a book about china thats..not written by a white man!!!

[boondock]

holy crap!
a book written about moden day china thats written by...a white female? wow, i thought the day would never come

Foreign Babes in Beijing: Behind the Scenes of a New China
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0393059022/qid=1116218849/sr=8-1/ref=pd_csp_1/103-0655062-3711823?v=glance&s=books&n=507846

it just came out and has been getting some pretty popular coverage.
unlike most of the white guy "teaching english" or "business" experiences in china, her's is actually pretty interersting.
she was the lead in the most popular soap opera in china and was/is super famous over there.

[bluemonq]

i'm sorry, but anytime i read in a review that the author is presenting to us "the ultimate insider's view" my eyes just glaze over.

[Tao]

what's up with the outsourcing of babies to china...wtf. have some dignity america, and leave the chinese girls alone.

i've always been curious why these yuppie cock suckers go through all this trouble to get asian kids, when it's so easy to adopt a black or hispanic kid in the us. what too brown for ya? yeah real fuckin enlightened bunch these ppl are.

[yoMAMA]

ummmmm........

is she hot?

:biggrin:

[robotic]

ummmmm........

is she hot?

:biggrin:

click :cool: (http://www.pshares.org/images/upload/redauthorphoto.jpg)

[boondock]

uh...Tao, did you check the link from my message?
cause i'm not sure what your writing about
yes yes, i too, am pissed off at foreign adoption as being "trendy"
the whole, we are white "liberals", so we must save little asian babies from their oppressive, sexist, backwords culture and teach them the "freedom" and superiority of this culture etc...
but...this ain't about this at all..maybe you should start a new thread
again, check the link to this book
it sounds pretty interesting
and um, the girl's pretty, i mean she's not unattractive
cause i don't think they'd put her in the lead role of the most popular soap opera as the "seductress" if she was. there should be a pic of her somewhere on that page

[ahsingjai]

It's unfortunate that China had their one child policy. It violated the family traditions that Chinese people value so much for centuries. Made a lot of ignorant families dont want their daughters because of that family tradition. Now...

Of course China is reforming for the better, going back to their Confucius roots, easing down the strict policy by introducing the Two Child Policy and banning Sex Selective abortions.

[boondock]

ahsingjai...wha?
where'd this change in topic come from?
huh? wha?
can i completely change the topic too?
dude so like, earthquakes, what's up with that?
i mean like they totally suck! am i right?
someone should just go up to an earthquake and say, "hey earthquake, you suck and we don't want you around!"
stupid tectonic plates

[Tao]

click :cool: (http://www.pshares.org/images/upload/redauthorphoto.jpg)
eh, i'm not impressed

[ahsingjai]

ahsingjai...wha?
where'd this change in topic come from?
huh? wha?
can i completely change the topic too?
dude so like, earthquakes, what's up with that?
i mean like they totally suck! am i right?
someone should just go up to an earthquake and say, "hey earthquake, you suck and we don't want you around!"
stupid tectonic plates

Oops, I read how Tao said outsourcing babies, and I thought the book was about chinese babies... I just read the amazon.com summary.

[boondock]

oh, ok
heh
well, earthquakes still suck
:tongue:

eh, i'm not impressed

whatever man, i think she's pretty

[rotrab]

uh...Tao, did you check the link from my message?
cause i'm not sure what your writing about
yes yes, i too, am pissed off at foreign adoption as being "trendy"
the whole, we are white "liberals", so we must save little asian babies from their oppressive, sexist, backwords culture and teach them the "freedom" and superiority of this culture etc...
but...this ain't about this at all..maybe you should start a new thread

What exactly is this thread about? Just you with the hots for some white bitch>?

[Tao]

What exactly is this thread about? Just you with the hots for some white bitch>?
i hope so...we asian guys loves the white chicks

[rotrab]

^^That topic could have been introduced in a more appropriate manner. No one cares about foreign babes in Beijing. As usual, another book that's all about whitey even though it's supposed to take place in China. I thought you guys were tired of this insulting Eurocentric shit. I didn't know it's okay as long as "white chicks" are doing the insulting. And for this you love them? And when were you appointed to speak for all Asians anyway? "we asian guys loves the white chicks" frankly, speak for yourself.

[Tao]

^^That topic could have been introduced in a more appropriate manner. No one cares about foreign babes in Beijing. As usual, another book that's all about whitey even though it's supposed to take place in China. I thought you guys were tired of this insulting Eurocentric shit. I didn't know it's okay as long as "white chicks" are doing the insulting. And for this you love them? And when were you appointed to speak for all Asians anyway? "we asian guys loves the white chicks" frankly, speak for yourself.
dude, i'm only joking man. i love asian chicks as well.....and hispanic chicks.

i dunno, i tihnk it's funny that some white chick is fucking chinese guys and then writes a book about it...like give me a break. if it makes you feel any better rotrab, almost nobody has ever bought the book according to amazon's listing.

[rotrab]

^^Good.

[kimpossible]

and um, the girl's pretty, i mean she's not unattractive
cause i don't think they'd put her in the lead role of the most popular soap opera as the "seductress" if she was.

have you seen some of the foreigner 'models' in Asia? B or C grade. i'm not talking the international ads for chic products. the pool for non-Asian foreign actresses fluent enough to act would be very small. as long as you had whiter skin and weren't a total moose you could be a seductress.

[applehead]

have you seen some of the foreigner 'models' in Asia? B or C grade. i'm not talking the international ads for chic products. the pool for non-Asian foreign actresses fluent enough to act would be very small. as long as you had whiter skin and weren't a total moose you could be a seductress.

hahahahaha
so true so true.

[yoMAMA]

eh, i'm not impressed

same here.

^^That topic could have been introduced in a more appropriate manner. No one cares about foreign babes in Beijing. As usual, another book that's all about whitey even though it's supposed to take place in China. I thought you guys were tired of this insulting Eurocentric shit. I didn't know it's okay as long as "white chicks" are doing the insulting. And for this you love them? And when were you appointed to speak for all Asians anyway? "we asian guys loves the white chicks" frankly, speak for yourself.

chill homie.

I wasn't making any judgements on her book, I was just playing around.

[SunWuKong]

well, she found a niché for her writing. good for her as a writer.
i'd have to read the book to judge for myself if it's good or if it's crap though.

[Napoleon Chynamite]

have you seen some of the foreigner 'models' in Asia? B or C grade. i'm not talking the international ads for chic products. the pool for non-Asian foreign actresses fluent enough to act would be very small. as long as you had whiter skin and weren't a total moose you could be a seductress.

Kinda like the Asian models or celebrities here in the US right? :biggrin: e.g. Lucy Liu or Lisa Ling.

[VV o n g B a]

here's an interview of the author. she comes off as pretty knowledgeable on stereotypes on both sides of the pacific. she'd be an interesting person to talk to and the book sounds interesting enuf to read.

http://www.salon.com/books/int/2005/05/17/dewoskin/index.html

[kimpossible]

I'd be more interested in her experience with fame and observations of change in the society she was living in. As far as her detailing experience as a foreigner female in Chinese society and romantic relationship with a Chinese male... if I wanted to spend time on that I could just indulge in some introspection.

Maybe because I'm a foreigner I just don't get into ex-pat books. Male or female. Or maybe because I don't live the ex-pat lifestyle.

Serious open question to all: what's interesting to you about this book? Does it make a difference to you that she's female? I don't think I'd read it even for free. Not in protest or anything but lack of interest.

[Tao]

Serious open question to all: what's interesting to you about this book? Does it make a difference to you that she's female? I don't think I'd read it even for free. Not in protest or anything but lack of interest.

i would read it just cuase it's sleazy. it doesn't even have to do with her race. like if an asian woman wrote this i'd be just as interested. then again, i am perverted, so eh.

[VV o n g B a]

ya, partially its b/c she's female, but also for exactly what u mentioned, the fame and the societal change. but i wouldn't buy the book. i read books like this over saturdays drinking latte's in barnes and noble.

[moser]

Won't read it and don't care to, but at least she's not either (1) trying to "save" Chinese people (meaning she'd adapt to the country and not have it adapt to her), or (2) going to a non-white country because she wants to get an ego boost/people say she's beautiful. (Huge pet peeves.)

She's at least close to hitting pet peeve #3 of white people who go live in Asia: "showing off that I went to an 'exotic' country." I mean, doubt she'd be writing a book like that had she gone to say, Romania.

[moJo]

holy crap!
a book written about moden day china thats written by...a white female? wow, i thought the day would never come
are you serious??

[golden_buns]

have you seen some of the foreigner 'models' in Asia? B or C grade. i'm not talking the international ads for chic products. the pool for non-Asian foreign actresses fluent enough to act would be very small. as long as you had whiter skin and weren't a total moose you could be a seductress.

I think it's because they all look exotic to them.
One day I was in the subway with my gym trainer and he couldn't keep his eyes off from this really trailer-park looking girl, and he kept on telling me she looked like Angelina Jolie.

[yoMAMA]

I think it's because they all look exotic to them.
One day I was in the subway with my gym trainer and he couldn't keep his eyes off from this really trailer-park looking girl, and he kept on telling me she looked like Angelina Jolie.

haha....... :tongue:

[Tao]

I think it's because they all look exotic to them.
One day I was in the subway with my gym trainer and he couldn't keep his eyes off from this really trailer-park looking girl, and he kept on telling me she looked like Angelina Jolie.
awww....*sniff* true love.

[yoMAMA]

there's thing canadian guy in china [he's white], who's a D list star, and he's pretty popular in china [especially since he's so fluent in chinese and he learned xiang sheng, or chinese standup comedy-usually with two people though].

[Tao]

there's thing canadian guy in china [he's white], who's a D list star, and he's pretty popular in china [especially since he's so fluent in chinese and he learned xiang sheng, or chinese standup comedy-usually with two people though].
oh, you mean da shan right? yeah we saw clips of his performance on stage in chinese class.

side note: i love chinese class

[yoMAMA]

oh, you mean da shan right? yeah we saw clips of his performance on stage in chinese class.

side note: i love chinese class

yep, da shan, or big mountain.

everyone in china knows him :biggrin:



side note: i love chinese class

you man...taiwanese class?

:wink:

[AliBabaIncorporated]

Da Shan's washed up and gone, him and that other blonde girl with the 50s hairstyle always on CCTV are reduced to starring for electronic dictionary commercials and cheesy language skits now.

[yoMAMA]

http://www.iht.com/articles/2005/05/18/features/babes.php


The International Herald Tribune

Beijing's new beautiful people
By Ann Mah International Herald Tribune
THURSDAY, MAY 19, 2005

BEIJING A career in modeling was the last thing on Lee Ambrozy's mind when she moved here in 2003. But with her blond head and Caucasian features, she found her Chinese language studies at Beijing University constantly interrupted by talent scouts.

"Modeling agencies would hover around the foreign dorms," she said. The 27-year-old Detroit native has since appeared in several advertising campaigns and performed in two music videos. "Being foreign in China is like being a beautiful person, no matter what you look like," she said. "People are interested in you just because you're different."

Navigating your 20s can be difficult, even without the challenges of being overseas, underpaid and continuously under a magnifying glass.

Nevertheless, a growing number of young foreign women are moving to China's capital in search of adventure, love, and good jobs in creative fields. These female expatriates have discovered a world of opportunity in China, where the simple fact of their foreignness affords them opportunities they only dreamed about at home.

That's certainly true for Rachel DeWoskin, who lived in Beijing for more than five years in the mid-1990s. During that time, she starred in a Chinese television drama called "Foreign Babes in Beijing," as the character Jiexi, an American vixen who falls in love with a Chinese man and seduces him away from his wife and family.

Now, 10 years later, DeWoskin, 32, has written a book with the same title, in which she recounts her experiences starring in the show, and offers insights into her life as a young, single American woman living in Beijing. "All things American, even women, both shine and writhe under a spotlight in China," she said. "Even before I magnified the vision by parading on TV, I was representing all things American and felt a responsibility not to let my homeland lose face."

Ambrozy, who currently works as an editor at That's Beijing, an English-language magazine for expats, has encountered people who are fascinated by American culture. "It's exactly like exoticism in the West," she said. "It's like Asiaphiles. Here there are Ameriphiles."

Though she feels her exotic qualities have become an asset, she says she harbors no illusions about her appeal to modeling agencies. "There's a lack of people with foreign faces," she said.

Alison Friedman, 25, came to Beijing in 2002 on a Fulbright scholarship to study modern dance in China.

Her program ended more than a year ago, and since then she has been successfully pursuing a career as a freelance dancer and choreographer. "As a foreigner, it's much easier to be one of a kind," she said. "In the States, I'd just be a cog in the wheel. Here, everyone's inventing the wheel."

Helen Feng, 26, has found similar success in the entertainment industry. A Chinese-American fluent in both Mandarin and English, she has appeared on MTV Asia, worked as a D.J. for China Radio International, and is currently a television host for an arts and culture program that is shown on China Central Television. "I can play both sides of the coin," she said.

The interest in American culture rarely breaks down other cultural barriers. "I've given up on finding a mate," said Feng, who has lived in Beijing for over two years. "Dating is the biggest challenge for any female in Beijing."

Friedman, who is from Washington, agrees. "Chinese men generally think you're going to be easy. They have the idea from movies and TV that sex is a national pastime" in the United States.

In her book, DeWoskin recounts a similar experience: When a co-worker suggested that all American women are kaifang, she interpreted the term literally as "open-minded" and was flattered. It was only later that she realized that kaifang can also mean promiscuous.

Beijing's foreign women often face cultural barriers when dating Chinese men, particularly differing concepts of romance and intimacy.

In "Foreign Babes in Beijing," DeWoskin describes her relationship with a Chinese man, which eventually disintegrated under cultural pressures. Her candid emotions collided too bitterly with her boyfriend's guardedness.

The traditional family values held by many Chinese men also present romantic difficulties. "Relationships can be hierarchical," Friedman said. And in a society where the concept of face dominates most personal interactions, it can sometimes be difficult to ascertain your boyfriend's motives. "Many Chinese men date Western women to gain face," Ambrozy said.

There is even a Chinese word for foreign girlfriends: shuaitang, or colored candy.

Despite these obstacles, cross-cultural relationships are becoming more common. "I think the 'Foreign Babes in Beijing' scenario - imported girls and Chinese guys - is gaining popularity," said DeWoskin, who is now married to an American. "I have many Western friends who are deeply in love with Chinese men."

Ultimately, it is a combination of relationship and career issues that eventually propel Beijing's female expatriates to return home. "I don't see myself here for my whole life," said Ambrozy, who hopes to pursue a career in Chinese-English translation. "If I had someone to share my life with here, then I'd be happy."

Friedman cites professional development as her reason for planning to return to the United States. "There's no one to challenge you to take it to the next step," she said. "In China, for foreigners, it can be really easy to be too comfortable and not want to leave."

The lure of China may always beckon, however, and many hope that the country will always be a part of their lives.

"I don't think I could date a person who's never been to China," Ambrozy said. DeWoskin, who lives in New York City but returns to Beijing at least twice a year, knows she'll always have a connection.

"I spent my twenties in the homes of my Chinese friends, on the sets of Chinese TV shows, and gleefully happy in China's increasingly cosmopolitan cities," she said. "And I'm certain and grateful that I'll spend much of my thirties on joyful flights East."





IHT Copyright © 2005 The International Herald Tribune | www.iht.com

[BaiSanghei]

Ugh, that book was horrible. Condescending, name-dropping. She dated ONE Chinese guy, not very seriously, and considered him a loser, and takes him as representative of the entirity of Chinese male-hood. Her one experience is not at all universal, and anyhow many Beijing men are arrogant jerks compared to men elsewhere in China.

That book made me wince and laugh on many levels. She postures herself as cool because she listens to XX band, and has read ZZ academic; I'm actually close friends with the band, and have interviewed the academic, and would never name-drop them unless to quote and promote them. My former agent years ago wanted me to write a similar book, rock and sex with Chinese men, and I ran away screaming. Such trash.

On other comments: "It's unfortunate that China had their one child policy." Actually, it is easy to say living in an underpopulated place like the US. But population is a huge problem here, simply space-wise. The one-child policy has been a WONDERFUL thing for Chinese women, freeing them from the exhaustion of being endless baby machines. Yes, women's rights still have a long way to go, and are actually going backwards in many ways due to Western-imported capitalistic values. Yes, the OCP is horribly, inhumanly inforced, like most laws in China. But the abandoned baby girls are a casualty not of the OCP but of the continuation of those "family traditions" - sons are gods, daughters are trash - you trumpet and that survive among the rural poor. Legal or not, they have more children than they can take care of, then only "keep" the boys. But, actually, there are plenty of de facto abandoned boys too.

[CBC guy]

I remember reading this in HK a few years ago, its kinda entertaining, and the author is considered good looking for non-celebrity standards, so yeah it was a mild diversion. But nothing more.

P.S. Before you say I'm a race traitor I did not take DeWoskin's comments seriously.... they were good for a laugh, (IMO) that's all.

Oh, and that Canadian guy you guys were talking about, yeah, he's from Vancouver I think. Suprisingly well-known in China, second best-known Canadian after Dr. Norman Bethune.

[huangalex]

Beijing's foreign women often face cultural barriers when dating Chinese men, particularly differing concepts of romance and intimacy.

In "Foreign Babes in Beijing," DeWoskin describes her relationship with a Chinese man, which eventually disintegrated under cultural pressures. Her candid emotions collided too bitterly with her boyfriend's guardedness.

Lol! Cause we're all a bunch of stoic ice queens and westerners are these free love hippies!

[Golden Monkey]

a book about china thats..not written by a white man!!!

Quotations from Chairman Mao Tse-Tung

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/77/Little_red_book.jpg

[yoMAMA]

books written on china by a white man are not necessarily bad.

for example, yale history professor Johnathan Spence writes pretty awesome novels on Chinese history.

[CBC guy]

books written on china by a white man are not necessarily bad.

for example, yale history professor Johnathan Spence writes pretty awesome novels on Chinese history.

Jonathan Spence is actually an excellent author and for a "white guy" knows a lot about Chinese history, even more than me probably. (Seeing as he's studied it for like 30 or more years now) I liked his books on the Taipings, the Chinese Warlords of the 20s and 30s, and Matteo Ricci.

DeWoskin is just pure entertainment though haha...

[badwill]

I think it is rather sad that there is a cultural fixation of whites in certain Asian country, while Asians in the West are only butt of racist stereotypes and jokes.

When will the day when Asian people realize the reality in which Asian are treated in the West. When will they realize that the West is far different from what they see on TV.

Asians are really naive. Asian in the West have the duty to enlightened people in Asia when they visit.