Opinions on Vancouver, BC

[kimpossible]

For those of you living there or have lived there - care to share your experience and opinions? Especially if you're Chinese and grew up there. Anything you could provide on the following topics would help.

*schools - particularly whether bilingual schools exist
*society
*chinese community there
*health care system
*travel time/ease of travel to Japan, Taiwan & HK if you know

Feel free to compare it to America whether good or bad.

[snow ninja]

Hi Kimpossible,


schools: there are french immersion schools but in Vancouver you'll find more than half the schools are asian and mostly chinese so i'm sure you'll hear some chinese in the hallways.

society? um, a more liberal mentality but there is some division. most people are just recreationalists who love the nature, scenery and what it offers.

chinese community: there is a lot to the point that many insecure whites are feeling "invaded"

health care: there are some problems but with universal health care, money is always an issue everywhere especially with all the aging boomers

travel to asia is getting cheaper i'm going to vietnam and hong kong and back for 800 through oasis hong kong airlines.

i like to board in the mountains, see the ocean, lakes and trees. and i'm getting an atv so i'll be trail riding soon too.

it's got a distinct international flare and multicultural feel. Lots of restaurants and decent shopping.

Unfortunately Real Estate among other things are priced high. You be lucky to find a house for under 500k that doesn't need work. It's basically impossible. It's almost better to rent if you are lower income but if you can afford it and have a huge downpayment then you should be ok.

[snow ninja]

you can live just outside of vancouver and the further you go say 60-70km into the more rural areas and pay 1 or 2 hundred thousand less for a house.

check out

mls.ca

[CBC guy]

YOu planning to move to the GVRD, forget about living in Vancouver proper. You'll have to stay in Langley or something like that to get any decent housing prices.

Snow Ninja did a pretty good recap, I would have said most of the same things.

$800 Airfare to Asia is pretty good, its easy to get to Japan, Taiwan, etc from here, there are even direct flights to Beijing and Shanghai I think. Vancouver has you covered there no doubt. Nice airport too. (Trust me, I've seen my share of airports, Vancouver's is pretty nice and I'm not saying this cause I live here, its cause its true) Twice-daily flights direct to HK, this city is well-connected to Asia, no worries there.

Most people are decent on first meeting, but there are quite a few nutcases and people full of themselves if you talk to them more. Most people just want to "commune with nature" but people here are notoriously whiny and fiercely liberal, often to the point of offending "moderates". Also, strikes seem to happen here a lot. i think there is still a strike on garbage collection in Vancouver if I'm not mistaken. (I'm not in Vancouver right now, sorry) On first contact though, most Vancouverites are polite and friendly to a fault.

Public transport is not great compared to Asia but I think its better than many US cities. (LA, for example) Skytrain only gets crowded before and after hockey games and such. (in which case there may be drunks around, but sheer numbers should cancel out any trouble most of the time)

Right now there is a hell of a lot of construction going on, Cambie (a main street here) is closed off for construction and traffic can get congested.

95% of schools are English pretty much, there are plenty of Chinese schools on weekends if that's what you want. Trust me, there's so many Chiense here you can speak Chinese all day and never speak English once.

Shopping: Again, nothing compared to Asia, but its alright I guess. Remember all goods have 7% tax.

Food is actually quite decent here. There are manifold forms of Chinese, (Most are still Cantonese, but there are decent Sichuan, Taiwan, and Hunan places now) in fact I think there has been a proliferation of Chinese and Japanese restaurants in particular and competition is quite fierce by Canadian standards. Sushi is seen as snack food and can be had cheaply, unlike most other places. Note that most Japanese restaurants are NOT Japanese owned, but Chinese restaurants are ALWAYS Chinese owned (go figure LOL).

For Japanese food I can recommend Kishu, a little place on Kingsway, I tihnk its Vietnamese owned but everything's pretty decent there. It often gets crowded though.

Many Indian-owned Indian restaurants on Main and 49th (I tihnk) that do a roaring trade.

Only a few places are open 24 hours that I know of. There's McD's and Subway on SW Marine Drive, along with Denny's. Number 9 Chinese restaurant in Richmond is open 24/7 and does good Cantonese/HK food

Plenty of Pho places too if that's your thing, oh yes, there's a 24 hour Pho place on Kingsway whose name I forget.

This place is fairly multicultural, with many of the "whites" actually from places in Eastern Europe and stuff, so there's a large Russian and Polish community, as well as a large group of Italians, Portuguese, and citizens of the former Yugoslavia. Open racism is a big no-no here for the most part, and hapas are not uncommon here, so you shouldn't be stared at too much. (Maybe by newly arrived Chinese, but oh well)

Anything else... well, we get the Olympics in 2010.... and read the Vancouver Sun for serious news and the Province for anything with entertainment, life and sports. (hockey is the sport of choice here, with football a distant second)

Oh, and if you do come, welcome to Vancouver! (No, I won't post the equivalent in French as there aren't that many Quebecois here, and those that are here mostly speak English anyway)

[SunWuKong]

never been to Vancouver, but i would think the Canadian healthcare system is definitely a plus for anybody with kids.

[snow ninja]

if you like sking/boarding you wont want to miss whistler but some of our local mountains are pretty good.

most brand new langley houses on city lots are 600k.

and with some rural acreage that can be rezoned and subdivided. it's in the millions.

but regarding restaurants, there is quite a few more good than bad but there are some bad ones like anywhere.

and there are quite a few east indians here too i think the second largest group after the chinese... and like CBC guy said, there are alot of Europeans of different nationalities too.

[snow ninja]

most people are buying condos now a days too because

1. easier living, less maintenance, cost, taxes etc.

2. boomers downsizing

3. more affordable for new buyers

4. often built in more concentrated areas with amenities within walking distance.

[CBC guy]

Coffee is a big thing in Vancouver, must be the influence from sister city Seattle. Starbucks is omnipresent, with the most interesting example being 2 seperate branches right accross each other on Robson and Thurlow. (I think) During last winter's snow storm the city decided that the coffee makers in Tim Horton's (A Canadian coffee/donut place) and Starbucks did not boil water to the specified standard during a snowstorm and thus neither had any hot drinks, including coffee. Now this caused a small ruckus as thousands of local denziens' dependence on the coffee bean (combined with the aforementioned whinyness and aggressive assertion of rights) led to some "altercations" between customers and hapless staff.

Right now, though, the coffee places are up and humming as usual.

Another drink which is common here is bubble tea. Since you lived in Taiwan you should know what it is, but for some reason bubble tea (or BBTea) is THE non-alcoholic drink of choice if ppl want to chat... oh, and Taiwanese-style cuisine to go with that never hurts either, especially right after a hockey game and you want to analyse what the fuck happend on the ice there eh? :wink:


There's great scenery and natural beauty when its nice. Vancity rains a lot though.

I would recommend trips to Whistler, the Okanagan and Victoria for starters. You can even drive to the US (Bellingham and Seattle) if you choose, although seeing as you are actually American that doesn't constitute a " foreign trip" per se LOL. My friends and I go down to Bellingham sometimes for shopping (certain hard-to-find items) and for better quality buffets.

Speaking of my friends, the Chinese community here is so large it can actually be divided into distinct groups rather than just "Chinese". There's the "CBCs" (akin to ABCs, similar in cultural outlook in many ways. My own username) the HK group, (Cantonese speaking... you get the idea), the Taiwan group and the small but growing prc group. The groups do mix, (I have friends from all these groups, with English being the common language) but its not always easy. Some old Chinese folks really like Vancouver (like my grandma, to the point that she declared she will NEVER live anywhere else!) but then some don't. (like anywhere else really)

Vancouver is not really a huge "top-class" city, its not NYC and never will be, being too laid back. However, the lifestyle here is quite enjoyable for many people. If I had to compare it with the States I will say Seattle (duh!) and San Francisco come closest in "feel" to Vancouver.


P.S. People in Vancouver have a bit of a reputation for being anti-American sometimes, (mostly at hockey games when it couldn't be helped) but don't worry unduly about it. Vancouverites are usually glad to teach you about their city.

P.S. 2: Avoid this area known as the "Downtown Eastside". You won't regret it. Trust us.

[snow ninja]

I agree with what CBC says..

also, ppl use words like "quaint" and "village" to describe vancouver.

but i must warn you, the traffic can be nasty at times. our infrastructure is definatley behind the times but i swear they do that intentionally to keep vancouver "quaint" and not a concrete jungle.

[CBC guy]

I agree with what CBC says..

also, ppl use words like "quaint" and "village" to describe vancouver.

but i must warn you, the traffic can be nasty at times. our infrastructure is definatley behind the times but i swear they do that intentionally to keep vancouver "quaint" and not a concrete jungle.

Vancouver Downtown's infrastructure, especially regards to traffic, is pretty bad I think. When Vancouver was being built I don't think they thought this city was going to have 2 million people living in the area commuting to work every day. If you live out in Langley or Surrey and have to commute to Vancouver, its a rough ride as the Port Mann Bridge ALWAYS gets stuck with thousands of vehicles heading west and very few heading east. (Vice versa around 6 PM) The water in and around Vancouver is very pretty to look at, but its a bit of a pain when it comes to driving as bridges are all-important routes of life and death.

Believe it or not, I think newer places like Burnaby, Coquitlam and Langley have better infrastructure than Vancouver, seeing as these "suburbs" ( i use that term loosely, as Burnaby is slowly being more and more like Vancouver every day) were developed later when city planners actually thought about, say, adding left-turn lanes? Or how about, wide, spacious mall parking lots? Or how about a big mall with rec centre and library a few steps away? I live near Metrotown (the largest mall in the GVRD and in fact one of the largest in Canada) in Burnaby and I must say that this is actually quite convienient, as Metrotown is also a major transport hub with a Skytrain station and bus terminal. (Now its called "Metropolis at Metrotown" or some monstrosity like that.... you can get almost anything there, I spend most of my time at EB, Sportchek, or the CHQ arcade LOL :biggrin: oh, yes, the food court, but we usually go to Crystal food court as its cheaper and there's better selection of Asian stuff there)

Coming to Downtown, forget driving if possible. Take the Skytrain, you won't regret it. But if the Canucks (the hockey team) are playing that night, expect congestion in around GM Place stadium, which is situated right on the Eastern edge of Downtown where most people arrive in Downtown.

[snow ninja]

I don't mind the suburbs at all. more room and less traffic.

but i suspect it's a little bit of an illusion since roads like kingsway, king george, 200th st do get congested. I actually hate Langley traffic because that town has some weird infrastructure planning and too many hwy's crossing and too many long lights.

maybe the suburb traffic may just seem not that bad because vancouver traffic is just so much worse in comparison.

that HWY 1,91,99, queensborough, mary hill bypass, are all congested during rush hours and are easily susceptible to holdups in traffic like accidents, police incidents, breakdowns that screw shit up big time.

[pikachupacabra]

It's a really nice place as far as I could tell from the one time I visited. Cool, but not cold temperature, nice vibes and atmosphere. A substantial asian population as well.


The only negative would be their motto. "Beautiful by nature". That's kind of an annoying and pretentious tagline.

[snow ninja]

if i lived in vancouver, i would probably not need to have a car even tho i would have one.

i would definately walk or bike to the local shops and eateries.

pikachu,
yeah, they are pushing this "best place on earth" marketing campaign to hype up 2010 winter olympics and i think to bring more people here? there's enough people right now i think.

[CBC guy]

If I lived downtown I would (of course) keep a car to get other places, but locally I would just walk. Honestly, the good thing about downtown is the density, and a fair amount of services are within walking distance.

Vancouver is really marketing itself lately. "Beautiful by nature" yes I think that';s the motto but really you can't blame them.

It is quaint compared with LA, NYC etc but it is huge compared with most places in Canada, only Toronto and Montreal are bigger in fact. I see people from the B.C. Interior all the time (very, very nice people BTW) who always comment on how Vancouver is the biggest city they have ever been to in their life. Thus, its all a matter of perspective.

Oh yes, proving beyond all doubt my obsession with food, I remember another 24-hour place. Its Bino's, an old-fashioned US/Canada diner with all-day (and all-night) breakfast for $3.99. Its not as good as Denny's breakfasts but for $3.99 you get toast, eggs, sausage, and some pancakes too if I'm not mistaken.

Unfortunately, the longtime butt of Vancouver jokes, the Pho Bich Nga (or Fo Bitch Nigga as some call it) is no longer in business. :biggrin: Apparently the food wasn't good there either, as some girls I know got wicked diarrhea after eating there, LOL. :cool:

Vancouver's official regional dish is smoked salmon I think. (very good BTW) But I would think the unofficial regional dish has to be sushi and sashimi, I know its odd but there is literally a Japanese (or Japanese-like) place on every other street corner. Butter Chicken and Dim Sum vie for second place.

This city is hilarious.

[mrazntre]

women in general are way hotter in vancouver than in LA. plus they're all skinny. that's gotta count for a lot.

[CBC guy]

women in general are way hotter in vancouver than in LA. plus they're all skinny. that's gotta count for a lot.


They're not ALL skinny, but I went to LA and the girls there just seemed... I don't know, too made-up. Either that or they were well overweight. There were good-looking ones but they looked like they had way too much makeup and fake tans on. That and 12 year olds wearing skimpy tank tops... somewhat creepy in my opinion.

In Vancouver people are more down to earth and they enjoy a more "natural" look. The only thing is LA people like to wear clothes with many different colours while in Vancouver its black, black, and more black LOL.

I mean, 80% of the Asian guys in Vancouver wear black. I do too, unconciously. I don't even think about it, but in LA people wear all kinds of wacky colours.

And one more thing, LA Baseball fans are LAID-BACK. Vancouver hockey fans can get hardcore. (as in hockey riots) Maybe its just the sport I don't know. I've been to a LA Dodger game against the SF Giants (as big a rival as there is man!) and the fans still seemed... easygoing, though to their credit they booed Barry Bonds mercilessly. (I enjoyed that LOL) whereas in Vancouver they've even booed the US anthem before. (They don't allow that anymore I think) And when Toronto, Calgary, Minnesota, Colorado or Edmonton come to town, look out, drunken fists may fly and the air turns blue on AND off the ice.

Maybe its just hockey and baseball are different sports haha

[snow ninja]

baseballs so laid back because it's so boring to watch:wink:

it's pretty fun to play tho.

is it true they go to watch football/baseball just to eat hot dogs and guzzle beer.

maybe that's why they are so laid back they are too busy consuming?

[snow ninja]

pics are worth a thousand words.

these pics are taken in a town called mission about 45 min from vancouver.

this is a trail at a park called "golden ears"

the trail is called "the lower falls trail"

this was a soggy sept 30 07.

i was truly in a rainforest.

step near that water and if you slip, you're so dead

http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee250/surreystyles/DSCN0387.jpg?t=1191299137

http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee250/surreystyles/DSCN0387.jpg?t=1191299137

http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee250/surreystyles/DSCN0388.jpg?t=1191299137

http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee250/surreystyles/DSCN0389.jpg?t=1191299137

[CBC guy]

At Lynn Valley Park (North Van) there is this big waterfall/cliff thing and one time I saw this white guy jump off of there ON PURPOSE I was like :eek: WTF?! I don't know what happened to him. (probably dead)

I probably can't watch a full Baseball game on TV (only live) but I have watched full Football, Soccer and Basketball games. Hockey, though is my true sporting love. :wink:

P.S. Is Kimpossible even reading this thread anymore? Its just me and you waxing poetic about our hometown. :wink:

[popculturepooka]

^ My girlfriend lived in Vancouver for 2 years (to learn English)...can I join? :cool:

Can I be cool by association?

[snow ninja]

be our guest kinozashi.

ask us any question about metro vancouver bc!

there's a waterfall at stave lake in mission i jump off of but have not went there for a few years. it's part way up a gravel road at the end of sylvester road.

it's called "suicide creek"

a movie was shot there once and an female actor/stuntman jumped off. i cant remember the movie's name. it was some kind of thriller or somthing.

(i'm sure kimpossible is around maybe she's just taking it all in from afar.)

[CBC guy]

^ My girlfriend lived in Vancouver for 2 years (to learn English)...can I join? :cool:

Can I be cool by association?

Oh by all means... be our guest, as snow ninja said, we are both glad to answer questions about our beloved hometown LOL. (GVRD Roxxors WOOOO!!!:wink: )

Your girlfriend? Where did she study? UBC? Simon Fraser?

P.S. Shoot man the NHL season is coming soon, the Canucks' season starts again on Friday,

GO CANUCKS GO! (waves playoff towel and puts on Orca jersey... again)

[snow ninja]

woohoo, go Canuckleheads!!

[popculturepooka]

Oh by all means... be our guest, as snow ninja said, we are both glad to answer questions about our beloved hometown LOL. (GVRD Roxxors WOOOO!!!:wink: )

Your girlfriend? Where did she study? UBC? Simon Fraser?



Coolio.

Actually I'm not sure. I'd have to ask her. Or maybe I can get her to start posting on here.......we'll see.

Question: I've heard there are about -3 black people in Vancouver. Is that true?

How big is the Japanese population there?

[CBC guy]

Coolio.

Actually I'm not sure. I'd have to ask her. Or maybe I can get her to start posting on here.......we'll see.

Question: I've heard there are about -3 black people in Vancouver. Is that true?

How big is the Japanese population there?


haha -3 is harsh, but there aren't that many Blacks here no. Many of the Black people that are here are actually from Africa and not African0American, so you may have to adjust.

There's considerably more Japanese people than Black people in Vancouver, and many of them are quite wealthy, living in West Vancouver and stuff. I have some Japanese Canadian acquaintances but that's what they are: Japanese CANADIAN, which means they are more western in outlook than anything else.

Quite a lot of Japanese Canadians in Vancouver intermarry with other races as well.

The history of Japanese Canadians in Vancouver is actually a poignant one, as they once had a much larger community here but they were driven out to detention camps during WWII (notice they didn't do that to Germans or Italians) and the Community has not fully recovered from that. But the Sushi craze in the 80s helped revive them a little bit. They are quite outnumbered by Chinese though...

BTW Vancouver has tons and tons of Japanese restaurants, the majority of them not owned by Japanese (many are owned by Koreans, ironically enough.) I do know a few though, (Sushi Garden in Burnaby is run by extremely polite and petite middle-aged Japanese ladies, and is very very good IMO) However, the Sushi may well be, I should say.... tailored towards Canadian tastes... but its so common in Vancouver that its become just another food option. (For example, in other places, it might be like, "hey let's try something daring: Sushi!" Whereas here its more like:" Ok I'm just going to grab a quick bite at Sushi Garden and come back." "Oh, how about Samurai Sushi? (A real restaurant name LOL) Its got good Sashimi there!" "Hmmm... no, Sushi Garden's cheaper and I just want something cheap and easy." I think you get the idea)

Your Girlfriend is Japanese? She'll probably have a better idea about Japanese people in Vancouver than I do. One prominent Japanese-Canadian who grew up in Vancouver is David Suzuki. (The bearded Asian guy from "The Nature of Things") Another is the all-star hockey player Paul Kariya (he's actually hapa, but whatever he counts LOL).

As for Black people.... sorry man I really don't know if they have a "spot" or not... (most Blacks I know in Vancouver have African and not African-American backgrounds, so it may well require some cultural adjustment for African-Americans like you sorry haha)

[CBC guy]

Oh... one more of my funny intercultural stories.

Recently throughout the summer I kept running into this same group of Japanese exchange students hanging out outside 7-11, eating hot dogs and drinking slurpies while sitting on the sidewalk. At first I was like WTF are these little punks doing sitting on the pavement eating hotdogs? What kind of weirdos are they? Then suddenly out of left field I remembered a line from Lonely Planet. "In general, Japanese people do not like to eat while walking. They will find a place to sit before eating." And I was like... "Hmmm.... so they'r probably Japanese-Japanese then and not CBC/CBJ (Canadian-born Chinese/Japanese) whatever. Sure enough I recognized certain Japanese keywords ("oooh... hai, hai..." "...desu ne/desu yo", etc) in their animated conversations (and noticed the girls kept bowing ever so slightly towards the boys and saying "uh!" in a high-pitched girly voice to acknowledge them. BTW one of the girls had really, really creamy smooth skin, was slim, and had shoulder-length curly hair, little button nose and soft, welcoming eyes. Very pretty and cute. LOL guys just notice these things. SHe seemd really bubbly and happy all the time too, very girly behavior haha) One time I saw this guy from their "posse" try to pay for a hotdog and a coke with a $100 CDN bill. That was hilarious because the cashier guy was pissed off and swearing at this poor Japanese guy who had no change left. (The hotdog and coke cost maybe $5.50?) I couldn't help him because I didn't know Japanese well enough. The student's English was actually understandable, (with heavy accents, but not totally hopeless) and later I learned they were students at SFU (Simon Fraser University, a college in Vancouver) and were learning English. They all agreed that English was difficult to learn, but they all seemed to like Vancouver and Canada. They were relatively open and willing to talk by Japanese standards, (reserved by Canadian standards no doubt) but I guess in Japan they would be considered the "Westernized" group haha.

At my sister's wedding two Japanese (from Tokyo, not CBJ) classmates of my sister's friend came to the service wearing Yutakas and Getas. It made them stand out like a sore thumb, but as it was sweltering in August I envied them as a Yutaka is much more conductive to hot weather than a full suit and tie. They kept apologizing to us (in English) that they were suddenly invited to this wedding by their "Canadian friend' and it would be "most impolite" not to come, but unfortunately as 21 year old University students they didn't really bring suits and ties (LOL!) over from Japan and this was the best they had. VERY Interesting. I didn't know them at all but you could spot them a mile away. Put them into "western" clothes though, they would blend right in. (As they're Asian and both of them could reasonably pass for Chinese) I think they were last-minute guests as the other friends who were supposed to come couldn't make it, and the Banquet was already paid for, the more the merrier right? My dad (doesn't like Japan much but he's rational enough to know these two young punks had nothing to do with WWII LOL) thought it terribly amusing. Hell, I thought it was terribly amusing. They seemed like they still managed to have a good time. they both hooted and clapped as my brother in law kissed my sister for the first time, managed to "practice oral English" (they said that!) and at dinner they got to "play Kanji games." They seemed to enjoy partaking in the beer provided. They said that as University students they really, really appreciated a free Chinese Banquet, and as 21 year old young males ate with considerable gusto, putting away fish, chicken and abalone without too much of the famed Japanese restraint. The Wedding Banquet was a fun time, and I noticed they were laughing more and more as they got redder and redder. They even got up to propose a toast to everyone at the Banquet. At the end of the night they just about staggered out as they bowed repeatedly towards us saying "daanK Yuuu!!! Daank Yuu weally mashu!"

To their credit, they did leave a $10 CDN bill with a small congragulatory note in English. It was signed in their Kanji names. (as Kanji names are more formal and also perhaps they knew we were Chinese and would find it much easier to read Kanji than Hiragana.)

Later I learned from my sister's friend that back home in Japan these two "characters" were seen as weirdos and being "much too friendly with girls" and "Much too outgoing and not polite enough." Their positives were that they were "jolly good lads" and "knew how to enjoy life."

Perhaps the reason they left Japan to go to Canada?

And finally, I think you might like this quote Kinzoashi

Unfortunately, the longtime butt of Vancouver jokes, the Pho Bich Nga (or Fo Bitch Nigga as some call it) is no longer in business. Apparently the food wasn't good there either, as some girls I know got wicked diarrhea after eating there, LOL.

Vancouver's official regional dish is smoked salmon I think. (very good BTW) But I would think the unofficial regional dish has to be sushi and sashimi, I know its odd but there is literally a Japanese (or Japanese-like) place on every other street corner. Butter Chicken and Dim Sum vie for second place.

This city is hilarious

[bmwhype]

i need to move from nyc to vancouver

[CBC guy]

i need to move from nyc to vancouver

When do you plan to move? Remember, Vancouver is a LOT smaller than NYC and the people are probably more introverted than in NYC. Less of everything, I don';t know how much things in NYC cost but I would imagine if you live in NYC Vancouver housing costs shouldn't faze you too much.

If you're Asian there's a lot of Asians here.

So what makes you want to move to Vancouver? Its also harder to find a job here than in NYC I would imagine LOL.

[snow ninja]

women in general are way hotter in vancouver than in LA. plus they're all skinny. that's gotta count for a lot.

there is a club called atlantis and as long as i've known the bar it's been 95% asian and the chicks there are HOT. all different ones, viets, chinese, korean, japanese, filips. lots of young ones too. the place is crazy

[bmwhype]

When do you plan to move? Remember, Vancouver is a LOT smaller than NYC and the people are probably more introverted than in NYC. Less of everything, I don';t know how much things in NYC cost but I would imagine if you live in NYC Vancouver housing costs shouldn't faze you too much.

If you're Asian there's a lot of Asians here.

So what makes you want to move to Vancouver? Its also harder to find a job here than in NYC I would imagine LOL.

the climate is nicer. and i might also run into kristin kreuk:biggrin: