Do You Speak Your Asian Language?

[Hiroshi2]

I got the idea from a poll of the day or whatever they call it on hapas.com. So, mixed asians, do you speak the language of your asian side? I wondered this also because my dad said that most Ameriasians (and yes he did actually use that word, I hate it personally) are billingual. So I wanted to see just how true this is, because I don't think it is. As for me, it would be barely. I understand very basic Japanese, but more than someone who has never studied the language before and can only utter out a poorly pronounced "ko-ni-chi-wa."

[SunWuKong]

this poll (and also hapas.com) is likely to be skewed because mixed asians that are not "in touch" with their asian side probably wouldn't go to asian oriented sites.

[BeTheReds]

I agree with him. Tho being in touch with your asian side and knowing your language are not exactly the same thing, they do have some sort of connection.

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by BeTheReds@Nov 19 2002, 12:06 AM
I agree with him. Tho being in touch with your asian side and knowing your language are not exactly the same thing, they do have some sort of connection.
good point

[Elizabeth A.]

Originally posted by BeTheReds@Nov 18 2002, 09:06 PM
Tho being in touch with your asian side and knowing your language are not exactly the same thing, they do have some sort of connection.
I agree with you. I can count to ten and say "hello" in Hindi, but that's it. Culture and language are very much connected. My father never taught me any Hindi, just like he barely taught me anything about Indian culture. I think he wanted me to be the 1950's definition of "all American", speaking only English.

However, I am fairly competent in Russian (took it in high school) and now I'm learning French.

[Hiroshi2]

All of those are good points, but yes everyone must realize that language is culture. They are very closely knit, to know a language (or its various dialects) is to be familar with the culture of those who speak it.

SunWuKing, I'd have to disagree. With people who are hapa (or mixed at all) they rarely can ever ignore one of their "sides". It's not something that goes away, believe me. So many mixed asians who are "out of touch" with their asian side may just be looking for a site like this.

[BeTheReds]

Originally posted by Hiroshi2@Nov 20 2002, 01:13 AM


SunWuKing, I'd have to disagree. With people who are hapa (or mixed at all) they rarely can ever ignore one of their "sides". It's not something that goes away, believe me. So many mixed asians who are "out of touch" with their asian side may just be looking for a site like this.
No, I'd still have to agree with sunwukung.
I can understand why mixed people with no grasp of their Asian side might go to a site like hapas.com, but the only ones who would hang around yellowworld are the ones who at least have a slight interest in their asian side. These would be the ones more likely to speak the language of their Asian parent.

And speaking the language of the Asian parent might actually be the reason they are in touch with their asian side so the two could possibly be functions of each other, tho no doubt there are lots of people who don't speak the language who are interested in their asianness.

Some one not in touch with their asianness.. (excuse the term) whitewashed, wouldn't look for Asian sites at all.

[Hiroshi2]

Originally posted by BeTheReds@Nov 19 2002, 05:46 PM
Originally posted by Hiroshi2@Nov 20 2002, 01:13 AM


SunWuKing, I'd have to disagree. With people who are hapa (or mixed at all) they rarely can ever ignore one of their "sides". It's not something that goes away, believe me. So many mixed asians who are "out of touch" with their asian side may just be looking for a site like this.
No, I'd still have to agree with sunwukung.
I can understand why mixed people with no grasp of their Asian side might go to a site like hapas.com, but the only ones who would hang around yellowworld are the ones who at least have a slight interest in their asian side. These would be the ones more likely to speak the language of their Asian parent.

And speaking the language of the Asian parent might actually be the reason they are in touch with their asian side so the two could possibly be functions of each other, tho no doubt there are lots of people who don't speak the language who are interested in their asianness.

Some one not in touch with their asianness.. (excuse the term) whitewashed, wouldn't look for Asian sites at all.
The poll doesn't seem to agree with you guys too much. The majority of those who voted say they can barely speak their asian language, or don't speak it at all, and you may be able to conclude, are out of touch with their asian side.

Unless, of course, they're asian american and/or have asian american friends. Thus there is no need to speak any asian language.

[BeTheReds]

Originally posted by Hiroshi2@Nov 21 2002, 12:58 AM
Originally posted by BeTheReds@Nov 19 2002, 05:46 PM
tho no doubt there are lots of people who don't speak the language who are interested in their asianness.



The poll doesn't seem to agree with you guys too much. The majority of those who voted say they can barely speak their asian language, or don't speak it at all, and you may be able to conclude, are out of touch with their asian side.

Unless, of course, they're asian american and/or have asian american friends. Thus there is no need to speak any asian language.
I never claimed that not being able to speak an asian language means you are not in touch with your white side. see my quote?

I was simply stating that people who knew an asian language that they learned from their parents would likely be more in touch with their asian-ness, and people who are more in touch with their asian-ness would be more likely to want to know an asian language.

I think that there are plenty tho who are in touch with their asian-ness who don't speak an asian language and that's fine too.

[angel nympho]

I speak enough of it to understand most of the stuff I hear. But not answer back.

[BeTheReds]

Now I think perhaps the poll results are skewed, as this was supposed to be for mixed asians.

Not that your input isn't welcome. :lol:

[Craig]

How do you guys (and/or gals) classify those that are language capable in another (or other) Asian language(s), but not the language of their Asian ancestry ?

[angel nympho]

:o oops!

[BeTheReds]

Originally posted by Craig@Nov 21 2002, 02:00 AM
How do you guys (and/or gals) classify those that are language capable in another (or other) Asian language(s), but not the language of their Asian ancestry ?
Read the topic thread

YOUR..

I answered it for Korean, not for Japanese.

[scott]

I've been actively trying to learn Corean for about two years now in my spare time (I'm half-Corean of course). I can't spend the time on it that I would like to but I can have a basic conversation on some minimal level, although I still cannot understand movies and TV yet.

Forum polls are ridiculously inaccurate though, no matter what the question is. A lot of forum users don't even look at them (like myself). The discussion is where the truth lies.

[Hiroshi2]

Originally posted by BeTheReds@Nov 20 2002, 06:06 PM
Originally posted by Craig@Nov 21 2002, 02:00 AM
How do you guys (and/or gals) classify those that are language capable in another (or other) Asian language(s), but not the language of their Asian ancestry ?
Read the topic thread

YOUR..

I answered it for Korean, not for Japanese.
I didn't put quite that much thought into it, but yeah I pretty much was addressing it to mixed asians and your language as in the language that half or part of your family speaks.

Actually, the poll could be for asian-americans too I guess, since they'd grow up speaking english primiarly, right? oh well, it's no big deal just curious i guess.

I think i see what you're talking about, bethereds.

[YuheiCarreau]

Originally posted by angel nympho@Nov 20 2002, 07:40 PM
I speak enough of it to understand most of the stuff I hear. But not answer back.
Yeah, me too. But I'm taking Japanese now... My twin sister started at Japanese 2 (actually she tested into 3 but she thought it was too tough), me I started with 1. First time I've gotten an A since I don't know how long...

[Hiroshi2]

Originally posted by YuheiCarreau@Nov 20 2002, 08:35 PM
Originally posted by angel nympho@Nov 20 2002, 07:40 PM
I speak enough of it to understand most of the stuff I hear.  But not answer back.
Yeah, me too. But I'm taking Japanese now... My twin sister started at Japanese 2 (actually she tested into 3 but she thought it was too tough), me I started with 1. First time I've gotten an A since I don't know how long...
Hey that reminds me of something I wanted to ask.

When I go to uni, i want to take a japanese-language course. as a black/asian, black hapa whatever how do you think the reaction will be? (Please by honest.) I expect to see a crowd full of whites and asians, and i know from past experience that i'll stand out like a sore thumb and the situation could turn out not-so-good.

[BeTheReds]

Originally posted by Hiroshi2@Nov 21 2002, 05:07 AM

Hey that reminds me of something I wanted to ask.

When I go to uni, i want to take a japanese-language course. as a black/asian, black hapa whatever how do you think the reaction will be? (Please by honest.) I expect to see a crowd full of whites and asians, and i know from past experience that i'll stand out like a sore thumb and the situation could turn out not-so-good.
Nope, in my classes plenty of black people were there for the earlier levels.

Only saw one blasian though.

Most of the people in there won't give you shit for being blasian. The white ones especially will tend to be more culturally sensitive than the average and not give you shit. Tho some will be annoyingly asiaphilic, but it's all about if that bothers you.

The Asians on the other hand will possibly give you shit and think that they are superior because they are ASians learning an Asian language, and because of that they have an edge on you. If they are fluent in Korean then they actually do have an edge over you because of similar grammar and pronunciation and kanji compounds. If they are chinese and can read, then they will have an edge over you because of kanji. If they are not fluent in either Korean and JApanese, they will still think they have an edge over you because the have the i am more asian than you will ever be attitude.. but these people also are as quick to drop out of J class like the otakus and asiaphiles when they learn that learning a language is hard work.

[Hiroshi2]

Originally posted by BeTheReds@Nov 20 2002, 09:15 PM
Originally posted by Hiroshi2@Nov 21 2002, 05:07 AM

Hey that reminds me of something I wanted to ask.

When I go to uni, i want to take a japanese-language course. as a black/asian, black hapa whatever how do you think the reaction will be? (Please by honest.) I expect to see a crowd full of whites and asians, and i know from past experience that i'll stand out like a sore thumb and the situation could turn out not-so-good.
Nope, in my classes plenty of black people were there for the earlier levels.

Only saw one blasian though.

Most of the people in there won't give you shit for being blasian. The white ones especially will tend to be more culturally sensitive than the average and not give you shit. Tho some will be annoyingly asiaphilic, but it's all about if that bothers you.

The Asians on the other hand will possibly give you shit and think that they are superior because they are ASians learning an Asian language, and because of that they have an edge on you. If they are fluent in Korean then they actually do have an edge over you because of similar grammar and pronunciation and kanji compounds. If they are chinese and can read, then they will have an edge over you because of kanji. If they are not fluent in either Korean and JApanese, they will still think they have an edge over you because the have the i am more asian than you will ever be attitude.. but these people also are as quick to drop out of J class like the otakus and asiaphiles when they learn that learning a language is hard work.
Thanks for sharing your experience.

About the asiaphile thing, yeah it does bother me actually. But other things bother me worse, and i'll try to handle it, i'm sure i can.

I've met a couple of black guys that wanted to learn japanese because of an interest in anime, etc. And in case you're wondering, yes, they would come up and ask me things about the language seeing that i'm half-japanese and all. and i'd be able to help them out with the basic stuff, but nothing complicated.

I definitely won't be the one who's dropping out after the first few lessons. Learning japanese means being able to communicate with my half of my family whom i can't communicate with right now because of language barriers. It's very important to me.

[noriko]

hiroshi, i think you definitely have the right attitude:). And seriously, don't worry about the other people in the class. one of my best friends, who is black/native american, has taken japanese at our college and studied abroad at a japanese university, and has never encountered any insurpassible race-related issues. Yeah, there are some people who ask her why she wants to learn japanese, but no more so than they would ask any other non-asian-appearing person. tons of non-asian people at my school take japanese courses, for many reasons (liking anime seems to be a big one i guess; also people who are interested in literature, business, or religion), and everyone else in the class is completely cool with it as long as they're there to learn!:)

(and there's only two or three japanese people at all, counting me, in any of the japanese classes! so non-japanese are definitely in the majority)

[axi0m]

I'm not sure if I consider myself able to speak Japanese fluently, but I'm not sure I consider myself able to speak English fluently either hehe. However, anything I say in English I can say in Japanese so I guess that constitutes fluency.

-Satoshi-

[SunWuKong]

heheh i think some non-mixed asians have voted in the poll and screwed it up...

[maldito]

Originally posted by Hiroshi2@Nov 20 2002, 01:13 AM
All of those are good points, but yes everyone must realize that language is culture. They are very closely knit, to know a language (or its various dialects) is to be familar with the culture of those who speak it.
I couldn't agree with you more.


With people who are hapa (or mixed at all) they rarely can ever ignore one of their "sides". It's not something that goes away, believe me. So many mixed asians who are "out of touch" with their asian side may just be looking for a site like this.


I think you're right. But one thing I notice, everyone focuses on the Asian side. How many (depending on their ancestry/ethnicity) speak the language of their non-Asian side? First of all, my grandmother who raised me spoke Cebuano, a Filipino language. I never spoke it but could understand her, but that was many years ago. I wish I was more agressive about it, so now of course I regret it.

However, I did manage to learn the language of my Portuguese side. It's easier though. *L*

[AliBabaIncorporated]

Originally posted by maldito@Nov 23 2002, 07:45 AM
I think you're right.  But one thing I notice, everyone focuses on the Asian side.  How many (depending on their ancestry/ethnicity) speak the language of their non-Asian side?  First of all, my grandmother who raised me spoke Cebuano, a Filipino language.  I never spoke it but could understand her, but that was many years ago.  I wish I was more agressive about it, so now of course I regret it.

However, I did manage to learn the language of my Portuguese side.  It's easier though. *L*
hah, but how many white people speak the language of their European ancestors? and for those that do, how many of them actually learned that language from their relatives and co-ethnic friends, as opposed to always speaking in English at home and then learning the language in classes at school? I'd venture to say that number is incredibly low, because of the low levels of European immigration to America for the past 4 generations. If we're talking about a mixed-Asian kid of a Russian immigrant and a Korean immigrant, that's another thing entirely, but the overwhelming majority of mixed-Asian kids in the US do not have any immigrant white ancestors who are actually alive while they are growing up, because they've all been passed away for decades.

As for me, I speak German and French as well as my dad's parents did - that is to say, I don't, except for isolated words and phrases. Similarly, I speak Chinese only somewhat worse than my great-uncle did. So I don't consider it an imbalance.

[luv]

**hesitant to post because I'm not a hapa***

I really doubt this is the same problem, but my father's side of the family speaks toishan -- which I think is a really loud Cantonese dialect where most conversations sound like arguments and many words sound like swears. I pretty much grew up watching HK tv (where I learned all my Cantonese) and my mother speaks HK Cantonese. Didn't actually learn English until I was 5 or 6. Funny cuz all the Asian kids (notwithstanding the fact that they were all American Born -- various bunch of Chinese, Vietnamese, Indian, Japanese) were put into an ESL class in elementary school where we recited the alphabet for 2 years like handicapped kids.

So I've always felt closer to my mother because we both spoke HK Cantonese. And I have less tolerance with older white folks because I would refer to my years in ESL.

[kimpossible]

Originally posted by Hiroshi2@Nov 20 2002, 09:07 PM
Hey that reminds me of something I wanted to ask.

When I go to uni, i want to take a japanese-language course. as a black/asian, black hapa whatever how do you think the reaction will be? (Please by honest.) I expect to see a crowd full of whites and asians, and i know from past experience that i'll stand out like a sore thumb and the situation could turn out not-so-good.
You'd be like most heritage learners, I imagine. We need Japanese to communicate with family members so I think we tend to have different motivation than a lot of the other students who take it for business or they think it's cool. I don't know what your Japanese class will look like but mine was mostly Taiwanese and Korean students and they treat me like an American.

The way I tend to approach relationships with Asians is assume they don't see me as Asian. *shrug* I'm not really sure you'd have any specific problems being black/Japanese in a Japanese class. You may have ppl curious and want to ask questions. Japan is a different story though. You may encounter old schoolers who are unapologetically racist (different social rules, right? no political correctness) but to be honest, eurasians get the same thing. I can also tell you because we represent the American and International element in Japanese universities, you'll most likely be pimped by some school officials to represent how 'international' and 'diverse' their school is. This happens a lot.

Hiroshi, do not worry about what people will think about you. You're doing the right thing for you, your education and for your family. No matter what we're mixed with, all mixed Japanese kids have an extremely tough time trying link up with our Japanese heritage because the Japanese sense of nationality and identity is so stringent.

It took me about a decade to become at ease with the truth that I'm just Asian enough to understand how much of a foreigner I really am. Keep your eyes on the goal and listen to yourself.

ganbatte.

[Hiroshi2]

Originally posted by Hello_Hapa@Nov 28 2002, 10:42 AM
I can also tell you because we represent the American and International element in Japanese universities, you'll most likely be pimped by some school officials to represent how 'international' and 'diverse' their school is. This happens a lot.

I'm not worried about that too much. I've had that happen to me before because suburban white schools saw me as a black kid from the inner-city who happened to make very good grades on standardized tests, etc. so it's like, "why don't you come to our school, we offer special scholarships for african-americans, etc." That was before they ever knew i was half-asian.

I remember the first time i called my uncle in japan, and he expected me to be fluent in nihongo apparently, because he just started talking in japanese, but he lost me at moshimoshi :P I remember feeling embarassed, cause he switched over to english and asked me "you speak no japanese" in a kind of dissapointing tone.

Anyway, thanks guys for the encouragement. I expect japan to be totally different from america, as a matter of fact i know it is. It's like i'd have a totally different mindset when in japan, i know that it is not america, unlike many americans who i know expect the entire world to be like the US, but of course, that isn't true and is really a topic for another thread........

[angel nympho]

I tried taking a launguage class. It was just embarassing. I was, like, the only Korean person in there who didn't know shit about Korean.

[loserbutt]

I'm fluent in english. as for mandarin and taiwanese.... well I have to take two years of language courses for my major so I'll be taking 2 years of chinese.... ack memorization of 5000 characters.....

[kimpossible]

Originally posted by angel nympho@Nov 28 2002, 12:30 PM
I tried taking a launguage class. It was just embarassing. I was, like, the only Korean person in there who didn't know shit about Korean.
I once took a Mandarin class with elementary school children. That so did not work, but it was a humbling experience and one of those unique Asian American generational tales. I remembered a story of my grandmother hunched up at a schooldesk, attending elementary school with my mother in Japan. Don't think there were English schools back in day.

This thought came to me as I sat hunched at a miniature desk learning Mandarin with elementary school children. That and extreme guilt and embarrassment for all the times I teased my grandmother for not speaking English.

Talk about coming full circle.

[AliBabaIncorporated]

Originally posted by loserbutt@Nov 29 2002, 04:42 AM
I'm fluent in english. as for mandarin and taiwanese.... well I have to take two years of language courses for my major so I'll be taking 2 years of chinese.... ack memorization of 5000 characters.....
the number of characters they make you memorize in 2 years of college level chinese is usually around 500-800, so don't worry too much. however, this will unfortunately leave you unable to read absolutely anything except your textbook. but, you will see all those cool cross-sectional diagrams of the human mouth which are useful to learn to draw if you ever go into linguistics.

in general language pedagogy in America is in a pretty sad state.

[noriko]

it really is sad how pathetic language education in america can be. I was literally amazed to find that most people, after 6 years of French, could not even have a conversation or read a book that was meant for someone over 12 years old. Seriously, I'm not kidding.

why is it that in many other countries, almost everyone knows three or four languages fluently-- but most american-born U.S. citizens seem to barely know 1?

ok done ranting...sorry:)

[Hiroshi2]

Americans have an *attitude* that everyone else in the world should speak english.

If it makes you feel better, i know people who took french for one year and could do what you mentioned above. And they weren't geniuses or anything like that.

[babysakura]

i'm not hapa, but pure chinese, so i can speak

mandarin (mum)
hainan (maternal grandparents)
hokkien (paternal grandparents)
cantonese (friends)
teochew (god-ma)

and i picked up some jap in my first year at uni..took classes

[angel nympho]

Originally posted by Hiroshi2@Nov 29 2002, 04:22 AM
Americans have an *attitude* that everyone else in the world should speak english.
Americans have an "attitude" that everyone who wants to sucessfully live and work in AMERICA should speak English... seeing that it's the national language. And I am one of them.

I don't think Americans go to other countries, look at the people who live there, and say "Damn, these fuckers should learn to speak fuckin' English" while they're asking for directions.

[Hiroshi2]

Originally posted by angel nympho@Nov 28 2002, 08:44 PM
I don't think Americans go to other countries, look at the people who live there, and say "Damn, these fuckers should learn to speak fuckin' English" while they're asking for directions.
Actually, many americans do. I wasn't talking about what language you speak here at home, but rather what you expect people to speak abroad. I've met quite a few people who traveled abroad to non-english speaking countries who came back and said things like "Oh it was nice but they should've spoken some fucking english!" WTF??? you were a visitor in their country, dumbass. :pissed:

[SunWuKong]

Originally posted by angel nympho@Nov 28 2002, 11:44 PM
Americans have an "attitude" that everyone who wants to sucessfully live and work in AMERICA should speak English... seeing that it's the national language. And I am one of them.

I don't think Americans go to other countries, look at the people who live there, and say "Damn, these fuckers should learn to speak fuckin' English" while they're asking for directions.
actually there are plenty of americans that do expect people to speak english when they go to a foreign country...

[iris]

I'm an American and an Americanphile, but I totally understand what you mean SWK. When I went to France, there were these two American ladies screaming at a train conductor because he couldn't speak English. I was like, "Ladies, you're in France. He speaks French. He doesn't have to speak English." I ended up translating for them, but it was so rude. <_<

[AliBabaIncorporated]

Originally posted by SunWuKung@Nov 29 2002, 01:36 PM
actually there are plenty of americans that do expect people to speak english when they go to a foreign country...
The English-worship in some overseas countries doesn't help either. As much as I make fun of French (mainly cuz my sister speaks it :P), sometimes I wish Japan were more like France on the language issue. Have a government ministry devoted to stamping out the more egregiously stupid direct English loanwords (yes I know this is a highly anti-libertarian attitude), and have people perfectly willing to get disgusted at you for not speaking the local language after months or years in the country. Compare to Japan, freakin katakanaized English overrunning the language (I can't really complain about it that much in everyday speech, but in technical writing? gggaaah) and people praising you for your Japanese skill when you order orange juice without making grammatical mistakes. Oh yeah, and the Diet proposing brilliant ideas like making English an official language alongside Japanese cuz English is needed to communicate with the increasing number of foreign immigrants to Japan.

Originally posted by Noriko@Nov 29 2002, 11:46 AM

why is it that in many other countries, almost everyone knows three or four languages fluently-- but most american-born U.S. citizens seem to barely know 1?

Americans have the attitude that if you need a foreign-language speaker, you can hire a foreigner. This is easily reinforced by high levels of immigration. Like just about everywhere else, we expect our permanent residents to learn the local language (in some cases to less of an extent than other countries), so we don't bother learning theirs' (again, the same as most other countries: Europeans learn the languages of other European countries, which are linguistically quite close and easily reinforced cuz in many border areas you can pick up TV signals from the next country over, but we don't see many French people learning Arabic, Germans learning Turkish, or British learning Urdu. Japanese people claim they should learn English to communicate with all the foreigners in their country, but most of said foreigners are actually Koreans, Chinese, or Iranians).

Furthermore, America is an abnormally large country, area-wise. Unlike Europe where people will take a drive into a neighboring country to take advantage of lower prices on wine or petrol, most people in America would have to drive for days or take a plane before reaching a place where they'd have to use a foreign language. Many of the multilingual Europeans we meet in US universities are members of the upper middle class - so of course they've had lots of travelling experience and a high-quality education from early childhood. And in Europe, a high-quality education necessarily includes an emphasis on the English language, which is valuable for business. In America, foreign-language isn't one of the top things parents are thinking about when enrolling their children in schools - math and science are. As a result, most kids don't start studying a foreign language until way past the time when it would be easy for them to pick it up just through osmosis.

So basically, language pedagogy in America sucks because there aren't enough people demanding it get better. Chinese afternoon/weekend schools which graduate illiterate students are an annoyance but not a giant outrage, because they aren't the make-or-break difference for a kid's economic future. University language classes invariably aim at the lowest common denominator - the guys who want a few phrases for use at the disco - and hence move incredibly slowly to accomodate their pace.

[angel nympho]

Originally posted by SunWuKung@Nov 29 2002, 05:36 AM
Originally posted by angel nympho@Nov 28 2002, 11:44 PM
Americans have an "attitude" that everyone who wants to sucessfully live and work in AMERICA should speak English... seeing that it's the national language. And I am one of them.

I don't think Americans go to other countries, look at the people who live there, and say "Damn, these fuckers should learn to speak fuckin' English" while they're asking for directions.
actually there are plenty of americans that do expect people to speak english when they go to a foreign country...
Some retarded ass shit. I didn't know people were THAT stupid.


It's one thing to speak to foreigners in English and pray that they understand you... it's completely different when you get PISSED and BLAME THEM for not knowing what you're saying. In a foreign country, you should realize that heyyyyyy, they do things different here..... *duhhhh*

[iris]

Right on Angel.

[angel nympho]

Originally posted by iris@Nov 29 2002, 08:26 AM
Right on Angel.
If some fucked up bastard came into a restaurant or something I was eating at all hollering in some funky language about how we should ALL be speaking his language, I'd knock him into tomorrow.

[Craig]

Originally posted by AliBabaIncorporated@Nov 29 2002, 03:23 AM
In America, foreign-language isn't one of the top things parents are thinking about when enrolling their children in schools - math and science are.
My impression is that most Americans (especially older Americans) don't give a rat's a*s about education. I don't think they care about most subjects, but I think math and science are further down on their list than foreign languages.

[AliBabaIncorporated]

Originally posted by Craig@Nov 29 2002, 05:07 PM
My impression is that most Americans (especially older Americans) don't give a rat's a*s about education. I don't think they care about most subjects, but I think math and science are further down on their list than foreign languages.
eh. that's a rather unfair characterization. Most middle-class homebuyers expecting children choose where to live precisely on the basis of the quality of the schools therein. Highly ranked public schools can push housing prices in a district up very high - this would not be the case if people didn't care about education.

[angel nympho]

Originally posted by Craig@Nov 29 2002, 09:07 AM
My impression is that most Americans (especially older Americans) don't give a rat's a*s about education. I don't think they care about most subjects, but I think math and science are further down on their list than foreign languages.
I don't think that's true. I think most people care VERY MUCH about the quality of the schools they're sending their children to.

[Hiroshi2]

Originally posted by AliBabaIncorporated@Nov 29 2002, 12:23 AM
The English-worship in some overseas countries doesn't help either. As much as I make fun of French (mainly cuz my sister speaks it :P), sometimes I wish Japan were more like France on the language issue. Have a government ministry devoted to stamping out the more egregiously stupid direct English loanwords (yes I know this is a highly anti-libertarian attitude), and have people perfectly willing to get disgusted at you for not speaking the local language after months or years in the country. Compare to Japan, freakin katakanaized English overrunning the language (I can't really complain about it that much in everyday speech, but in technical writing? gggaaah) and people praising you for your Japanese skill when you order orange juice without making grammatical mistakes. Oh yeah, and the Diet proposing brilliant ideas like making English an official language alongside Japanese cuz English is needed to communicate with the increasing number of foreign immigrants to Japan.


Sounds a bit like the situation with the spanish language here in the states, actually. But I can understand what you're saying about retaining the japanese language in the culture as opposed to more americanizing.

[Grass Monkey]

I can only understand what's being said. half of the time. In Cantonese. But I can't speak a damn word of it.

[luv]

Originally posted by Craig@Nov 29 2002, 09:07 AM
My impression is that most Americans (especially older Americans) don't give a rat's a*s about education. I don't think they care about most subjects, but I think math and science are further down on their list than foreign languages.
I think that its really a class issue. Some people will put their unborn fetuses on preschool waiting lists, while others are just glad to have some place to put their kids for 8 -10 hours while they go to work. Its really sad, but its the truth, especially when the parents didn't even graduate high school.

Schools are terribly underfunded, so I'm pretty sure the language and music departments goes way before the phy. ed. department. So for English speaking households, they might not even be thinking about other languages, cuz they think their kids will grow up like them and never use a word of it. Globalization...Damn foreigners...