Accommodation of White people?

[>:^|]

Yellowworld.org: The cultivation of a political asian consciousness

I've noticed that when White people join a thread about Asian issues here, the thread often loses its focus. Instead, it becomes all about the White person. We answer their questions, we respond to their idiocy ... and soon we aren't talking to each other. We're talking to White people.

If I wanted to hear White people's opinions, I find it very easy to do so. I find it more difficult to have a discussion with a large group of diverse Asians, which is part of the appeal of yw.

So I'm curious why we're so fucking polite all the time. And why can't we simply ignore people?

When you respond, I ask that you speak from your Asian consciousness and speak to the other Asians present. If possible, I ask that you ignore the White people who will want to jump in on the thread. And if you can't ignore them, then I will demand to know why.

When people have privilege, is it because we willingly give it to them?

[AliBabaIncorporated]

So I'm curious why we're so fucking polite all the time. And why can't we simply ignore people?
eh, I don't think the problem is that we're polite. Usually, especially if the person is a troll or making trollish comments, everyone's jumping in to tell the troll to shut up and giving them long explanations (which they likely never read) of why they're wrong to hold the opinions they do.

[tommyhtown]

Back in the late 2002, when I just started participating in different APIA forums I would go out of my way to explain my point of views to many non-Asians member. Of course, it was to no avail. Most of them didn't really care. They just wanted to get a rise out of you. Other Asian members would go bezerk even more.

That's why I came to YW. When I first joined it was pretty 'Troll-proof' compared to other APIA forums. I don't think YW made any special accomodation to non-Asian posters then or now.

[deez nuts]

mr or miss thingamabob whom we don't know your race, ethnicity or gender. how do we know you're not a whitey. a wolf in sheep's clothing? how do we know you're not just trying to work into our good graces only to stab us in the back later on? how do we know you're not in cahoots with the man?

i, however, find your frustration very endearing.

i don't think you should unleash your wrath and frustration just on white people. i think you should include all nonasians cuz we all know that all the "incidents" that we've had with nonasians wasn't just limited to white people. if you're gonna unleash hell, why go half assed.

[Meki]

^I think that >:^| whole point was to go after the ones that have the privilege. i.e. “whitey”


Yellowworld.org: The cultivation of a political asian consciousness

I've noticed that when White people join a thread about Asian issues here, the thread often loses its focus. Instead, it becomes all about the White person. We answer their questions, we respond to their idiocy ... and soon we aren't talking to each other. We're talking to White people.

If I wanted to hear White people's opinions, I find it very easy to do so. I find it more difficult to have a discussion with a large group of diverse Asians, which is part of the appeal of yw.

So I'm curious why we're so fucking polite all the time. And why can't we simply ignore people?

When you respond, I ask that you speak from your Asian consciousness and speak to the other Asians present. If possible, I ask that you ignore the White people who will want to jump in on the thread. And if you can't ignore them, then I will demand to know why.

When people have privilege, is it because we willingly give it to them?

Wow... I believe this is the first time I’ve ever really seen you rant. Nice to know that you are human too. ^_~

I’m guessing that you are basing this off the recent “Asian babies adopted by white parents” thread? Well, that one does affect the future of a potential member of our community. It would be difficult not to speak out on such issues. As far as the site in general, I really haven’t noticed any of us being overly accommodating to white people. The mods and admin are pretty PC about non-Asian members but I’d have to say that’s how they should be. I don’t see this site being bombarded by white people nor do I see that many that speak their minds. The small amount of white members we do have, seem to generally stay away from the AA issues. Personally, I don’t mind answering informed questions from... well... anyone. I figure if a person is willing to listen then most likely it will only serve to further our cause. Unfortunately, this is usually not the case; it’s a troll or whatever that has our attention. But it’s only for a short time because they are usually run off by the barrage of acerbic comments thrown their way. I’d say that if we were completely closed to the idea of having non-Asian members than we would be no better than MM. =)

And if you want to speak your mind, please do so. I haven’t seen you post all that much and I rather enjoy reading them. Post more often and I will personally make a concerted effort to respond to them (and not so much to whitey... ^_~), though I’m not sure that you would enjoy such nonsensical dribble. =D

[kimpossible]

^I think that >:^| whole point was to go after the ones that have the privilege. i.e. “whitey”


We've had the variety pack through YW. It's hardly been limited to either whites, or males for that matter. Varying degrees of pain in the ass.

[SunWuKong]

those of us who have been around long enough should remember that white members have not been the only non-Asian members that attention have gravitated toward...

[Meki]

We've had the variety pack through YW. It's hardly been limited to either whites, or males for that matter. Varying degrees of pain in the ass.

Me? :frown: I <3 you Kim... I <3 you... Must you hurt me so?

[>:^|]

If you want an equal-opportunity rant, start your own thread.

[deez nuts]

since i keep hearing about privilege.

i think anonymity, flying under the radar if you will, grants you certain amount of privilege in a forum such as yw if you are not asian.

it is a forum for asians first and foremost. i think in a forum such as this and if you are a nonasian, it is common courtesy to show all of your cards on the table. one the worst kinds of extension of one's privilege are the ones that are extended surreptitiously or under pretense.

[kimpossible]

Me? :frown: I <3 you Kim... I <3 you... Must you hurt me so?


What? No. Why would I mean you?

[pikachupacabra]

This is so obvious but I don't think I ever thought of it before. Thanks for keeping our heads fresh.

[Meki]

What? No. Why would I mean you?

Oh... I was just joking... hehe... I guess I just wanted an excuse to say I <3 you. LOL! :biggrin:

[hooligan]

I can't let any race-lined issue outside of critique. I'll let it go only if the person's an outright troll, but if they're not criticism is needed and I will not be quiet on something as blatantly racist as something as to what happened in the adoptee's thread. Yes, adopting a child's good, but people aren't critical enough of race.

Particular people who post in threads on YW seem to be outrightly trolls, but then there are some white posters who seem to be somewhat questionable and since they bring familiar arguments backing up their ideas of racism to the table I think it's fair game to criticize and learn from these views. Besides, it's really fun to juggle these same criticisms everytime. It's good to be reminded that when privelege is threatened, we will undoubtedly be harassed.

Ignoring racism is the same as accepting it. It's the YW'ers who pander toward those who come on this forum and backup this racism that I find questionable. And believe me, there seems to be a large amount of room given to people who are white on this site. There is even larger room given to those who come here asking questions about culture. If that's what you are addressing I wholeheartedly agree. If we're trying to build a consciousness, whether that be through fire and friction, as APIAs we need to do it alone first, without having our motives questioned.

I think we need to be more vigilant and recognize that we're here to discuss things we believe in. I like debates, I like arguments. It's something refreshing to have a place where I can have these arguments with similar people who have similar experiences. I don't want to be questioned by white folk and I dont' want to be told by white folk what to believe in. I feel that this is fair to ask since the white dominated patriarchy was what I've believed in for so long.

[kimpossible]

Well one last word on the subject since this was probably spawned by the thread I just closed it because it veered too far away from an APA centered perspective.

I can't nuke everyone for the slightest infraction or for being non-Asian, not that that was what face was really suggesting anyhow. The truth is that they're welcome to join and participate... on our terms. It's an open house and they can come in but that doesn't mean they can move in and redecorate according to their tastes.

I had the custom title of "Landlady" for a while and it was mostly in jest but I've come to feel like the boards of YW that serve as a communication tool for our online community and organization are somewhat like a house with tenants. I don't mind visitors, I don't mind inquiries but invasive trespassing or squatting is a no-no, especially at the cost of our potential gains as a group.

I agree with face's basic sentiment and I can assure you that it is the guiding principle that each mod and admin has in his or her heart; to stay true to the APIA perspective, reserving and protecting the space and sense of community that thousands (based on membership numbers) have come to value.

But in order to use the medium we have, a publicly available forum, we are somewhat subject to non-Asian participation and the best method I have available to me is re-aligning once things start going off course. With the goal of APA sanctuary in mind as a guiding principle, I go for overall balance.

I hope this is the type of moderator-member-community relationship we've forged over the last few years. If I've failed in that capacity, anyone can shoot me a message. I may or may not adjust what I do if it's legit feedback but I will hear it out. But I can say I really haven't gone out of the way to politely kiss non-Asian ass, instead trying to serve as an example to the non-Asians since I'm not very Asian myself. Supermod, member, no matter my role here, I curb my content if I think it'll skew the central theme away from Asiancentric.

[o2binthesun]

We've had the variety pack through YW. It's hardly been limited to either whites, or males for that matter. Varying degrees of pain in the ass.

Maybe you should screen your participants in discussions as George Bush screens his audiences! That way, some one will always be agreeing with you! Then you wouldn't have to put up with us pains in the asses! This is a lame group!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[bluemonq]

Maybe you should screen your participants in discussions as George Bush screens his audiences! That way, some one will always be agreeing with you! Then you wouldn't have to put up with us pains in the asses! This is a lame group!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
putting it aside that it would be impracticable (sp?), it's probably a testament to the people here at yw that your "solution" has never really seriously come up as a possibility;after all, being non-asian does not automatically make one a troll. and if you think yw's a lame group, then you're free to leave at any time and not come back. and don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.

[kimpossible]

Maybe you should screen your participants in discussions as George Bush screens his audiences! That way, some one will always be agreeing with you! Then you wouldn't have to put up with us pains in the asses! This is a lame group!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I let the namecalling aimed solely at me over private message slide. You don't get to do that to the community of AAs here. The red sign you'll get in a few moments is a warning. They can lead to being banned.

Do not disrespect the community here.

[hooligan]

I want to add, I criticize APIAs who reflect the same type of arguments that white folk might say as much as ... well ... white folk who say the same thing.

[deez nuts]

Maybe you should screen your participants in discussions as George Bush screens his audiences! That way, some one will always be agreeing with you! Then you wouldn't have to put up with us pains in the asses! This is a lame group!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

we were so close to pal'ing around and you just had to go and ruin the whole thing.

[xzotyqarz]

who has read Michael Moore's book "Stupid White Men"?
(i was almost afraid to buy the book fearing what people would think of me of simply wanting to know what he meant, and that I got the book because it attacked the white man in the title no less!)

although I don't agree with his Roman Catholic influenced views, he comments that in America, more white people are more racist than they realised or willing to admit.

i can just imagine how many white Americans would fit his 'not me' description in that book.

on that point alone, i could agree.

[AliBabaIncorporated]

I want to add, I criticize APIAs who reflect the same type of arguments that white folk might say as much as ... well ... white folk who say the same thing.
Okay, I sense that there's some difference here between your statement and plain old "people who disagree with me might as well be white", so to give you the benefit of the doubt, would you mind clarifying?

[kpih]

In some ways this is part of the reason why I have been less inclined to post lately. May be it is just me, but I sort of noticed an increase of idiotic comments lately at yw. I get enough idiocy from real life (in the classroom) and the news already. So I just get too tired and pissed off to respond (especially without resorting to profanity). While some individuals are truly open to new and challenging ideas, some others are plain idiots (on that I have to partially disagree with >:^|, white or nonwhite, Asian non-Asian, doesn’t matter). It is a very time consuming and exhausting exercise to explain to idiots why they are idiots, especially when they just don’t get it!

But then again I also agree with hooligan, silence is sometimes a disservice to the community (yw or the Asian community). I appreciate some of your guys of tirelessly trying to educate people on various matters. My hats off, and you know who you are...

Sometimes fighting back is the only option…

It is an important task, perhaps even a duty, to engender communication and the exchange of ideas between people of different backgrounds.

Lastly, I have to extend a salute to our mods. Frankly if I were in charge I would give out bans like candy…

[hooligan]

Okay, I sense that there's some difference here between your statement and plain old "people who disagree with me might as well be white", so to give you the benefit of the doubt, would you mind clarifying?

Assuming that the majority's views on politics, as diverse as they are, usually are encompassed by the left, right and center. Unfortunately, a lot of times, APIAs fail to recognize the ideas of race, power and different types and levels of discrimination exist in our communities. So, when on YW, I find APIAs who post opinions and arguments that oftentimes reflect mainstream thought and do not take into account of things like race, I tend to criticize them accordingly.

You might argue that I'm pushing a "liberal" agenda, but I don't feel as though race or critical theory (of race, gender, religion, or sexuality) falls into the right, left and middle politically. I feel that it is necessary to add this view into YW because there is such a lack of this type of view even among the APIA community. If I don't, other people will, and if other people don't, I will.

I hope that clarifies?

[Martino]

Yellowworld.org: The cultivation of a political asian consciousness

I've noticed that when White people join a thread about Asian issues here, the thread often loses its focus. Instead, it becomes all about the White person. We answer their questions, we respond to their idiocy ... and soon we aren't talking to each other. We're talking to White people.

If I wanted to hear White people's opinions, I find it very easy to do so. I find it more difficult to have a discussion with a large group of diverse Asians, which is part of the appeal of yw.

So I'm curious why we're so fucking polite all the time. And why can't we simply ignore people?

When you respond, I ask that you speak from your Asian consciousness and speak to the other Asians present. If possible, I ask that you ignore the White people who will want to jump in on the thread. And if you can't ignore them, then I will demand to know why.

When people have privilege, is it because we willingly give it to them?

In other words, don't feed the trolls.

You can't rely on people not taking the bait when a Troll or Idiot says something provocative. Even YW mafia with tons of karma still do it, sometimes just to be facetious, sometimes ... not.

This would be for the Mods to decide, and may take some fiddling with the code but ...there's already a 'report bad post' button on each message. Maybe it should be made more prominent and more immediate? Say, anyone with approved status could click the post and hide it until a Mod can review it? It sounds a bit like censorship, but it could be an earned right ... and one confined to confirmed Asian members.

[SunWuKong]

Assuming that the majority's views on politics, as diverse as they are, usually are encompassed by the left, right and center. Unfortunately, a lot of times, APIAs fail to recognize the ideas of race, power and different types and levels of discrimination exist in our communities. So, when on YW, I find APIAs who post opinions and arguments that oftentimes reflect mainstream thought and do not take into account of things like race, I tend to criticize them accordingly.

You might argue that I'm pushing a "liberal" agenda, but I don't feel as though race or critical theory (of race, gender, religion, or sexuality) falls into the right, left and middle politically. I feel that it is necessary to add this view into YW because there is such a lack of this type of view even among the APIA community. If I don't, other people will, and if other people don't, I will.

I hope that clarifies?

honest question here - but don't you think it's a little condescending to say that you need to criticise these people? there are bound to be a lot of grey areas where nobody can be certain that race, etc, played a part. in those particular instances, you basically have a disagreement.

So I'm curious why we're so fucking polite all the time. And why can't we simply ignore people?

wouldn't ignoring somebody be the polite thing to do if s/he annoys the hell out of you?

at any rate, YW does not limit membership by race. and even if we tried, we'd fail. not that we want to limit membership by race. personally i've always felt that it's about inclusion, not exclusion. but YW does have the primary purpose of serving the Asian American community, so we have to determine on a case-to-case basis if points brought up by a non-Asian person need to be forcefully dismissed by the mods and admins.

if, for example, a non-Asian person comes here and proclaims, in all his honesty, even without any intent of being a troll, that he thinks Asian Americans are not American or they're not really Asian (i assure you it happens), then this is an easy and obvious case. i'm sure many if not most Asian members on the site can disagree with that point of view. a thread about that particular issue serves no purpose other than piss people off.

but if a non-Asian person comes here and posts politely (at least initially...) about his/her experience with transracial adoption, however, she cannot be brushed off so simply especially when she is open to learning how Asian people feel about the issue. for one thing, there are plenty of disagreements in the Asian American community itself about the issue of transracial adoption. if she then starts attacking others or if she starts dismissing basically everything we have to say without counter-argument, then of course, action should be considered. a member like that would increasingly serve no other purpose than piss people off.

believe me, we have banned plenty of white people who comes here and suck up attention and doesn't really serve YW's purpose. we've also had black members who do the same. it matters little to me since either cases are not Asian.

not that you'd be reprimanded or anything, but what is your race? are you a non-Asian member sucking up attention on YW?

[hooligan]

honest question here - but don't you think it's a little condescending to say that you need to criticise these people? there are bound to be a lot of grey areas where nobody can be certain that race, etc, played a part. in those particular instances, you basically have a disagreement.

No, why would it be condescending if these people aren't critical of an identity they subscribe to? Or at least say they identify with? You can't go idly by and let someone who says they're APIA make blatantly, obviously racist, sexist posts.

When I speak about race, it is usually tied to critical race theory and that theory is based upon racism, discrimination, privelege (or lack thereof). If someone decides to come on this site and identify as APIA, come speaking about the benefits of racism I will obliged as an APIA to criticize them.

If people who aren't APIA come on this forum and start making posts LINED with racism (and there was obviously racism) I feel obliged to point it out and make it an issue. While other YW'ers, moderators feel the need to pander and allow these posts it's not fair for people who come here for a safe space to discuss race to allow these sort things with these sort of people.

not that you'd be reprimanded or anything, but what is your race? are you a non-Asian member sucking up attention on YW?

What's your race? I don't believe your asian, I've never seen a picture of you to prove otherwise. While the face, in my opinion, has made some great posts and created some great discussion on APIA issues I feel that they understand the ins and outs of a very critical race-based, gender-based, and sexuality-based critique of the APIA experience. On the other hand, you haven't, now can you prove you're APIA?

[PropellerheadCP]

Hey, nothing wrong with non-Asians who happen to be stupid, posting misguided or simply idiotic ideas.

a) It's good for a laugh
b) It keeps us grounded and it reminds us that we can't stick our heads in the sand, by belonging into an Asian group
c) It keeps us sharper, when dealing with racist idiots in real life
d) We can ignore them, if we don't want to participate.

The truth is that some people need to know when to chill. It's a forum and we can step away from it. If you want to give your two cents, then that's great because... well... it's a forum. However, when you have a feeling that your two cents are going to be thrown back at you, then why bother? It's not going to change the troll's mind. The troll's probably having the time of his/her life, by getting responses.

Personally, I don't have anything against non-Asians participating in most Asian issues, as long as they participate, instead of defending their right to do those naughty things that bother Asians so much. Heck, I know some Asians who are more ignorant than some non-Asians, so we can't blame it on race. Stupid people don't just come in "white". Heck, I'm pretty stupid most of the time too, and I'm Chinese. We're supposed to be smart (I guess I'm a bit of a blacksheep, then?).

All that stated some non-Asians who post on Asian forums honestly want to learn. Racism is usually something that's learned. So it'a also possible to "un-learn" those ideas. I don't think any effort was truly wasted on "educating" people. People slowly change with every sentence they hear or read.

[SunWuKong]

What's your race? I don't believe your asian, I've never seen a picture of you to prove otherwise. While the face, in my opinion, has made some great posts and created some great discussion on APIA issues I feel that they understand the ins and outs of a very critical race-based, gender-based, and sexuality-based critique of the APIA experience. On the other hand, you haven't, now can you prove you're APIA?

actually i have posted pictures of myself in the past. i've also met YW members before so they can attest.

i know you're asking a rhetorical question, but for my part, all you have to do is say what race you are and i'd believe you. so i tell people i'm Chinese. everybody here is free to believe it or not.

whether or not Face has created great discussions is irrelevant, and if it's any consolation to you, i agree that his/her posts are pretty good. the question he/she posed is: why do we accomodate white people?

s/he said:
If I wanted to hear White people's opinions, I find it very easy to do so.

the implication here is that white people's opinions shouldn't suck in all our attention. well, i'm thinking that the opinion of anybody that is not Asian should not suck in our attention.

and you know, if creating "some great discussion on APIA issues" that you "feel that they understand the ins and outs of a very critical race-based, gender-based, and sexuality-based critique of the APIA experience" is proof that someone is APIA whereas without this ability, it is proof that someone is not APIA, then i must tell you that my grandmother would not qualify even though she has lived in the US for more than 30+ years and plan on spending the rest of her life here.

in fact, hooligan, all one needs to do is agree with everything you say and this person would qualify as an APIA as you define it. and if someone disagrees, well, i guess it's time to question his or her ethnic background.

[hooligan]

no, i recognize clearly that there are other facets of the APIA identity. i mentioned in my post, one of the most neglected is that race-based identity and i feel the need to bring it up and use it as criticism. also, what the face's post really implies is that we're oftentimes, well, actually surrounded by a white-dominated sphere of opinion. it is found everywhere in the US and why does it have to exist here?

apparently, the face posts very familiar arguments among apias who're familiar with critical race theory. that's why their posts are so pertinent to things i believe in. in a sense, you're right, it's irrelevant because the face apparently understands a lot more than you do about race issues as an apia. by the way, feel free to argue, i never said you were wrong. i'm pointing out a lack, if you don't think so, please state why.

[SunWuKong]

no, i recognize clearly that there are other facets of the APIA identity. i mentioned in my post, one of the most neglected is that race-based identity and i feel the need to bring it up and use it as criticism.

so your idea of a critique of race-based identity is to ask rhetorically for someone who claims to be Asian to prove he's Asian because you feel that he does not make posts that shows he "understand the ins and outs of a very critical race-based, gender-based, and sexuality-based critique of the APIA experience"?

please. can we move beyond the "who's more Asian" thing already?

also, what the face's post really implies is that we're oftentimes, well, actually surrounded by a white-dominated sphere of opinion. it is found everywhere in the US and why does it have to exist here?

that's fine. and i want to ask further, why should any non-Asian person dominate a discussion here at all? this is not PersonOfColorWorld.org.

apparently, the face posts very familiar arguments among apias who're familiar with critical race theory. that's why their posts are so pertinent to things i believe in. in a sense, you're right, it's irrelevant because the face apparently understands a lot more about than you do about race issues as an apia. by the way, feel free to argue, i never said you were wrong. i'm pointing out a lack, if you don't think so, please state why.

actually, hooligan, it seems like you are the one making a claim here. i think the burden of proof is upon you. please tell me why and how i am not familiar with critical race theory.

[hooligan]

Sure, like the face said, more often than not forum "leaders" reflect mainstream beliefs on gender and sexuality and even race. This may be news to you, but many people who study APIA and race consider APIAs to be people of color and thus race based critical theory is not just pertinent, but integral to understanding the APIA experience. I find it lacking because we talk about racism and we react to racism, but we never seem to understand it or move beyond it. More often than not, this forum is reactionary, we react to things to offend us. Sure, we can say it's racist, but do we as APIAs know why? Why does the caricature of Kung Fu costumes affect us? Why do we work on such actions like offensive t-shirts? These may be rhetorical, but I think it points to this gap within our understanding of racism. While we understand that racism is wrong, we do not look at how we fit into the black, white, brown, yellow and red racial hiearchy that dictates the entire APIA experience.

When this site invokes the use of the word "yellow" it's definitely a color. When we're talking about cultivating a political conscious in the context of the word "yellow" we're talking about our experiences as people of color. We shouldn't allow any non-APIA to dominate the discussion here, BUT when non-APIAs can reflect upon the experiences with any -ism and tie it to the APIA experience it's something that I believe we can all learn from. Starkly opposed to such posts as "what can i do for my adopted chinese daughter" or "why do you all hate white people" or "let's talk about the new j-pop movie that's getting time in American theaters." While these speak toward a facet of the APIA experience, the fact that this site uses the word "yellow" and connects it to the cultivation of something political actually does a disservice to those who want to see a site that's dedicated to racial subjects.

Contrary to your beliefs, color, race and privelege has everything to do with the fact that we're APIAs and discussing these issues on this site.

[SunWuKong]

Sure, like the face said, more often than not forum "leaders" reflect mainstream beliefs on gender and sexuality and even race. This may be news to you, but many people who study APIA and race consider APIAs to be people of color and thus race based critical theory is not just pertinent, but integral to understanding the APIA experience.

ok, so correct me if i'm wrong, what you're saying here is that if we agree with anything that is mainstream, then we don't have an understanding of critical race theory?

this may be news to you, but many people who understand critical race theory may disagree with its proponents.

I find it lacking because we talk about racism and we react to racism, but we never seem to understand it or move beyond it. More often than not, this forum is reactionary, we react to things to offend us. Sure, we can say it's racist, but do we as APIAs know why? Why does the caricature of Kung Fu costumes affect us? Why do we work on such actions like offensive t-shirts? These may be rhetorical, but I think it points to this gap within our understanding of racism. While we understand that racism is wrong, we do not look at how we fit into the black, white, brown, yellow and red racial hiearchy that dictates the entire APIA experience.

and how did you come to the conclusion that we don't look at how we fit into the "black, white, brown, yellow, and red" racial hierarchy? because we're reactionary? or is it because we don't all agree with everything you learnt in academia?

When this site invokes the use of the word "yellow" it's definitely a color. When we're talking about cultivating a political conscious in the context of the word "yellow" we're talking about our experiences as people of color. We shouldn't allow any non-APIA to dominate the discussion here, BUT when non-APIAs can reflect upon the experiences with any -ism and tie it to the APIA experience it's something that I believe we can all learn from. Starkly opposed to such posts as "what can i do for my adopted chinese daughter" or "why do you all hate white people" or "let's talk about the new j-pop movie that's getting time in American theaters."

sure, i can agree with that. but that was not the point that Face made:

I've noticed that when White people join a thread about Asian issues here, the thread often loses its focus. Instead, it becomes all about the White person. We answer their questions, we respond to their idiocy ... and soon we aren't talking to each other. We're talking to White people.

she's asking why we accomodate white people, period. not dumb white people, not smart white people, just white people period. it's only fair that we also ask why we accomodate anybody who is not Asian.

While these speak toward a facet of the APIA experience, the fact that this site uses the word "yellow" and connects it to the cultivation of something political actually does a disservice to those who want to see a site that's dedicated to racial subjects.

well, sorry to disappoint you if some of the members here actually want to talk about things that are not political. i don't think we're going to force members to post only racial-political subjects anytime soon. however, we have never stopped our members from doing so.

does this mean that if someone is not as interested in racial politics as you are, you think that they don't have an understanding of critical race theory?

elbert and kasie may or may not disagree with me on this, but i also feel that YW serves as a tool for community building.

Contrary to your beliefs, color, race and privelege has everything to do with the fact that we're APIAs and discussing these issues on this site.

oh this is rich. please grant me the privilege of knowing what you think my beliefs are, and how you think i believe the opposite of what you just said there.

[koongchiulo]

cmon y'all

group hug

[hooligan]

ok, so correct me if i'm wrong, what you're saying here is that if we agree with anything that is mainstream, then we don't have an understanding of critical race theory?

this may be news to you, but many people who understand critical race theory may disagree with its proponents.
that's not what i'm saying, let me repeat myself, there doesn't seem to be enough analysis of privelege and race within yw. there are people here who do not seem to understand that APIAs are people of color and you've made comments yourself that reflect this belief. so, excuse me for concluding you don't believe that apias are people of color becuase you've never said anything to prove it differently.


and how did you come to the conclusion that we don't look at how we fit into the "black, white, brown, yellow, and red" racial hierarchy? because we're reactionary? or is it because we don't all agree with everything you learnt in academia?

how about all of the above? these are critiques, if you have something contrary to add, say it and stop beating around the bush.

sure, i can agree with that. but that was not the point that Face made:

she's asking why we accomodate white people, period. not dumb white people, not smart white people, just white people period. it's only fair that we also ask why we accomodate anybody who is not Asian.

I've noticed more accomdation for white posters than posters of any other race. I don't think this should happen at all, why does it happen?

well, sorry to disappoint you if some of the members here actually want to talk about things that are not political. i don't think we're going to force members to post only racial-political subjects anytime soon. however, we have never stopped our members from doing so.

does this mean that if someone is not as interested in racial politics as you are, you think that they don't have an understanding of critical race theory?

elbert and kasie may or may not disagree with me on this, but i also feel that YW serves as a tool for community building.

what kind of communtiy are we building? as i recall we're building a community that's built around the ideas of political cultivation of yellow peoples (APIA). so, what kind of community do you think we're building based on these observations? i believe we're building a community that can talk about race, that can talk about privelege that these categories and ideas bring. i also believe that things personal are political. identity based politics aren't the end all, but a vehicle to discuss and view larger issues. now, let me repeat, what kind of community do you think we're building?


oh this is rich. please grant me the privilege of knowing what you think my beliefs are, and how you think i believe the opposite of what you just said there.
Prove it different, also, prove to me you're APIA?

By the way, how exactly have I got it wrong about critical race theory?

[kasia]

Yellowworld.org: The cultivation of a political asian consciousness

I've noticed that when White people join a thread about Asian issues here, the thread often loses its focus. Instead, it becomes all about the White person. We answer their questions, we respond to their idiocy ... and soon we aren't talking to each other. We're talking to White people.

If I wanted to hear White people's opinions, I find it very easy to do so. I find it more difficult to have a discussion with a large group of diverse Asians, which is part of the appeal of yw.

So I'm curious why we're so fucking polite all the time. And why can't we simply ignore people?

When you respond, I ask that you speak from your Asian consciousness and speak to the other Asians present. If possible, I ask that you ignore the White people who will want to jump in on the thread. And if you can't ignore them, then I will demand to know why.

When people have privilege, is it because we willingly give it to them?

and i would say it's not only white people but non-asians as well. sometimes we'd start a poll on a topic perhaps unrelated to being asian american per se, but the idea is to get a poll of api population. some people just can't respect that yw is a forum for apis to discuss and learn about one another.

[SunWuKong]

that's not what i'm saying, let me repeat myself, there doesn't seem to be enough analysis of privelege and race within yw. there are people here who do not seem to understand that APIAs are people of color and you've made comments yourself that reflect this belief. so, excuse me for concluding you don't believe that apias are people of color becuase you've never said anything to prove it differently.

that is one issue that probably deserves discussion, and i know that some mods and admins feel the same way that you do.

but excuse me, have you lost track of the discussion we've been having? you were making a point that people around here don't seem to understand critica race theory. i asked you to explain how you came to this conclusion. you replied by saying there isn't enough discussion of race politics.

exactly how does lack of discussion of particular subjects demonstrate a lack of understanding of the subjects?

also, i'd like to ask why you think i don't think Asians are people of colour? i've always thought that by virtue of the fact that we're not white, we're people of colour. or is there some new criteria that some of us haven't met aside from ethnic background?

how about all of the above? these are critiques, if you have something contrary to add, say it and stop beating around the bush.

huh? no offense, but they sound more like baseless accusations to me. why do you think we don't "look at how we fit into the "black, white, brown, yellow, and red racial hierarchy"? no, seriously, is it because not everyone here agrees with what you've learnt in academia?

I've noticed more accomdation for white posters than posters of any other race. I don't think this should happen at all, why does it happen?

why do you think this? because we don't automatically ban anybody who is white, and instead take the time to see if the person is basically harmless to YW?

what kind of communtiy are we building? as i recall we're building a community that's built around the ideas of political cultivation of yellow peoples (APIA). so, what kind of community do you think we're building based on these observations? i believe we're building a community that can talk about race, that can talk about privelege that these categories and ideas bring. i also believe that things personal are political. identity based politics aren't the end all, but a vehicle to discuss and view larger issues. now, let me repeat, what kind of community do you think we're building?

we're building an online Asian American community. at least that's how i personally feel about it.


Prove it different, also, prove to me you're APIA?

what the hell? guilty until proven innocent, huh? is this how you think critical race theory works? sorry man, but you're the one making the accusations here. why don't you show me how you're right instead.

let's say for example that i claim you are an egomaniac, if i were to do this, the burden of proof is on me, not on you to prove that you're not an egomaniac. understand?

exactly what criteria are you using to make the claims that you're making? you've replied already that there's not enough discussion of race politics, so again i ask, if someone is not as interested in discussions on race politics as you are, does it mean that this person actually does not understand race politics?


By the way, how exactly have I got it wrong about critical race theory?

what about critical race theory? i never said you were wrong about your understanding of critical race theory...

[thaite]

prove to me you're APIA?


i've met him. he's Asian.

[hooligan]

What does being Asian American and having an political consciousness mean? I personally believe that it has everything to do with being APIA and looking at race. I don't believe that you can exclude being APIA and being a racial minority.

i've met him. he's Asian.
I know.

[tapestrybabe]

but if a non-Asian person comes here and posts politely (at least initially...) about his/her experience with transracial adoption, however, she cannot be brushed off so simply especially when she is open to learning how Asian people feel about the issue. for one thing, there are plenty of disagreements in the Asian American community itself about the issue of transracial adoption. if she then starts attacking others or if she starts dismissing basically everything we have to say without counter-argument, then of course, action should be considered. a member like that would increasingly serve no other purpose than piss people off.

the white adoptive parents that i know... who lead FCC... in whom i babysit their chinese daughter... i know on a personal level... i've enjoyed being able to discuss certain issues with the white adoptive mom... i feel i've had very open and honest discussions with her... my attitudes of whites adopting asians... and how i prefer to see more asians adopting instead, issues about culture and stuff, etc... and when i talk to her... i dont think i actually accomodate her... but i talk how i really feel... and what i like about her is that she just listens to me...

i use my yw email account when i correspond to her... so i dont know if she's aware of this forum or not... but i've been tempted to invite her here... ALTho, than again... what would be the purpose of it other than her just listening, reading?? cuz as a white adoptive parent... i honestly dont see how she can add to the discussion... unless she talks from her own experience... but whats so important of having her discuss her own experience and point of view... when she's not asian herself... this site being centered around the asian point of view in the first place...

but than again...
there have been a few whites, non asians...
the ppl who keep themselves anonymous on this board...
who've been able to add to such discussions...
and still keep it asian centered...
and it doesnt all bother me...
when an anonymous person or
non asian is able to empathize
relate to how i feel and think...
but thats not really an example of yw
accomodating to whites, non asians...
but the other way around...
non asians accommodating to yw...

[SunWuKong]

What does being Asian American and having an political consciousness mean? I personally believe that it has everything to do with being APIA and looking at race. I don't believe that you can exclude being APIA and being a racial minority.

i agree. but somehow it seems like you're implying that i do not. if this is how you feel, would you mind telling me why?

i use my yw email account when i correspond to her... so i dont know if she's aware of this forum or not... but i've been tempted to invite her here... ALTho, than again... what would be the purpose of it other than her just listening, reading?? cuz as a white adoptive parent... i honestly dont see how she can add to the discussion... unless she talks from her own experience... but whats so important of having her discuss her own experience and point of view... when she's not asian herself... this site being centered around the asian point of view in the first place...

i personally feel there's absolutely no harm in white adoptive parents coming to YW to learn about the Asian American experience so she has a better idea of what his or her child may experience in life as an Asian American in the US.

a problem would arise, however, when a white (or whatever non-Asian race) person comes here to tell us what he or she thinks being Asian American is all about, or being completely dismissive of what most of us have to say about racial issues, etc etc.

it's a simple recognition that YW serves the Asian American community first and foremost.

[hooligan]

i agree. but somehow it seems like you're implying that i do not. if this is how you feel, would you mind telling me why?

I think it was during our arguments about Affirmative Action that you mentioned that APIAs don't have a connection with other people of color. As I recall you said that you don't see APIAs as people of color because our issues are so different. I argued that APIAs are people of color because we still feel the brunt of racism.

[SunWuKong]

I think it was during our arguments about Affirmative Action that you mentioned that APIAs don't have a connection with other people of color. As I recall you said that you don't see APIAs as people of color because our issues are so different. I argued that APIAs are people of color because we still feel the brunt of racism.

did i say this? honestly i do not remember saying that. and if i gave you the impression that i did, then let me tell you that is not what i think at all. what i think is that Asian Americans are people of color, but not all our issues are the same as African Americans, Latino Americans, and Native Americans. sometimes some of us in the Asian American community may even have opposing views with the majority of people in those groups - however, that in no way mean Asian Americans are not people of colour. as i've said before, Asian Americans are people of colour because we're not white. it's pretty cut and dry.

[hooligan]

did i say this? honestly i do not remember saying that. and if i gave you the impression that i did, then let me tell you that is not what i think at all. what i think is that Asian Americans are people of color, but not all our issues are the same as African Americans, Latino Americans, and Native Americans. sometimes some of us in the Asian American community may even have opposing views with the majority of people in those groups - however, that in no way mean Asian Americans are not people of colour. as i've said before, Asian Americans are people of colour because we're not white. it's pretty cut and dry.

Great, I think this is where we kiss and make up for all those times we've argued. :: smooch ::

[Napoleon Chynamite]

I think the term "people of color" from a sociological or progressive standpoint implies a connection or bond between all minority or subordinate groups in society based upon common barriers or obstacles as a result of the existing white male infrastructure, but there will always be varying extents to which people see these similarities, and varying extents to which people view just how interconnected we are in the social hierarchy. In America, do Asian Americans have more in common with African Americans or more differences when taking all factors into consideration instead of simply the discrimination angle? On that note I'd vote for the latter. A great portion of the struggles faced by minority groups here are not merely due to unfair treatment from the privileged elites as it fits into the whole mesh of the net of oppression, but also the direct result of the existing differences between these groups in language, ideology and way of thought, history, ties to the country they immigrated or arrived from, etc.

[hooligan]

These comparisons are too ... shallow, how does one measure the impact of discrimination on a community? You can't.

[Napoleon Chynamite]

^ Are you refering to my post? How are they shallow? I think the problem here is that you're constantly measuring or comparing two minority groups simply from the standpoint of discrimination, as I mentioned earlier. The hardships endured by individual minority groups amount to more than simply those that exist because the white man is keeping them down.

Minority groups are not merely passive entities serving as puppets with no free will for the white elite even though the mechanisms of socialization and politics may rest largely in their hands.

[hooligan]

A great portion of the struggles faced by minority groups here are not merely due to unfair treatment from the privileged elites as it fits into the whole mesh of the net of oppression, but also the direct result of the existing differences between these groups in language, ideology and way of thought, history, ties to the country they immigrated or arrived from, etc.

Actually, I'd argue differently, for example. A lot of people who've studied the model minority myth would say that the white patriarchy uses a middle man in order to exert power or influence in communities. Take the Watts Riots/Rebellion of the 1920s. Jewish merchants who lived in Watts had their homes and stores burnt down due to angry African Americans. Now, as I remember someone explaining it to me, this rebellion was because there was a white flight that happened around this time due to the influx of African Americans into the Southern Californian community. Jewish merchants who operated between white and black communities took the stores that these whites left. (This was before Jewish peoples were included under the "white" umbrella). In essence, they became surrogate whites, a buffer for white people who operated these stores before.

Now, flash forward to 1992, the LA rebellion. Again we have African Americans destroying what appears to be Korean stores due to a radical decision akin to the Vincent Chin decision in 1982. What people don't tell you is that Korean store owners were viewed as surrogate whites. Again, this was due to white flight. There was a large amount of store owners in the area, but after they left, Korean Americans came and took over these stores.

Now, if you go around the communities, you find that there isn't a lot of corporate investment. There aren't Costcos, Targets, Starbucks or other mainstream places like Mervyns. Before the 1992 rebellion, this place lacked investment. A lot of people attribute this to the fact that the white flight had a untold racist effect on the area and created a vacuum. This vacuum took Korean Americans in and made them surrogate whites. The case where as I recall the Williams girl was murdered and the murderer given a slap on the wrist for punishment reinforced the black community there that Koreans were just surrogate whites. Increasing tension between people of color. That same tension escalated to the 1992 rebellion.

Inter-racial tensions, are only part of the story, I believe we must look at the entire racial hiearchy and understand the larger picture at hand. Yes, there are interracial tensions, but why? What are the underlying reasons? Who controlled the money and the flow of people. Why could a whole group of people move out of an area and not only take resources and taxes with them, but also business and corporate investment? It's a sure sign of racism at work and without looking at the white flight movement and the white dynamic, I don't think the 1992 rebellion or the Watts Riots would be complete.

[Napoleon Chynamite]

Actually, I'd argue differently, for example. A lot of people who've studied the model minority myth would say that the white patriarchy uses a middle man in order to exert power or influence in communities. Take the Watts Riots/Rebellion of the 1920s. Jewish merchants who lived in Watts had their homes and stores burnt down due to angry African Americans. Now, as I remember someone explaining it to me, this rebellion was because there was a white flight that happened around this time due to the influx of African Americans into the Southern Californian community. Jewish merchants who operated between white and black communities took the stores that these whites left. (This was before Jewish peoples were included under the "white" umbrella). In essence, they became surrogate whites, a buffer for white people who operated these stores before.

Now, flash forward to 1992, the LA rebellion. Again we have African Americans destroying what appears to be Korean stores due to a radical decision akin to the Vincent Chin decision in 1982. What people don't tell you is that Korean store owners were viewed as surrogate whites. Again, this was due to white flight. There was a large amount of store owners in the area, but after they left, Korean Americans came and took over these stores.

Now, if you go around the communities, you find that there isn't a lot of corporate investment. There aren't Costcos, Targets, Starbucks or other mainstream places like Mervyns. Before the 1992 rebellion, this place lacked investment. A lot of people attribute this to the fact that the white flight had a untold racist effect on the area and created a vacuum. This vacuum took Korean Americans in and made them surrogate whites. The case where as I recall the Williams girl was murdered and the murderer given a slap on the wrist for punishment reinforced the black community there that Koreans were just surrogate whites. Increasing tension between people of color. That same tension escalated to the 1992 rebellion.

Inter-racial tensions, are only part of the story, I believe we must look at the entire racial hiearchy and understand the larger picture at hand. Yes, there are interracial tensions, but why? What are the underlying reasons? Who controlled the money and the flow of people. Why could a whole group of people move out of an area and not only take resources and taxes with them, but also business and corporate investment? It's a sure sign of racism at work and without looking at the white flight movement and the white dynamic, I don't think the 1992 rebellion or the Watts Riots would be complete.

All this is fine and dandy, but again I don't really see what your point is here. You're going into specifics regarding just how interconnected many of the struggles faced by minority groups are thanks to the evil white man who is pulling all the strings ..... which has been acknowledged many times over. But this doesn't mean that cultural, historical, and ideological differences don't count for anything, and I'm merely of the opinion that these differences outweigh the similarities, or at the very least, pose great significance when considering the existing racial dynamics in this country.

[tapestrybabe]

not that you'd be reprimanded or anything, but what is your race? are you a non-Asian member sucking up attention on YW?

if were talking about anonymity in this thread...
and the importance of having MERe members
reveal their race and ethnicity...
i for one dont really care or take that much
concern about who this person really is...
but from my several correspondance
with this person...
the persons race is not
so anonymous to me tho...

but aside from that fact, i just know
from day one, several months ago...
perhaps a year, 2 years ago...
when i knew nothing of this person...
when adoption issues were first being discussed...
>:^|, i feel it was this person and the MAin person...
who really had the ability to accommodate me...
understand me,
speak of the essense of how i felt,
truly relating to me...
more so than any asian who is openly out
on this board...

[Grasshopper]

.....the struggles faced by minority groups are thanks to the evil white man who is pulling all the strings ..... which has been acknowledged many times over. But this doesn't mean that cultural, historical, and ideological differences don't count for anything, and I'm merely of the opinion that these differences outweigh the similarities, or at the very least, pose great significance when considering the existing racial dynamics in this country.That's true but black posters like hooligan have no real interest in Asian Americans as a unique political entity. Instead he and other black posters like Chu Chi want Asians to be part of an agenda to fight the "evil white man."

Just look at the terrorist attacks in LA in 1992 that are given code words like "rebellion." This was simply domestic terrorism waged disproportionately at Asian Americans by black racists who were jealous of what they saw as Asians "blood sucking" from their community.

It was an uneducated black bigots way of seeing the Asian as perpetual foreigner, as not really American and definitely not black.

Unfortunately the reality of this kind of anti-Asian hate is forever denied, avoided and blame shifted away from the specific black haters onto some mythic entity like "the white man."

This is simply a ploy to evade black guilt for hating on Asian people. PERIOD.


I know this is getting away from the original topic heading but it's an important issue nonetheless.

I just don't think black posters, anonymous or not, or any posters should redirect Asian American political consciousness and make it a handmaiden to black political hatred for White America.

[Napoleon Chynamite]

^ Hooligan isn't black, lol.

But anyways, I guess it's all just a matter of perspective. There are many who argue that the L.A. riots and damage done to Korean businesses are only the end result of a long chain reaction of events and actions set in motion by the privileged white infrastructure, and then there are those who feel that the responsibility and blame of such vandalism falls solely into the hands of those immediately responsible, e.g. the African Americans who broke into Korean stores and made off with merchandise or damaged property. I believe we should consider both approaches and caution against placing too much value on one side.

[Grasshopper]

^ Hooligan isn't black, lol.
I was just trying to flatter him. :biggrin:

But anyways, I guess it's all just a matter of perspective. There are many who argue that the L.A. riots and damage done to Korean businesses are only the end result of a long chain reaction of events and actions set in motion by the privileged white infrastructure, and then there are those who feel that the responsibility and blame of such vandalism falls solely into the hands of those immediately responsible, e.g. the African Americans who broke into Korean stores and made off with merchandise or damaged property. I believe we should consider both approaches and caution against placing too much value on one side.
Yeah, I know all about the "root causes" game.

I find it an insult and part of the problem.

It's like the drug addict and the "enabler".

The criminals always find some educated wimp to make excuses for them and blame "society" or whatever.

"Critical race theory" is just a psuedo-intellectual game that fortunately is mainly played by people without too much power. Fringe academics and wannabees.

[Napoleon Chynamite]

^ Well I wouldn't be so quick to call critical race theory garbage. I believe it's a helpful tool in analyzing or taking a look at the big picture and seeing how everything fits into the entire machine, but it becomes a big problem when the theory's proponents begin to do nothing but point fingers and pull out the same blame cards, justifying their mistakes or shortcomings no matter what they may be by citing what a bunch of asswipes the people at the top are.

Frankly from my perspective, critical race theory tells us a helluva lot about human nature and human tendencies in general, and with an understanding of this theory also should come the understanding that just because you can call yourselves victims or oppressed doesn't automatically mean you're suddenly exempt from being reprimanded for your actions. Furthermore, reversing such a system of oppression or adding more balance to the system requires work on the part of all groups, which means minority groups and subordinate groups should not be allowed to just sit on their ass and wait for the white man to compensate them. What a lot of individuals don't understand is that we are all prone to acting in the exact same ways and abusing power, which is why threads like "If China ruled the world, no more oppression would exist" is bullshit. I know a great many people who actually grasp this quite well, and many others who fit what I just described, but ultimately yeah it would be unfair to throw critical race theory into the trash without acknowledging all the academic ground it has to offer.

[hooligan]

Just look at the terrorist attacks in LA in 1992 that are given code words like "rebellion." This was simply domestic terrorism waged disproportionately at Asian Americans by black racists who were jealous of what they saw as Asians "blood sucking" from their community.

It was an uneducated black bigots way of seeing the Asian as perpetual foreigner, as not really American and definitely not black.

Unfortunately the reality of this kind of anti-Asian hate is forever denied, avoided and blame shifted away from the specific black haters onto some mythic entity like "the white man."

This is simply a ploy to evade black guilt for hating on Asian people. PERIOD.

I know this is getting away from the original topic heading but it's an important issue nonetheless.

I just don't think black posters, anonymous or not, or any posters should redirect Asian American political consciousness and make it a handmaiden to black political hatred for White America.

What kind of shit is this? What makes you the white apologist? Let's talk about Asian American political consciousness in regards to the 1992 rebellion. Who the fuck said anything about avoiding guilt? People who've studied the 1992 riots point to and compare it to the Watts Riots. For many of the reasons above, no one absolved anyone of guilt. My friend, if you think this is some sort of African American apologizing, you are sadly mistaken and should remove that racist belief from your system. Jeff Chang, who wrote "Can't Stop Won't Stop" and many other APIAs view the 1992 Riots with sadness and we know that there are inter-ethnic problems, but simply saying that it's African American jealousy avoids looking at social, economic, and power that the white position and actions created the riots.

Look APIAs and African Americans share one important thing that being we lack a lot of the same power that white people do. I am the unique APIA political consciousness that you're looking for, what are you?

Yeah, I know all about the "root causes" game.

I find it an insult and part of the problem.

It's like the drug addict and the "enabler".

The criminals always find some educated wimp to make excuses for them and blame "society" or whatever.

"Critical race theory" is just a psuedo-intellectual game that fortunately is mainly played by people without too much power. Fringe academics and wannabees.

And not using critical theory is just another excuse blame shifting and avoiding looking at the complexities that things like race, class and power affords people and communities.

How would you explain it? Homie?

[Grasshopper]

What kind of shit is this? What makes you the white apologist? Let's talk about Asian American political consciousness in regards to the 1992 rebellion.
Calling the 1992 LA terrorist attacks a "rebellion" is obscene. It was a racist, irrational massive criminal enterprise that disproportionately was targetted against Asian Americans by blacks. Do you realize that the Rodney King punk that the trial was all about was a convicted felon who was on parole for the crime of, get this, an armed robbery of a Korean store owner!!

Who the fuck said anything about avoiding guilt? People who've studied the 1992 riots point to and compare it to the Watts Riots.

It was comparable to any mass terror attack or racial pogrom. Whether it's Jews being targeted in Europe, Indians being targeted in East Africa or Chinese in SE Asia.

For many of the reasons above, no one absolved anyone of guilt.

You have some kind of cognitive dissonance on this issue. Obviously you have a strong emotional need to connect with blacks in your war with whitey yet you feel a bit guilty about being seen as making excuses for anti-Asian haters.

My friend, if you think this is some sort of African American apologizing, you are sadly mistaken and should remove that racist belief from your system. Jeff Chang, who wrote "Can't Stop Won't Stop" and many other APIAs view the 1992 Riots with sadness

I don't. I view it with anger.

The 1992 riot in LA was domestic TERRORISM.

And it was racially motivated black hatred for Asians and anybody else not black.

I am not going to let these black bigots and criminals off the hook or blame blacks as a group or "hate whitey" for it.

The criminals and terrorists were adults and responsible for their behavior. Just like the criminals who carried out the Oklahoma terrorist attack and the Muslim terror attack on 9-11.

and we know that there are inter-ethnic problems, but simply saying that it's African American jealousy

It wasn't only jealousy. It was also hate and racial bigotry.

avoids looking at social, economic, and power that the white position and actions created the riots.

Look APIAs and African Americans share one important thing that being we lack a lot of the same power that white people do.

The differences between Asian Americans and blacks in America out way the similarities. Regardless of what you or neo-nazi types might think.

I'm not willing to lie about reality and dump everybody nonwhite into the same social group.

I am the unique APIA political consciousness that you're looking for, what are you?
You are a cartoon version of the cultural studies/sociology/left wing blame whitey college boy.

There is nothing unique about you. You're a familiar left wing radical nerd.

[hooligan]

Calling the 1992 LA terrorist attacks a "rebellion" is obscene. It was a racist, irrational massive criminal enterprise that disproportionately was targetted against Asian Americans by blacks. Do you realize that the Rodney King punk that the trial was all about was a convicted felon who was on parole for the crime of, get this, an armed robbery of a Korean store owner!!

It was comparable to any mass terror attack or racial pogrom. Whether it's Jews being targeted in Europe, Indians being targeted in East Africa or Chinese in SE Asia.

You have some kind of cognitive dissonance on this issue. Obviously you have a strong emotional need to connect with blacks in your war with whitey yet you feel a bit guilty about being seen as making excuses for anti-Asian haters.

I don't. I view it with anger.

The 1992 riot in LA was domestic TERRORISM.

And it was racially motivated black hatred for Asians and anybody else not black.

I am not going to let these black bigots and criminals off the hook or blame blacks as a group or "hate whitey" for it.

The criminals and terrorists were adults and responsible for their behavior. Just like the criminals who carried out the Oklahoma terrorist attack and the Muslim terror attack on 9-11.

It wasn't only jealousy. It was also hate and racial bigotry.

The differences between Asian Americans and blacks in America out way the similarities. Regardless of what you or neo-nazi types might think.

I'm not willing to lie about reality and dump everybody nonwhite into the same social group.

You are a cartoon version of the cultural studies/sociology/left wing blame whitey college boy.

There is nothing unique about you. You're a familiar left wing radical nerd.

lol. just lmao. anger, no shit sherlock. you also do realize that policemen did not protect korean stores, yet protected "better" neighborhoods outside of the riots? you don't know much about this outside of your racist views huh?

[Grasshopper]

lol. just lmao. anger, no shit sherlock. you also do realize that policemen did not protect korean stores, yet protected "better" neighborhoods outside of the riots?
That myth has been disputed by historians and in court cases.

Unfortunately, LAPD has a huge area to patrol yet has one of the smallest police forces in the country relative to civilian population and geographical territory.

you don't know much about this outside of your racist views huh?
That's the best you can do? You get a verbal beat down on all your sophomoric claims and all you can do is claim your opponent has "racist views"?

I think I actually know quite a lot about many things.

How come whenever you lefties can't take the heat you simply call the people who get the better of you "racist"?

When are you going to man up for the first time in your life and actually blame real people for their own adult acts instead of blaming the "white man," "the system," "the patriarchy," "capitalism" and all the other BS code words?

And if anyone here has "racist views" it's you. You just have a more "politically correct" target for your hate.

[pikachupacabra]

That's the best you can do? You get a verbal beat down on all your sophomoric claims and all you can do is claim your opponent has "racist views"?


Yeah, I know, why does hooligan even bother, right grasshopper? I mean, someone talks shit to you, calls you racial slurs, and then drags you outside, holds you down, yells some more racial slurs, brings over a friend to hold you down, yells a few more racial slurs and then blames everything bad happening to them in the world on you, your "race" and your "unfair practices", beats you with a baseball bat so that pieces of your brain end up on the asphalt, and then gets off of murder charges can't be a racist according to the legal system of america, so it's OBVIOUS that someone spewing nasty nasty racial SHIT from an anonymous name on an online forum should be safe from being a racist as well...no?


I think I actually know quite a lot about many things.


oh golly gee willikers molly, this here's a smart one!

[Grasshopper]

oh golly gee willikers molly, this here's a smart one!
True, but I'm humbled before the intellect of AliBabaIncorporated.

Not ashamed to admit it. :biggrin:

[hooligan]

It wasn't only jealousy. It was also hate and racial bigotry.

I love the irony in this sentence. You're allowed to stereotype a whole community of diverse people, thoughts, and beliefs, but when I call you on this remark. Because, it is a racist remark. you call me a left wing radical nerd.

You also must know that the majority of people who were arrested by police weren't Black at all, they were in fact, Latino. LOL. Good going sherlock, keep digging your hole.

[Grasshopper]

Originally Posted by grasshopper
It wasn't only jealousy. It was also hate and racial bigotry.
I love the irony in this sentence.
What's so ironic about it? I said the black rioters who targeted Asian Americans were motivated by hate and racial bigotry not only jealousy.
You're allowed to stereotype a whole community of diverse people, thoughts, and beliefs,
A diverse community of RIOTERS???
but when I call you on this remark. Because, it is a racist remark.
You called me on nothing. You are a coward when it comes to criticizing blacks who carry out racist hate on Asians. CASE CLOSED.

You can find nothing in my post blaming blacks as a people. I specifically mentioned blacks who were racist criminals motivated by hate, bigotry and jealousy.

You on the other hand run off into that critical race theory pseudo intellectual cop out that aint nothing but "hate whitey" cliches wrapped up in jargon.

you call me a left wing radical nerd.
And......

You also must know that the majority of people who were arrested by police weren't Black at all, they were in fact, Latino.
Oooooo, does that make you racist against Latinos?

I never said that Latinos weren't arrested as well as other races. But Latinos were not targeting Asians as many black rioters were. They were simply opportunistic looters taking advantage of the riot to steal merchandise. And they were wrong.

LOL. Good going sherlock, keep digging your hole.
My comments are up for anyone to read, in context, compared to yours. We'll see who is the one hiding in a hole.

[deez nuts]

I am the unique APIA political consciousness that you're looking for, what are you?


grasshopper is also very unique.

[>:^|]

Yellowworld.org: The cultivation of a political asian consciousness

When I posted, I was not intending to make a judgment on people for their responses to White posters. What I want to know is why. A couple of reasons I could think of for responding to White posters in a thread about Asian issues are our own desires to be heard and our desires to educate.

At one time I think I was flattered to have my opinion asked by White people and to give them my opinion. That's not where I am right now. In case nobody noticed. :tongue:

But I find it worth noting that we seem to be incapable of simply ignoring these posters, and that they then become the focus. I've seen this in real life too--in a forum convened to address serious race issues in a community, much of the time was taken up by a White woman who cried and talked about how she had tried to be friendly to Black people, but they were often mean to her.

And it strikes me that when White people are getting what they want from us--whether it be affirmation, validation, information, praise, whatever--they want to play here. What they do not seem to want to hear is our full truth, so when our reality conflicts with theirs, we're no longer fun playmates.

[hooligan]

Yellowworld.org: The cultivation of a political asian consciousness

When I posted, I was not intending to make a judgment on people for their responses to White posters. What I want to know is why. A couple of reasons I could think of for responding to White posters in a thread about Asian issues are our own desires to be heard and our desires to educate.

At one time I think I was flattered to have my opinion asked by White people and to give them my opinion. That's not where I am right now. In case nobody noticed. :tongue:

But I find it worth noting that we seem to be incapable of simply ignoring these posters, and that they then become the focus. I've seen this in real life too--in a forum convened to address serious race issues in a community, much of the time was taken up by a White woman who cried and talked about how she had tried to be friendly to Black people, but they were often mean to her.

And it strikes me that when White people are getting what they want from us--whether it be affirmation, validation, information, praise, whatever--they want to play here. What they do not seem to want to hear is our full truth, so when our reality conflicts with theirs, we're no longer fun playmates.

Yeah, for real. The more we want to press for our ideas and beliefs, we have morons coming on this forum ranting about how our beliefs are wrong. When we take a strong stand on something, we're inviting harassment.

What's so ironic about it? I said the black rioters who targeted Asian Americans were motivated by hate and racial bigotry not only jealousy.

A diverse community of RIOTERS???

You called me on nothing. You are a coward when it comes to criticizing blacks who carry out racist hate on Asians. CASE CLOSED.

You can find nothing in my post blaming blacks as a people. I specifically mentioned blacks who were racist criminals motivated by hate, bigotry and jealousy.

You on the other hand run off into that critical race theory pseudo intellectual cop out that aint nothing but "hate whitey" cliches wrapped up in jargon.


And......


Oooooo, does that make you racist against Latinos?

I never said that Latinos weren't arrested as well as other races. But Latinos were not targeting Asians as many black rioters were. They were simply opportunistic looters taking advantage of the riot to steal merchandise. And they were wrong.


My comments are up for anyone to read, in context, compared to yours. We'll see who is the one hiding in a hole.

Actually no, both Latino and African American rioters were targetting Korean stores. From what you said earlier, you only implicatd African Americans. Go ahead and hide behind your hate because it's apparent who you are and where you stand.

White flight isn't psuedo intellectual bull shit, what the hell makes you believe that? It's well documented that when whites move out of communities, they take a lot of resources from these areas. White flight takes profound impacts on areas where they leave. Go ahead and look around. Inglewood used to be a pretty white community and so was Compton. Now, look at what happened. Shitheads find juvenile reasons to blame people, akin to shallow racist beliefs.

[draconisz]

Sorry for butting in. . .but I have a question. Hooligan, are you Asian or Asian-American.

[mizhi]

And it strikes me that when White people are getting what they want from us--whether it be affirmation, validation, information, praise, whatever--they want to play here. What they do not seem to want to hear is our full truth, so when our reality conflicts with theirs, we're no longer fun playmates.

I don't want to derail this thread and ruffle feathers, but I thought I'd toss below in. Take it for what it's worth.

It can be hard for a white person to hear that full truth, it can be even harder to understand it. White people don't have to put up with a lot of the shit that APIA (and other groups) have to put up with, thus it can be difficult to understand where many of the complaints and criticisms come from. It can be a shock to a white person to see that the United States is not the happy-happy race neutral society they imagine. A lot of them, including myself at first, respond by becoming belligerent and defensive. Many times, understanding or, at least, being aware of the racism that exists involves taking a look in the mirror and acknowledging that many of the assumptions one had made about how the world works are incorrect. This takes effort, an open mind, and some soul searching. It's not an assumption of white guilt, but rather a realization that there is still progress to be made. This whole process can be difficult for a white person to wrap their head around while still retaining some amount of self-respect.

[hooligan]

Asian American (no hyphen please).

[draconisz]

Asian American (no hyphen please).

Sorry. . .my bad. Thanks for responding.

[o2binthesun]

Yeah, for real. The more we want to press for our ideas and beliefs, we have morons coming on this forum ranting about how our beliefs are wrong. When we take a strong stand on something, we're inviting harassment.



I haven't seen anyone really come in her and press any of your ideas and beliefs? I came in being honest and positive. At first I recieved feed backfrom some wonderful people. when I would post trying to be as openly as possible. I felt like many of you would twist my words and try to find a deeper dark hidden meaning in them? When I began to write opposition to this, I was warned, I have seen name calling and just flat out insults at the white comminity? Yet I guess that is Ok as long as you are Asian and are complaining about white issues? I am not saying that some White Americans don't deserve to be insulted? I am not denying there is racism in the world. From what I have read and I am not saying this about everyone in this group there are some great people here, this is the Asian, let's feel sorry for ourselves, shut up everything we don't want to hear hate group?
Where is the topic, how racism has affected you personally, or better this one? What are you personally doing to change things and bring peace between the races?

[PropellerheadCP]

From what I have read and I am not saying this about everyone in this group there are some great people here, this is the Asian, let's feel sorry for ourselves, shut up everything we don't want to hear hate group?
Where is the topic, how racism has affected you personally, or better this one? What are you personally doing to change things and bring peace between the races?

Actually, there have been a lot of discussions with those topics. If you just look through some of the threads, you'll see.
However, let's get real here: How do you address a personal problem that happened on a particular day, without seeming like you're "complaining"? You can't lump all of the little events that happen and sum it up into a nutshell to discuss how it's affected you, as a person. Not all the time, anyway.

Bringing peace between races is something that can't happen yet, because a lot of people (Asian or non-Asian) aren't willing to listen to each other. Unfortunately, that includes some people who offer advice on topics that they really shouldn't jump into, because they don't know enough about it.
People (Asian or non-Asian) from one group, telling people of another group how to run the show, without seeing the problems that they create by doing so, happens a lot. It doesn't help, either. It's like a man trying to tell a group of women, how they should solve their problems, or the other way around. It just creates more problems.

[koongchiulo]

group hug...

[>:^|]

Just a reminder that those of you who have chosen to respond to the White posters on this thread have been requested to explain why. Thanks.

In real life, it often strikes me that the Asian American voice is simply ignored. Peggy McIntosh notes this in her "White Privilege" piece:

My culture gives me little fear about ignoring the perspectives and powers of people of other races.

So why can't we ignore the White voice? Is it because it would be too dangerous for us to do so? Is it about proving our equality? Is it because we have learned to always response to White requests?

PropellerheadCP noted that we sharpen our own arguments through interaction with oppositional Whites. But my question would be at what cost to our own community? We have lots of complex, difficult issues among ourselves. If we're always staying at the top, discussing the simplest things like why a segregated group is not necessarily racist, then we're not discussing the tougher stuff.

[deez nuts]

Just a reminder that those of you who have chosen to respond to the White posters on this thread have been requested to explain why. Thanks.


that's very high and mighty of you to request that other asian posters have to explain their actions to you of all people.

[>:^|]

You don't have to if you don't want to, Chasiubao_Boy. It was a request, not an imperial command. :tongue:

[deez nuts]

You don't have to if you don't want to, Chasiubao_Boy. It was a request, not an imperial command. :tongue:

i'll indulge you.

i chose to respond to >:^| because i don't like having requests to justify my actions to anybody - white, asian, black, latino or whatever you is.

though i believe that >:^| is not white, i have no reason to assume he/she is asian either. so i chose to justify my actions to >:^| at his/her request just to be safe.

[SunWuKong]

I haven't seen anyone really come in her and press any of your ideas and beliefs?

believe me, we have had our fair share of non-Asian people come in here and dismiss either how we identify ourselves or the issues that we talk about that pertains to the Asian American community.

In real life, it often strikes me that the Asian American voice is simply ignored. Peggy McIntosh notes this in her "White Privilege" piece:



So why can't we ignore the White voice? Is it because it would be too dangerous for us to do so? Is it about proving our equality? Is it because we have learned to always response to White requests?

i can't speak for anyone else, but just because the Asian American voice is often ignored in real life, i don't think it justifies us ignoring a voice based on the race of the person it comes from. personally i take it on a case-by-case basis. if i feel that what a person said deserves a response, within the context of the purpose of YW, of course, i would respond. so i'll tell you what it's about for me. it's about treating an individual as an individual and not merely the sum of his or her race. in fact, you can say that the reason i wouldn't flat out ignore a white member here is the same reason i wouldn't cross the street when i see a random black person approaching. statistically speaking, crimes are more often committed by a black person in my city. what do you think, should my criminal radar be more sensitive when i see a random black person?

and again, YW may serve the Asian American community, but we don't exclude membership based on race and we've never encouraged all non-Asian people to be flatly ignored simply based on their race.

[hooligan]

At what percentage does a case by case basis support racism?

[Napoleon Chynamite]

I don't think we especially accommodate white people on here. If an Asian person or some other type of non-Asian entered the forum and asked a question or provoked us (like a black or Hispanic person or whatever), I'm sure most of us would be just as inclined to respond, defend, explain, or attack.

[kasia]

in case there is any misunderstanding, this thread is for our asian members to discuss the issue of accomodating white people on this forum.

[BeTheReds]

I agree with what most of this thread says. Often times in the hapa forum, we get non hapas coming in and participating in or starting threads that they shouldn't. While I am usually welcoming of participation from non-hapas, there are certain places in the hapa forum where we don't need any opinion from someone who isn't hapa.

The same is true for the entirety of Yellowworld's forums. There is a time and a place and a context for everything. And some non-Asians need only observe in certain situations. But I am not suggesting that by any means we need to disallow their participation as long as they realize when they can and when they cannot participate.

And people, don't feed trolls. They'll only stay around longer that way.

At what percentage does a case by case basis support racism?


HAHA.

I guess 51. lol.

[hooligan]

42, the answer is 42.

[>:^|]

There is a time and a place and a context for everything. And some non-Asians need only observe in certain situations. But I am not suggesting that by any means we need to disallow their participation as long as they realize when they can and when they cannot participate.

And people, don't feed trolls.

I recognize that not all White people are trolls, but I still think that we feed them in some respects. Speaking solely for myself, I would say that in the past I have attempted to respond to the questions and remarks of well-meaning White people. However, what I have come to recognize is that this encourages dependence of White people who think that they can learn about race and racism on the backs of people of color. Additionally, it seems to feed racist love. It often seems that people come here all enamored with the idea of our yellowworld, only to become angry when we don't give them what they want. Often what they want is in itself racist--they want acclaim for being so sensitive to us poor yellow folk.

This has made me think about privilege in another light. I think that I have often willingly given privilege to White people simply because I was raised to understand this was the norm. It also makes me recognize the inherent inequality of our relationship.

[hooligan]

Another thing that irks me is that we're trying to build an Asian American community, but I don't understand why we need whites to come in and give us their opinions about what our community is supposed to look like. Like the face is pointing out, why do we need to sit back and listen to them? If we're trying to cultivate an unique APIA political identity, what's the point of listening and even sometimes regurtitating thoughts and beliefs that run the mainstream (in other words, white beliefs?).

[deez nuts]

i'm curious who are the ones specifically (feel free to name names) that are accomodating white people?

[hooligan]

i'm curious who are the ones specifically (feel free to name names) that are accomodating white people?
I was addressing SWK's point.

[deez nuts]

I was addressing SWK's point.

i was addressing >:^| since it's his/her rant.

[hooligan]

i was addressing >:^| since it's his/her rant.
Feeling singled out or something?

[Martino]

i'm curious who are the ones specifically (feel free to name names) that are accomodating white people?

Almost everyone on this thread has given me karma at some point. Including >:^|.

I'm all for stamping down on white/other idiots who don't make worthwhile contributions, or cannot back up their ideas with well-reasoned argument, but how far does >:^| want to go? Should people stop feeding me?

I have to add that I've always rated >:^| very highly. I would still go along with his/her (still don't know which) ideas because I'm aware that I don't have the qualifications to argue/rant against them.

I'm getting feelings of deja vu.

:O/

[SunWuKong]

Another thing that irks me is that we're trying to build an Asian American community, but I don't understand why we need whites to come in and give us their opinions about what our community is supposed to look like. Like the face is pointing out, why do we need to sit back and listen to them? If we're trying to cultivate an unique APIA political identity, what's the point of listening and even sometimes regurtitating thoughts and beliefs that run the mainstream (in other words, white beliefs?).

1) are you assuming all white members come here in order to tell us what we're supposed to be like?

2) who are the white members that come here and are telling us what we're supposed to be like? note that i'm not asking you to prove anything this time, so it should be easy enough, right? as someone who does much of the banning, i know that they exist. the last time i remember this happening was CEBA and he's been banned.

3) what's the point of listening to black or Latino members, too?

[hooligan]

I'm assuming that when a white person responds to a thread about race or whatever on this board, I'm assuming their bringing in their perspectives about race, gender or whatever. Their posts do not outrightly dictate what we believe in, but they do bring in their perspectives on race. Also, the most obviously racist fucks get our attention, but then there are those who post on this board and make implications about who they are and reflect mainstream beliefs about APIAs without ever stating their racist beliefs. There are various white members who do this, including those who come here asking about cultural things they can do about their adoptive baby or white posters who post about interracial dating. etc. I've noticed that most adoptees are white and most of them ocme on this board asking for advice. WTF. Like any of us can speak for the most "cultural" way of raising an adopted Asian baby.

Hey, you're the mod, I'll leave the banning to you. Since, you know, all of you are so great at it.

[deez nuts]

Feeling singled out or something?

nope i was just curious and looking for examples.

but, if you or >:^| feel like i should be singled out, by all means go right ahead.


Hey, you're the mod, I'll leave the banning to you. Since, you know, all of you are so great at it.

lol.

yes we are quite good at it, aren't we.

[hooligan]

nope i was just curious and looking for examples.

but, if you or >:^| feel like i should be singled out, by all means go right ahead.



lol.

yes we are quite good at it, aren't we.
Don't worry, I knew that would get you all aroused.

[>:^|]

but, if you or >:^| feel like i should be singled out, by all means go right ahead.

I shall single you out for loooove. :biggrin:

Hey, I was speaking from my experience and noting some general patterns. What I did not want to do was to turn this into a veiled ad hominem attack, which is what happened in a large part of this thread. And that's another dynamic I think we could do without--arguing who has the best perspective or grasp of the issues.

Talk to the issues. Not to the personalities.

[SunWuKong]

I'm assuming that when a white person responds to a thread about race or whatever on this board, I'm assuming their bringing in their perspectives about race, gender or whatever. Their posts do not outrightly dictate what we believe in, but they do bring in their perspectives on race.

bringing their perspectives on race is a far cry from telling us what we should be like.

but i agree that there are cases when them bringing their perspectives is simply out of place.

i'd like to emphasize that it's not only white people who do this. when we get strict about a black person's participation or manner of participation not being welcome on certain topics, there have been substantial accusations of racism pointed in our direction - not every time, but sometimes.

Also, the most obviously racist fucks get our attention,

yeah, well, no offense, but i did notice that you replied to CEBA a lot, even if only to flame him.

i can agree with your assessment with this one, because i'm not about to defend racist fucks. but we'd really rather not ban people on the slightest of whims, so members will just have to do a better job at ignoring racist trolls and reporting them. there can be a lot of grey areas sometimes. there are those who really believe in what they believe, no matter how naive, or in some cases, how unpopular those beliefs may be. i think some of them can be reasoned with, and some of them are lost causes.

now one thing that we cannot do is apply the assumption of racist fuck to a person simply because she is white, black, or any other colour.

but then there are those who post on this board and make implications about who they are and reflect mainstream beliefs about APIAs without ever stating their racist beliefs. There are various white members who do this, including those who come here asking about cultural things they can do about their adoptive baby or white posters who post about interracial dating. etc. I've noticed that most adoptees are white and most of them ocme on this board asking for advice. WTF. Like any of us can speak for the most "cultural" way of raising an adopted Asian baby.

well let's talk about that specific situation of white parents of adoptive Asian children, since obviously this thread was initially started because of it. obviously i won't tolerate anybody who holds a perception of, for example, Little Chinese Girls Need To Be Rescued From Big Bad China. the particular person in question here actually came to ask questions, and for my part, i was glad to dissolve her assumptions about the One Child Policy and its effects - she in turn was open to learning my perspectives and not at all simply stubbornly dismissing them. maybe other mods will disagree with me on this, but i do not see the harm in this. and if there were any doubts, i would have done the same if it was a black adoptive parent doing this. for one thing, these people are raising Asian American children. that fact alone is important to realise.

now if such a person becomes belligerent, of course, that is another matter.

[deez nuts]

Don't worry, I knew that would get you all aroused.

close. but, not quite there yet. you tease.

however, if you decide to come back to ny to explore your asian heritage cuz i guess ny is the place to go to discover your asian heritage for you and you bring your foreskin to me then it might get me all hot and 2" erect.


yeah, well, no offense, but i did notice that you replied to CEBA a lot, even if only to flame him.


lol that is true. he was one of the more active members to reply to CEBA's antics.

[hooligan]

I guess, what I do is read in between what they're trying to say and what they're implying. Sometimes, after reading some of people's posts you can read certain racist remarks or ideas behind what they believe. For example, that same lady would not answer the question if she would have adopted a Latino kid. Also, she did not answer why she found adopting an African American baby worse (socially). It's things she's saying and things she implied. I'm not discounting racism, but I feel that if we're so aware of racism, wouldn't someone have read this and said something about this?

Yes, I did reply to CEBA, but I think there are YW'ers masquerading as APIAs. There are posters who find negative things to say regardless. There are posters who may be APIA but never bring their perspectives as APIAs into the discussion. Wouldn't anyone find this odd?

[deez nuts]

There are posters who may be APIA but never bring their perspectives as APIAs into the discussion. Wouldn't anyone find this odd?

it's about as odd as those apia that don't want to make their race an issue or sick about hearing about their race yet come and join a forum called yellowworld.

[hooligan]

it's about as odd as those apia that don't want to make their race an issue or sick about hearing about their race yet come and join a forum called yellowworld.

well, that's a good point, do you or can you separate race from being Asian American?

[deez nuts]

well, that's a good point, do you or can you separate race from being Asian American?

i dunno son of chu chi.

i just figure there's a method to to elbert's madness in adding the race/ethnicity option.

[hooligan]

i dunno son of chu chi.

i just figure there's a method to to elbert's madness in adding the race/ethnicity option.

I'm thankfully not a product of his loins.

[Tao]

i do agree with ben on the point that the woman wanted to adopt an asian because we're more "white" than a black or latino kid. And that even though she didn't say it, her implication was the asian baby wouuld be able to better assimilate into her family. I don't like the situation either, but in that case she was already dead set on getting a chinese girl, the postings in response to her was basically to help her be more concious of the girl's culture and development.

[o2binthesun]

I guess, what I do is read in between what they're trying to say and what they're implying. Sometimes, after reading some of people's posts you can read certain racist remarks or ideas behind what they believe. For example, that same lady would not answer the question if she would have adopted a Latino kid. Also, she did not answer why she found adopting an African American baby worse (socially). It's things she's saying and things she implied. I'm not discounting racism, but I feel that if we're so aware of racism, wouldn't someone have read this and said something about this?

I Yes, I did reply to CEBA, but I think there are YW'ers masquerading as APIAs. There are posters who find negative things to say regardless. There are posters who may be APIA but never bring their perspectives as APIAs into the discussion. Wouldn't anyone find this odd?




I have been following the discussion in this room. I see that it is important that Asians are heard. I think that is something that everyone wants. Asians deserve to be heard. I do not believe that this person has psychic abilities to read between what people are trying to say and what they are implying??? Racist remarks or ideas behind what they believe???? I believe you may be talking about me and that is fine. If you are? I am sorry I did not answer about adopting a Latino baby? I was open to that and I was torn between Guatemala and China. I have friends who have adopted from both. I did not say adopting a black baby is worse. I said, there is racism in society and it is more difficult and challenging. I have already been called on this too, because I mentioned it? I was married to a black man for 10 years. It was not easy.

I think you just like to argue and pick at people.
There are many people in this forum who have lots of interesting things to say. You just always seem to want to accentuate the negative? I get it? Your one of those persons who always sees the glass half empty aren't you? I wish for you someday to be happy.

[>:^|]

Does racism have to be overt? I think it's the covert stuff that is more interesting. And that's the way in which I think privilege operates.

As for liking attention, I'd note that I have any of a number of Asian female friends who have been flattered by the attentions of asiaphiles. I think it's human nature to enjoy having somebody pay attention to us. But like with asiaphiles, racist love doesn't do us any good either.

kimpossible noted at one point that yellowworld in general is geared towards the APIA community, and that is embedded in every thread. I think that's particularly true for issues concerning our communities. Notice that White people just can't seem to stay out of this thread.

[Napoleon Chynamite]

I remember reading about this attitude held by a lot of white people regarding how they see the cultures of minority groups, especially some of the ones that call themselves liberal or progressive (not a shot at progressives, just the misguided ones). They feel as if minorities should be obligated or happy to share with them their culture (or their women, lol) because to show interest in another culture's "artifacts" and "mysteries" is supposed to mean that they embrace diversity, which most white liberals and progressives (and non-whites) equate as positive and the key to utopia. And when they don't get what they want or they don't get a result which feeds into their ideal expectations, they start calling the minorities racist or intolerant. What was that one bullshit message CEBA was trying to get across when whining about Asian women who refused to date white men, "Stop being so racist and let us get to know you!" Funny~

But on the flip side, once again, I really don't think we especially cater to whites on here. Troll-feeding or responding to ignorant posts seems to be a tendency the vast majority of us have regardless of the race or ethnicity of the poster/troll.

[Grasshopper]

What was that one bullshit message CEBA was trying to get across when whining about Asian women who refused to date white men, "Stop being so racist and let us get to know you!" Funny~
To be honest, I always thought that guy was fake. He was so arrogant and in your face with the "Asiaphilia".

At first I thought he was Asian pretending to be a White asiaphile and maybe he thought people would get the joke. But then he kept at it.

He really was like a stalker but not for a particular Asian woman just stalker for the concept of Asians must not be racist and just accept his desire for Asian women.

He was definitely the second weirdest guy here, next to hooligan. :biggrin:

[power puff girl]

Another thing that irks me is that we're trying to build an Asian American community, but I don't understand why we need whites to come in and give us their opinions about what our community is supposed to look like. Like the face is pointing out, why do we need to sit back and listen to them? If we're trying to cultivate an unique APIA political identity, what's the point of listening and even sometimes regurtitating thoughts and beliefs that run the mainstream (in other words, white beliefs?).

exactly. i don't think i could have said it better.

we're talking about serious issuses for the asian community, and I don't know how many other asians feel comfortable