Suicide rate high for Asian-American women

[bmwhype]

ATLANTA, Georgia (CNN) -- One evening in 1990, Eliza Noh hung up the phone with her sister. Disturbed about the conversation, Noh immediately started writing a letter to her sister, a college student who was often depressed. "I told her I supported her, and I encouraged her," Noh says.
But her sister never read the letter. By the time it arrived, she'd killed herself.
Moved by that tragedy, Noh has spent much of her professional life studying depression and suicide among Asian-American women. An assistant professor of Asian-American studies at California State University at Fullerton, Noh has read the sobering statistics from the Department of Health and Human Services: Asian-American women ages 15-24 have the highest suicide rate of women in any race or ethnic group in that age group. Suicide is the second-leading cause of death for Asian-American women in that age range.
Depression starts even younger than age 15. Noh says one study has shown that as young as the fifth grade, Asian-American girls have the highest rate of depression so severe they've contemplated suicide.
As Noh and others have searched for the reasons, a complex answer has emerged.
First and foremost, they say "model minority" pressure -- the pressure some Asian-American families put on children to be high achievers at school and professionally -- helps explain the problem.
"In my study, the model minority pressure is a huge factor," says Noh, who studied 41 Asian-American women who'd attempted or contemplated suicide. "Sometimes it's very overt -- parents say, 'You must choose this major or this type of job' or 'You should not bring home As and Bs, only As," she says. "And girls have to be the perfect mother and daughter and wife as well."
Family pressure often affects girls more than boys, according to Dr. Dung Ngo, a psychologist at Baylor University in Texas. "When I go talk to high school students and ask them if they experience pressure, the majority who raised their hands were the girls," he said.
Asian-American parents, he says, are stricter with girls than with boys. "The cultural expectations are that Asian women don't have that kind of freedom to hang out, to go out with friends, to do the kinds of things most teenagers growing up want to do."
And in Asian cultures, he added, you don't question parents. "The line of communication in Asian culture one way. It's communicated from the parents downward," he says. "If you can't express your anger, it turns to helplessness. It turns inward into depression for girls. For boys it's more likely to turn outwards into rebellious behavior and behavioral problems like drinking and fighting."
But Noh says pressure from within the family doesn't completely explain the shocking suicide statistics for young women like her sister.
She says American culture has adopted the myth that Asians are smarter and harder-working than other minorities.
"It's become a U.S.-based ideology, popular from the 1960s onward, that Asian-Americans are smarter, and should be doing well whether at school or work."
Noh added that simply being a minority can also lead to depression.
"My sister had a really low self-image. She thought of herself as ugly," she says. "We grew up in Houston in the '70s and '80s, and at that time in school there were very few Asian faces. The standard of beauty she wanted to emulate was white women." In college, Noh's sister had plastic surgery to make her eyes and nose appear more European-looking.
Heredity, Noh says, also plays a role. She says in her study, many of the suicidal women had mothers who were also suicidal. She says perhaps it's genetic -- some biochemical marker handed down from mother to daughter -- or perhaps it's the daughter observing the mother's behavior. "It makes sense. You model yourself after the parent of the same gender."
As varied as the causes of depression, Noh says she saw just as many approaches to overcoming it.
While some women in her study did seek help through counseling and prescription drugs, most of her subjects were ambivalent or even negative about counseling. "They felt the counselor couldn't understand their situation. They said it would have helped if the counselor were another Asian-American woman."
These women found help through their religious faith, herbs, acupuncture, or becoming involved in groups that help other Asian women.
"It shows the resourcefulness of these women," she says. "They had really diverse healing strategies."

[Banana]

This is actually the main story on cnn.com

[Tao]

^ yeah i was like...ummm really? this is more important than the situation in iraq?

i don't know how i feel about the article...i'm always afraid that somewhere some boonie is gonna say they have a high suicide rate cause they like to kill off their female newborns =/

[Deadpool]

This article is a load of crap.
I sense an alternative motive for CNN for putting out this article.
Probably to instill fear and neurosis into the Asian American community.
How is suicide within the Asian community any different than suicide in any other community.
CNN is trying to put an Asian face on suicide and is trying to make it seem like it is something exclusive to Asians.
Shame on CNN.

[AngryABCGirl]

I wouldn't go so far with the conspiracy theories about CNN, articles like these have been written by Asian American scholars for years, only they haven't been in the mainstream media.

I know the community doesn't like having it's dirty laundry aired, but it's a fact in our community that Asian women have an usually high suicide rate and the reasons written in the article, while not a fully encompassing perspective by any means, are true.

If anything, I'm glad that certain model minority stereotypes have had its lids blown off the cover recently year, by reasons good (Yul Kwon, Daniel Dae Kim, Heroes) and bad (Seung Cho).

Hopefully with more exposure, more Asian Americans will realize they aren't alone and get help before it's to late.

[USCTrojanzNo1]

I agree that it is not a particularly insightful article. But it does shed some light on how the pressures of living up to the "model minority" stereotype can take its psychological toll on Asian Americans.

I only wish there were some statistics to back this up. I really wish the reporters would probe deeply into this issue. Seems that many Asian Americans I've talked to (both in person and on-line, including this forum) are in one sense, "proud" of being the model minority because it gives them a sense of pride (though a by-product of this pride is that sometimes these people think they have the right to act like jerks because they are privileged to be the model minority). On the other hand, many Asian Americans who do not live up to the model minority image of being an Ivy League (or in 2007, a Michigan/Berkeley/Northwestern Top 25-ish school) educated individual making six figures in a white collar job by his late 20s feel ashamed and a disgrace to not just him/herself, but his/her family (and surrounding Asian community).

Unfortunately though, from my observations, one problem is that many Asian Americans themselves are not very sympathetic or compassionate to those who are struggling in life and are experiencing some sort of mental depression as a result of these struggles.

Overall, the article is OK. I for one am glad that they are shedding light on this problem. Then again, I'm sure that there are many Asian Americans who'd rather be known as the model minority and find that this stereotype is slowly being shattered.

[Banana]

Also, keep in mind that this article is old and there just filling it in for AA month.

And I have never heard how the Asian community shuns mental health care.

[SunWuKong]

And I have never heard how the Asian community shuns mental health care.

actually statistics show this. Asian Americans have the lowest in-patient rate, and of the out-patient pool, a bigger percentage of Asian Americans are shown to need professional help than other races.

[Napoleon Chynamite]

Actually I'm glad this article was printed for the viewing of a broader mainstream audience. Puts an end to all those people that like to romanticize the life of Asian people, or Asian women in particular due to prevailing stereotypes. The sad thing is that a lot of Asian men online buy into this also as they lament their own struggles and assume that Asian women live a life of drinking chaomomile (spelling?) tea and shitting rainbows.

[Space_Cabbage]

Asian chicks have it easy compared to asian guys. MUCH easier...

[j&j2]

The sad thing is that a lot of Asian men online buy into this also as they lament their own struggles and assume that Asian women live a life of drinking chaomomile (spelling?) tea and shitting rainbows.

While not to diminish the issues facing Asian-American women, where are the articles showing the suicide rates of Asian-Am males, etc.?

It's not, after all, like Asian-Am males don't face some of the same pressures (if not more so) to succeed academically, the "model minority" stereotype, not fitting the idealized version of what's considered attractive, etc.

By singling out Asian-Am women - this article, whether intentionally or not, seems to contribute to the stereotype of "Asian culture" oppressing Asian women.

For instance, in a study done on Asian adoptees in Sweden, the AMs had higher incidences of depression, suicide, joblessness, being umarried, etc. than either the ethnic Swedish male pop. and that of their (adopted) female counterparts.

(Btw, since when did pressure to succeed academically become just an Asian thing? What about immigrants from Africa, the Caribbean, Eastern Europe; UMC WASPS and Jews?)

[pikachupacabra]

Males typically have more actual suicides, but women typically have higher suicided attempts.

[USCTrojanzNo1]

(Btw, since when did pressure to succeed academically become just an Asian thing? What about immigrants from Africa, the Caribbean, Eastern Europe; UMC WASPS and Jews?)

This is definitely one of the most contentious points in this whole Asian American model minority debate. The pressure to succeed academically isn't necessarily exclusively an Asian thing, but it is definitely more predominant among Asians (particularly Chinese and Korean) and Jews (including those from Russia, Eastern Europe, etc.).

Although I speak only from anecdotal experience, the difference between East Asians and other ethnicities is that there is a lot more pressure for East Asians to attend elite institutions and get high paying white collar jobs after graduating. Many Black and Hispanic parents want their children to go to a school that makes them feel comfortable and get a good education. Asian parents often want their kids to go to Harvard or else they will completely be homeless and fail in life. Now granted, maybe I exaggerate a bit (nowadays, Asian parents only push their kids to go to Berkeley or UCLA) but there's definitely more emphasis on going to college for the prestige rather than feeling comfortable and getting a good education.

Likewise, there's more pressure for Asians to get high-paying white collar jobs (e.g. management consulting, investment banking, etc.) because Asians are pushed to get ahead and gain power in the elite. Asian parents (and indeed many Asians themselves) aspire to overtake the Jews as the most powerful and richest ethnicity in the nation.

[j&j2]

Although I speak only from anecdotal experience, the difference between East Asians and other ethnicities is that there is a lot more pressure for East Asians to attend elite institutions and get high paying white collar jobs after graduating.

I wonder who all the "crazy" parents in Manhattan are who wait in-line overnight to get the chance of paying $16,000 a year for their toddler's preschool?

Many WASPy parents (particularly in the affluent suburbs in the NE) also have a huge stake into whether their kids gets into an Ivy or peer university.

Many Black and Hispanic parents want their children to go to a school that makes them feel comfortable and get a good education. Asian parents often want their kids to go to Harvard or else they will completely be homeless and fail in life. Now granted, maybe I exaggerate a bit (nowadays, Asian parents only push their kids to go to Berkeley or UCLA) but there's definitely more emphasis on going to college for the prestige rather than feeling comfortable and getting a good education.

Not for black immigrants from Africa or the Caribbean - where the kids are pushed hard (if anything, this pressure is more of an immigrant thing) and have a similar "model minority" stereotype (except in this case, they are aggressively pursued by the elite universities and admitted at a significantly higher rate than Asian immigrant kids).

[AngryABCGirl]

Asian chicks have it easy compared to asian guys. MUCH easier...

What's with the oppression olympics? Have you experienced being an Asian woman?

[Paradox]

What's with the oppression olympics? Have you experienced being an Asian woman?

I agree his comment was baseless and way off the mark. I am really curious as to what the suicide rate for Asian-American males are though. I think overall asian males have expectations foisted on them but in a different way so that rate may actually be a lot smaller compared with other ethnic minority males.

I did have a cousin (male) who did talk of suicide before but most of us DO seem to externalize a lot of our anger. I see a lot of the "thug life" asians as just that..

[eos]

it's not just anger though. guys are raised not to cry, not to express any "girly" feelings or whatever. so feelings of sadness and depression are kept way deep down inside, not having an outlet.

unless you're my bf's stupid brother who complains about everything and everyone and whose last name is lai (you'd understand that last part if you're from hk or are canto.)

[SunWuKong]

I agree his comment was baseless and way off the mark. I am really curious as to what the suicide rate for Asian-American males are though. I think overall asian males have expectations foisted on them but in a different way so that rate may actually be a lot smaller compared with other ethnic minority males.

I did have a cousin (male) who did talk of suicide before but most of us DO seem to externalize a lot of our anger. I see a lot of the "thug life" asians as just that..

here you go:
http://www.cdc.gov/men/lcod.htm

the national rate of suicide as the cause of death for men in general is 2.1. for white men, it's 2.2. for Asian men, it's 2.3.

[Paradox]

here you go:
http://www.cdc.gov/men/lcod.htm

the national rate of suicide as the cause of death for men in general is 2.1. for white men, it's 2.2. for Asian men, it's 2.3.
It's the range that I thought it would be. I guessed it was higher than the average "white" category but maybe the same or lower than other ethnic males. I notice hispanic males have a 2.5, Native Americans/inuits 3.8!, and for some reason the stat is omitted for african-americans. Interesting.

[SunWuKong]

It's the range that I thought it would be. I guessed it was higher than the average "white" category but maybe the same or lower than other ethnic males. I notice hispanic males have a 2.5, Native Americans/inuits 3.8!, and for some reason the stat is omitted for african-americans. Interesting.

that's the top ten causes of death. apparently, suicide is not one of the top ten causes of death for black men. for Asian men, it's just 0.1% higher than whites, and 0.2% higher than the national male average.

[SunWuKong]

alright i've moved some posts to a newly merged thread:
http://forums.yellowworld.org/showthread.php?t=32686

please try to keep this thread free of IR discussions. i'd like the topic to remain about suicide and mental illness in the Asian American community. and if you want to bring up that Asian guys are killing themselves because they're not getting laid, you can post that up in the IR thread instead of here. thanks.

[USCTrojanzNo1]

Another problem I see is that Asians do not exactly elicit sympathy from others. Whenever blacks or hispanics are struggling through life, people always feel sorry for them because the assumption is that they grew up in poor neighborhoods with broken families.

On the other hand, when Asians are struggling through life, people are a lot less sympathetic to them. They think, what the f*** is wrong with this guy? He's suppose to be the model minority. Also, another difference is that blacks are much more willing to support each other through trying times. Asians on the other hand, point fingers at the less successful ones and say that they are a disgrace to the Asian community.

in many ways, Asians need as much sympathy as others. But they receive it a lot less because needing sympathy (or even being sympathetic to others) is tantamount to weakness.

[Paradox]

On the other hand, when Asians are struggling through life, people are a lot less sympathetic to them. They think, what the f*** is wrong with this guy? He's suppose to be the model minority. Also, another difference is that blacks are much more willing to support each other through trying times. Asians on the other hand, point fingers at the less successful ones and say that they are a disgrace to the Asian community.
This is true and which is why I believe the AA cause is pretty broken from the start. It's a pan-asian movement that is trying to unite people that come from very ethnocentric native cultures. African-Americans and regionalized hispanic americans have a huge advantage in "unity" because of their shared heritage. African-americans were mostly brought over as slaves so they have a common ancestral bond. Hispanics are more "regionalized" in that Mexican-Americans or Puerto-rican Americans tend to congregate in one area.

AA's don't have that advantage at all..our numbers are miniscule and it's easy to disperse/isolate us in the cultural mileu. Not to mention the innate ethnocentrism of various asian cultures makes even pan-asian unity an unlikelihood. Then when you consider western white culture's influence in denigrating our role in society then it becomes apparent why so many AA's have issues.

[eos]

goooooooooodddddddd.....i feel so depressed now.

i want to kill myself.

[sageb1]

i am depressed right now too.

my best friend died at year ago. another friend died in january 2007. and to top it off my father died on May 2, 2007.

when i came into work today at the virgin mobile festival at TBird Stadium at UBC, I said "I'm in mourning. My dad died on May 2."

not a word from the owner's sister.

no compassion at all.

asian people have a low incidence of schizophrenia. most of us have a major depressive disorder, sometimes with psychosis.

however, our homelands treat the mentally ill like 2nd-class citizens. in china, a typical insane asylum is worse than our prisons. in some asylums, patients may be chained. in Japan, anyone who gets put in a mental hospital spends up to 406 days in it. and the shrinks tend to give you typical anti-psychotics which cause unnecessary side effects with a needle.

as well, depression can be treated early, not when a psychosis send them to the psychward.

the clues are simple: sleeping most of the day away in bed and deterioating attendence to personal hygiene.

and the top reason why social workers and counsellors do not screen for depression: it's frustrating trying to get a depressive out of bed to come for an appointment.

also depressives are intensely realistic: they can analyze any situation to the point of nearly depressing everyone with their detail.

[SunWuKong]

my best friend died at year ago. another friend died in january 2007. and to top it off my father died on May 2, 2007.

sorry for your loss.