Chinese football players

[syc]

anyone here follow soccer anywhere around the world? My boys Sun Jihai and Li Tie are both playing very well. Everton (Li Tie) are fourth in the league and Man City (Sun Jihai) are coming up the table. Sun scored his first goal a while ago. Chinese football is coming up in the world.

[MellowDrama]

Li Tie is very good, but I was actually surprised he got to start since the opening game and has basically stayed there. But he has proven himself and deserves it. Now if only Li Weifeng could get some playing time.

Sun is also an excellent defender. Qu Bo was supposed to go to Tottenham, but England has that retarded rule on foreigners on how they have to be capped for a certain number of games, so the deal was shot down. He'll probably be put on next year.

[Mr T]

Originally posted by syc@Nov 18 2002, 09:39 AM
Chinese football is coming up in the world.
I disagree

[Mr T]

Originally posted by MellowDrama@Nov 18 2002, 10:14 AM
Li Tie is very good, but I was actually surprised he got to start since the opening game and has basically stayed there. But he has proven himself and deserves it. Now if only Li Weifeng could get some playing time.


Chinese players are'nt 'that' (let's be objective here) good to be honest. If they were 'that' good they'd be playing for the likes of AC Milan, Real Madrid and Barcelona. At the moment I rate Japanese (No.1 Asian) and S Korean (No.2 Asian) players above them. Of course, the very best players in the world are joint Brazilian and Argentinian.

[syc]

China's level is still low i know. But we arent far apart from Japan and Korea either. Japan have a bunch of players in Europe but where do Koreans play? In Belgium? Does anyone besides Belgians care about that league? Li Tie and Sun Jihai are doing much better than other Koreans. Ahn Jung Hwan couldnt even get signed in England.

[SunWuKong]

... do i hear a can of worms opening? :unsure:

[amietron]

Kailee Wong. :)

Chinese-American. =X

[MellowDrama]

Originally posted by syc@Nov 18 2002, 03:50 PM
China's level is still low i know. But we arent far apart from Japan and Korea either. Japan have a bunch of players in Europe but where do Koreans play? In Belgium? Does anyone besides Belgians care about that league? Li Tie and Sun Jihai are doing much better than other Koreans. Ahn Jung Hwan couldnt even get signed in England.
To be honest, Ahn would have gone to Blackburn but for the same retarded English rule that spiked Qu Bo's chances to go to Tottenham.

Also, the K-League team bosses are @$$holes and aren't letting their players go to Europe, but things may be changing, and many are rumored to be getting their releases in January. A few should wind up in the Netherlands at either PSV, where Guus Hiddink is the coach is ex-S. Korea coach, or Feyenoord, which is heavily scouting Asian players. They are rumored to be scouting for Koreans and Japanese playing in the J-League, and they already boast a Korean, Chong gug Song, and a Japanese, Shinji Ono, in their starting lineup.

[Craig]

Originally posted by amietron@Nov 18 2002, 05:47 PM
Kailee Wong. :)

Chinese-American. =X
Amie,

They mean "international" football => "soccer".

[BeTheReds]

Originally posted by syc@Nov 18 2002, 09:50 PM
China's level is still low i know. But we arent far apart from Japan and Korea either. Japan have a bunch of players in Europe but where do Koreans play? In Belgium? Does anyone besides Belgians care about that league? Li Tie and Sun Jihai are doing much better than other Koreans. Ahn Jung Hwan couldnt even get signed in England.
Cha Doo Ri plays in Germany... tho he grew up there and is in the process of changing citizenship.

Ahn Jung Hwan Played in Seria-A (Italy), then he was gonna play for Blackburn Rovers in England, but had visa problem. So now he plays in the Shimizu S-Pulse in the J-League.

Choi Sung Yung played in Austria

Seol Ki Hyun in Belgium

You can say that those two are doing fine representing China in England, but how many WC goals does China have?

[Craig]

Originally posted by BeTheReds@Nov 18 2002, 07:27 PM
You can say that those two are doing fine representing China in England, but how many WC goals does China have?
During the last World Cup, it seems to be the exact same number as the previous champions France ... :D

[BeTheReds]

Originally posted by Craig@Nov 19 2002, 12:51 AM
Originally posted by BeTheReds@Nov 18 2002, 07:27 PM
You can say that those two are doing fine representing China in England,  but how many WC goals does China have?
During the last World Cup, it seems to be the exact same number as the previous champions France ... :D
I'm talking about all time....

And the answer is still the same. ZERO

[Craig]

Originally posted by BeTheReds@Nov 18 2002, 07:55 PM
Originally posted by Craig@Nov 19 2002, 12:51 AM
Originally posted by BeTheReds@Nov 18 2002, 07:27 PM
You can say that those two are doing fine representing China in England,  but how many WC goals does China have?
During the last World Cup, it seems to be the exact same number as the previous champions France ... :D
I'm talking about all time....

And the answer is still the same. ZERO
Well then, how many wins did South Korea have before World Cup 2002 ...

[BeTheReds]

Originally posted by Craig@Nov 19 2002, 01:00 AM
Originally posted by BeTheReds@Nov 18 2002, 07:55 PM
Originally posted by Craig@Nov 19 2002, 12:51 AM
Originally posted by BeTheReds@Nov 18 2002, 07:27 PM
You can say that those two are doing fine representing China in England, but how many WC goals does China have?
During the last World Cup, it seems to be the exact same number as the previous champions France ... :D
I'm talking about all time....

And the answer is still the same. ZERO
Well then, how many wins did South Korea have before World Cup 2002 ...
How many GOALS... not wins does China have? (Doesn't matter, the number is the same.)

Wins are much higher up there than goals.

Korea has at least scored in previous attempts.

[syc]

I was happy for Korea even though im chinese but i hear too much of it from Koreans. You have to admit they were lucky to get that far, cause they did get help from the refs. You cant honestly say that the Spanish and maybe the Italians and Portugese didnt get some bad calls.

Im still just happy we got in the world cup. With more chinese players getting chances overseas the team is only going to get better. I know Koreas been in the world cup alot of times but how long did it take you to score and win a game? Still... nowhere better to do it than in front of your home fans.

Also, Ahn barely played in the serie A, Austrian and Belgian leagues are shite, and Cha doesnt even play for his team. And what does it say about Cha that he is changing citizenship? will he still be able to play for korea?

[MellowDrama]

Originally posted by syc@Nov 18 2002, 11:58 PM
I was happy for Korea even though im chinese but i hear too much of it from Koreans. You have to admit they were lucky to get that far, cause they did get help from the refs. You cant honestly say that the Spanish and maybe the Italians and Portugese didnt get some bad calls.

Im still just happy we got in the world cup. With more chinese players getting chances overseas the team is only going to get better. I know Koreas been in the world cup alot of times but how long did it take you to score and win a game? Still... nowhere better to do it than in front of your home fans.

Also, Ahn barely played in the serie A, Austrian and Belgian leagues are shite, and Cha doesnt even play for his team. And what does it say about Cha that he is changing citizenship? will he still be able to play for korea?
Belgian League isn't that bad actually. I think A LOT of Asian players are better off going to one of the smaller leagues before heading off to the Big 4 - (Spain, England, Italy, Germany). A lot of African and S. American players play in France and the Netherlands before joining more prestigious European teams, so there's nothing wrong with doing that.

[BeTheReds]

Originally posted by syc@Nov 19 2002, 05:58 AM
I was happy for Korea even though im chinese but i hear too much of it from Koreans. You have to admit they were lucky to get that far, cause they did get help from the refs. You cant honestly say that the Spanish and maybe the Italians and Portugese didnt get some bad calls.

Im still just happy we got in the world cup. With more chinese players getting chances overseas the team is only going to get better. I know Koreas been in the world cup alot of times but how long did it take you to score and win a game? Still... nowhere better to do it than in front of your home fans.

Also, Ahn barely played in the serie A, Austrian and Belgian leagues are shite, and Cha doesnt even play for his team. And what does it say about Cha that he is changing citizenship? will he still be able to play for korea?
...

The fact that Korea got into the world cup over and over again is a testament to Korean soccer and how great it is. Korea has scored in the world cup long before 2002, just never winning. In 2002 Korea was definately aided by the home crowd, but you can't take anything away from them because of that. Skill is skill. I can see where you might think Korea got a few lucky calls tho. Still Korea's team was awesome.

Who cares how long it took to get the first win?

China still has not even gotten its first, so any attempt to downplay Korea's soccer mastry based on time makes the Chinese team look even worse, because they have not consistenly qualified for WC nor have they ever scored in a WC game, much less won one.


Ahn was a reserve in Seria-A, which is why the Italians were so upset that one of their reserves, and gasp.. a yellowman ended their team's bid for the WC.


As for Cha Doori, once he changes citizenship he wont be playing for Korea anymore, but I guess there are more important things to his life besides soccer. Perhaps he could play for Germany, although that's not likely, since German Soccer is fine without him. I remember in 1998 people were making this huge fuss about Mark Chung playing for the USA in friendy matches but it's too bad he didn't make the team. Koreans in Korea were calling him a traitor and what not because they didn't understand the concept of Korean-American, and I think even many Korean-Americans don't either. Sadly the same might happen for Cha Doori.

[syc]

Belgian League isn't that bad actually. I think A LOT of Asian players are better off going to one of the smaller leagues before heading off to the Big 4 - (Spain, England, Italy, Germany). A lot of African and S. American players play in France and the Netherlands before joining more prestigious European teams, so there's nothing wrong with doing that.

I agree with you on that point, alot of asian players would be better off going to smaller european leagues first. But the Belgian league is way behind the big 4 leagues, the French and Dutch leagues arent half bad, i used to live in paris so i followed the french league.

I wasnt trying to downplay Korea's victory, i was also happy that an Asian team could get past the initial stages, they played with heart and worked hard for every ball. But definately you cant deny they had luck in getting that far.

I was mainly trying to bring the wind out of BTR's sails. Cant you let me be happy about getting into the WC for the first time without bringing up that Korea did better? While Korea played better than China in the WC the chinese players are doing much better for themselves overseas for their clubs and right now thats more important than past achievements.

Also, i really dont understand why Cha Doo Ri would do that. Giving up playing for your country so you can play in or maybe even for Germany? I mean, couldnt he play in Germany and still keep his Korean citizenship? I can understand Koreans being mad about that because even though players need clubs for their wages, playing for your country should be the highest honour. He wouldnt even have the chance to play in Germany if it wasnt for his national team.

[MellowDrama]

I wouldn't necessarily foreclose Cha's chances for playing for S. Korea in 06. I'm pretty sure Germany allows dual citizenship, which is why Miroslav Klose could have played for Germany or Poland. Also, there is talk of FIFA reforming their rules on non-citizens eligibility rules for international matches, so I belive the only obstacle will be the Korean soccer officials.

[BeTheReds]

Korea is Cha's country only because he has a green passport.

He grew up in Germany and German is his native language. He even said himself that he feels more German than Korean. To him it wouldn't really be giving up anything, but gaining something to change his citizenship to German. He's not changing citizenship just to play in or for Germany he's changing his ciizenship for non soccer related reasons. I don't think many Koreans truly understand the concept of people of Korean descent considering another country as their home. This is why many of them are not happy with Cha's decision.

Even if Germany allows dual citizenship, Korea doesn't after you become 18, so it wouldn't matter anyway.

I was going to let you be proud of China's accomplishments without saying anything about Korea doing better until I came across this post.

China's level is still low i know. But we arent far apart from Japan and Korea either. Japan have a bunch of players in Europe but where do Koreans play? In Belgium? Does anyone besides Belgians care about that league? Li Tie and Sun Jihai are doing much better than other Koreans. Ahn Jung Hwan couldnt even get signed in England.

This post basically says China is good and Japan is good but Korea is not. So naturally I had to retaliate.

[amietron]

Originally posted by Craig@Nov 18 2002, 03:21 PM
Originally posted by amietron@Nov 18 2002, 05:47 PM
Kailee Wong. :)

Chinese-American. =X
Amie,

They mean "international" football => "soccer".
i feel really dumb now. i guess it's my bad for not reading anything anyone posted above me. i thought football in asia? WHOA. and thought of kailee wong.