time the two men are scheduled to meet, an Olympic gold medal will hang in the balance.

“There is no favorite,” Allen Johnson of the United States, the 1996 Olympic champion, said.

yoMAMA
06-13-2008, 10:46 AM
I will be watching the olympics in china, i hope Liu can win it.

KenTsui
08-19-2008, 08:46 AM
he wont win anything now

yoMAMA
08-19-2008, 09:37 AM
yeah, what happened yesterday, words cannot describe.

Paradox
08-19-2008, 09:44 AM
Well the rumor is he has been injured for over 6 months and he knew it as well as his coach. He wasn't willing to pull out completely from events because it would send the media into a frenzy. So basically he showed up and flopped on purpose instead of not showing up altogether.

Ah well, he's still an awesome athlete in my book.

cloudzero
08-19-2008, 09:45 AM
all this for 1 gold? or 2?

lethal
08-19-2008, 11:05 AM
1

tommyhtown
08-19-2008, 11:25 AM
But by being there, wouldn't he take a spot to compete in the event away from China?

Paradox
08-19-2008, 11:44 AM
But by being there, wouldn't he take a spot to compete in the event away from China?

They have reserves and whatever. I think Liu Xiang was really the only guy they had that was a serious contender. China does not focus on track and field events at all so it doesn't really have a deep pool of talent to draw from.

cloudzero
08-19-2008, 11:45 AM
They have reserves and whatever. I think Liu Xiang was really the only guy they had that was a serious contender. China does not focus on track and field events at all so it doesn't really have a deep pool of talent to draw from.

dont forget the rarity of an asian with fast twitching muscles

Paradox
08-19-2008, 11:55 AM
dont forget the rarity of an asian with fast twitching muscles
I don't think it's that rare actually. Out of 1.3 billion people i'm sure there are a lot of undiscovered track and star athletes waiting to happen. The problem is isolating those with natural physical talent and then training them. China is really only skimming the surface here of what's available.

cloudzero
08-19-2008, 12:27 PM
so what now? liu at the next olympics or too old?

VV o n g B a
08-19-2008, 12:31 PM
I don't think it's that rare actually. Out of 1.3 billion people i'm sure there are a lot of undiscovered track and star athletes waiting to happen. The problem is isolating those with natural physical talent and then training them. China is really only skimming the surface here of what's available.even w/ someone of liu's talent, he's still only able to compete in hurdles which requires more than raw speed.

i think it's been pretty well borne out by the results that some events are better suited for some groups of ppl. men's 100m is the most glaring example. when is the last time a non-black (and specifically a non-west african descended black) has even reached the finals of the 100m, much less actually win it?

that isn't to say that there aren't ultrafast asians out there, but that there's prolly very few of them. same for whites and everyone else.

BillBlythe
08-19-2008, 12:56 PM
so what now? liu at the next olympics or too old?

he would be 29 at the 2012 olympics and while that isn't 'too old', i think we've seen him peak. his record is broken, he's suffering some major setbacks, i think we'll be seeing him in commercials and giving motivational speeches more than running on the track. i wonder if it's just more humane to put him down like a lame horse.

Paradox
08-19-2008, 01:10 PM
even w/ someone of liu's talent, he's still only able to compete in hurdles which requires more than raw speed.

i think it's been pretty well borne out by the results that some events are better suited for some groups of ppl. men's 100m is the most glaring example. when is the last time a non-black (and specifically a non-west african descended black) has even reached the finals of the 100m, much less actually win it?

that isn't to say that there aren't ultrafast asians out there, but that there's prolly very few of them. same for whites and everyone else.
I'm not sure about these genetics arguments to be honest. It ties in a little too closely to eugenics and whatever. Nutrition, environment, and social/cultural factors play more of a role in what type of people do well in the Olympics. I'm not arguing that some people living in specific environments might have developed these attributes but as a whole it can really be manipulated into racial arguments and that's what i'm avoiding here.

If we all listened to the prevailing stereotypes about race then who would believe Asians would dominate weightlifting ?

cloudzero
08-19-2008, 01:17 PM
If we all listened to the prevailing stereotypes about race then who would believe Asians would dominate weightlifting ?

weightlifting depends more on form than strength.
theres no argument that asians have a higher torse to legs length ratio.
blacks have the lowest. whites are somewhere in between.
but then u got a freak like phelps

VV o n g B a
08-19-2008, 03:31 PM
If we all listened to the prevailing stereotypes about race then who would believe Asians would dominate weightlifting ?i'm not talking about stereotypes here. i'm talking about results. i haven't said anything about asians being weak. japan was winning weightlifting events back in the 60s, so there are results that show parity from decades before.

in pure speed, there appears to be no parity. i'm not saying asians shouldn't run the 100m, or that they should concede any event simply b/c of race. but over many decades, u would think that if all races had the same exact ability, then u would have parity in something as basic as running 100m. there are few barriers to entry in training for this sport. u don't need amazing facilities, u don't need ungodly expensive equipment, u don't need a large number of teammates or depth, u don't need to make many split second decisions, u don't need absolute precision. u just need to be healthy and run fast.

i'm saying don't expect all sorts 100m world record breakers to come out of china anytime soon b/c it appears to be quite difficult to overcome whatever factor west african blacks have in their favor.