PDA

View Full Version : America rooting against Team USA due to racism?


Banana
08-27-2004, 02:34 PM
I must've missed the memo -- the memo that went out to the red-blooded American sports public and explains exactly when it became OK to throw patriotism out the window and openly root against a U.S. Olympic team.


Yeah, I didn't get that memo. I'm wondering what was in it. Did it mention Allen Iverson by name? Did it have stipulations about the number of tattoos acceptable on an Olympian? Was there a cornrows clause? Or was the memo just straight and to the point?

Americans do not have to support a group of black American millionaires in any endeavor. Despite the hypocritical, rabid patriotism displayed immediately after 9/11, it's perfectly suitable for Americans to despise Team USA Basketball, Allen Iverson and all the other tattooed NBA players representing our country. Yes, these athletes are no more spoiled, whiny and rich than the golfers who fearlessly represent us in the Ryder Cup, but at least Tiger Woods has the good sense not to wear cornrows.

The memo must've read something like that. That's the only explanation for the near-universal hatred of our Olympic basketball team. Oh, you can hide behind a bunch of other excuses. You don't like the NBA style of play (which I don't). You're rooting for the underdogs. Shaq and Kidd and K.G. declined an invitation. The selection committee picked the wrong team.


There are a million excuses, some of which might legitimize a teeny bit of hostility toward USA Basketball. But there's no reasonable justification for the out-and-out hatred of Larry Brown's squad. There's no reasonable justification for the sheer delight that many red-blooded, patriotic Americans are taking from the USA's struggles.


In a poll on Page 2's Daily Quickie on Monday, 54.1 percent of the approximately 20,000 respondents said they wanted to see the USA team lose, and another 19.9 percent said they "kind of" would like to see it lose. I've sat on my radio show the past two weeks and listened to alleged patriot after patriot bitch about and shred Team USA and openly admit they want the team to lose. One guy, who identified himself as a former member of the American military, said he hates Team USA because the team doesn't "represent the America he fell in love with." I asked him to describe the America he fell in love with, and he said, "it was a country you could walk the streets without worrying about being mugged."


So there once was a time when a man or woman could walk the streets without worrying about a wild gang of NBA players whacking them over the head with a bottle and taking their wallet or purse? That must've been a glorious time, because you can hardly go anywhere these days without looking over your shoulder wondering whether Tim Duncan or Stephon Marbury is stalking you. I know it's dangerous to make too much of the sentiments expressed by talk-radio callers. But they speak for somebody. Monday evening I wore my Team USA jersey to the Rams-Chiefs game. As I walked to the stadium, people laughed at me and my jersey and several people made disparaging comments about our basketball team.


If this team doesn't win the gold medal (they beat Spain Thursday to advance to the semifinals), I half expect Americans to spit on Iverson, Duncan, LeBron James and Carmelo Anthony at the airport. We haven't fielded a team this unpopular at home since Johnson and Nixon sent Team USA into Vietnam.


This is ridiculous, and it hints at a much larger issue.
Someone call Johnnie Cochran and have him send over "The Card" -- the race one.



This team is being discussed unfairly in the media and being treated unfairly by American sports fans. There's a lot of convenient denial going on. No one wants to deal with the truth because they're having too much fun blasting a bunch of black millionaires for being lazy, unpatriotic and stupid. With the exception of adding the word "millionaires," this is a very familiar tune.


It's just more denial. The truth -- and what needs to be discussed -- is that African-American basketball players no longer have a lock on the game. The rest of the world has caught up, at warp speed. The game has been exported and redefined in superior fashion.

Go ask the folks up in Canada what the Soviets did to the game of hockey. Don Cherry can tell you all about the Red Army team whipping Canadian and NHL fanny on bigger rinks with faster, more creative skaters. It was 1972, and Team Canada -- the best Canadian-born NHL players formed into a Dream Team -- took on the Soviet Union team, which had pretty much dominated international play since 1954. It was called the Summit Series -- eight games between the world's two hockey powers.


The Soviets won the first game 7-3 and led the series 3-1-1 before the Canadians rallied to win the last three games -- all by one goal -- to win the series. Paul Henderson scored a goal with 34 seconds to play in Game 8, or the series would've ended in a tie. One of the reasons Team Canada eventually prevailed is that the bigger, stronger Canadians began to resort to cheap shots and thuggery on the ice. Several Canadian players later admitted they were embarrassed by what they had to do to sneak past the quicker Soviets. A Canadian newspaperman had to eat his entire newspaper because he'd promised to do it if Phil Esposito, Stan Mikita, Ken Dryden and Co. lost a single game in the series.


Canadians invented hockey in the late 1800s, and once dominated it the way African-Americans dominate basketball. Eastern Europeans reinvented the game and made up nearly 70 years of hockey experience on the Canadians in just two decades.


Sound anything like what we're witnessing on the basketball court?


Eastern Europeans introduced finesse, speed and creative passing to hockey. No longer could you just dump the puck into the zone and maul the guy in the corner. You had to play the game. The Canadians weren't stupid and lazy. They were just slow to adjust to a new, superior brand of hockey.


"Back then, we thought our way was the only way to play hockey; and we found out it wasn't," American Ken Morrow, one of the heroes on the 1980 Miracle on Ice Olympic team, told me Wednesday. "The NBA is kind of going through that right now. Hockey went through it in the 1970s and '80s. The NBA should look at what we went through and learn from it."


Morrow, the current director of pro scouting for the New York Islanders, played 10 years in the NHL. He vividly remembers the 1972 Summit Series.


"You talk to people in Canada, and they'll tell you the Summit Series was like a national emergency," Morrow said. "It really shook the heart and soul of the Canadians."


The similarities between hockey and basketball and the impact that international play is having on the games is indisputable. The high rounds of the NHL draft now favor European players. The NHL in the 1970s celebrated the Philadelphia Flyers' Broad Street Bullies approach, which included beating people up. The game was played at a slow, boring, defensive pace. Does that sound anything like today's NBA?


"The skill portion of the game [hockey] is viewed as being superior by the Europeans," Morrow said. "But when it comes to character and heart and competing, it's still the Canadians and the American players. Just look at the top scorers in the NHL the last few years -- seven or eight out of 10 are European."


Doesn't that sound like Dirk Nowitzki vs. Ben Wallace?


The international style of basketball play is superior to the American game, particularly the NBA game. The wide lane, shorter 3-pointer and prevalence of zone defenses limit the effectiveness of the NBA's two-man game. You can't have three guys stand on one side of the court and talk to Spike Lee while your two best players go two-on-two on the other side. It's boring, and it doesn't work in international play.

It's also foolish and arrogant to believe that we can throw a team together that can take on the world in two or three weeks. We can't do it. Even if we had Shaq and Kidd and K.G., our team would need time to prepare. We obviously need role players.
Would Michael Phelps have been this excited about the Olympics if he was making millions as a professional swimmer?

What bothers me most are the charges that Iverson and Co. aren't trying and don't care. First and foremost, they do care and they are trying. They're competitors. They know what's at stake. They don't want to be ripped at home.

But do they care about the Olympics the way Michael Phelps does? No. And we shouldn't expect them to. American basketball players don't spend their childhoods dreaming about playing in the Olympics. Their goal is the NBA. For swimmers and track athletes and gymnasts, on the other hand, the Olympics is the pinnacle.

If there was a professional swimming league that would make Phelps filthy rich, I guarantee he'd dream of making that league more than he dreamt of making the Olympic team. Phelps might even turn down a spot on the Olympic team, if it interfered with his professional swimming offseason.
Once every four years, Phelps and Carly Patterson and Justin Gatlin get an opportunity to strike it rich. They go all out. Don't romanticize it. They're chasing money -- endorsement opportunities -- just like the NBA players. Phelps, Patterson and Gatlin might be more cooperative and gracious with the media during the Olympics because they only have to deal with us once every four years. We don't know how they'd react if they were forced to talk to us every day almost year round.

The criticism of USA Basketball is borderline racist, is definitely unsophisticated and exposes a lot of super patriots as hypocrites. Allen Iverson is wearing our jersey -- our red, white and blue -- and playing the game the way we taught him to play it.



We owe Iverson support when he's representing us abroad. Save the hatred for when he's back home skipping Sixers practices and boring us to death playing a two-man game with Glenn Robinson.


http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=whitlock/040826

Mr.Lum
08-27-2004, 02:48 PM
I don't care about the color of the atheletes. I just don't root for team USA because I think it's stupid.

Napoleon Chynamite
08-27-2004, 03:04 PM
I don't care about the color of the atheletes. I just don't root for team USA because I think it's stupid.

Why/how is it stupid to root for team USA, or any other team for that matter?

Mr.Lum
08-27-2004, 03:16 PM
Why/how is it stupid to root for team USA, or any other team for that matter?

Why is it not? I think it's stupid to get all excited over a team whereever it is from because what does it mean to you? It means nothing to me. Rooting for the Chinese team makes no more difference than rooting for the US or Fijian team. You're doing the same thing just behind a different flag.

Napoleon Chynamite
08-27-2004, 03:27 PM
Why is it not? I think it's stupid to get all excited over a team whereever it is from because what does it mean to you?

Perhaps for the same reasons(s) you root for Fiji. Unless you were just kidding when you said you supported the Fijian Olympic team.

Mr.Lum
08-27-2004, 03:31 PM
Perhaps for the same reasons(s) you root for Fiji. Unless you were just kidding when you said you supported the Fijian Olympic team.
I was kidding. I saw them in one event. It makes no sense to support a country in sports just because you live there or have family there.

Napoleon Chynamite
08-27-2004, 03:34 PM
I was kidding. I saw them in one event. It makes no sense to support a country in sports just because you live there or have family there.

Personally, I am not a patriotic guy, and I could care less who wins the Olympics or ends up with the most gold medals or whatever. As a Chinese American I feel a very meager sense of alliance towards either the U.S. or China. Nevertheless, if you can understand patriotism and why some people pledge passionate devotion and feelings of attachment to their country and support for their country's aspirations (and you DO feel patriotic about Fiji, or at the very least you support them, do you not? I think this is evident in the articles you put up here and in your posts), then I don't see how you could not understand why the very same people would root for their country's Olympic team.

Mr.Lum
08-27-2004, 03:44 PM
(and you DO feel patriotic about Fiji, or at the very least you support them, do you not? I think this is evident in the articles you put up here and in your posts),

I care about Fiji only because I have family living there. I don't post articles about Africa because I have no business with it.
Nevertheless, if you can understand patriotism and why some people pledge passionate devotion and feelings of attachment to their country and support for their country's aspirations (and you DO feel patriotic about Fiji, or at the very least you support them, do you not? I think this is evident in the articles you put up here and in your posts), then I don't see how you could not understand why the very same people would root for their country's Olympic team.


I know why they do it, and I feel it is stupid and pointless. Pledging to the flag of any country in my view is foolish as well because all it means is that the leaders of that country can make you do whatever they like. "It's your country" my ass. Venezuala could just as soon be my country as well.

Napoleon Chynamite
08-27-2004, 03:45 PM
I care about Fiji only because I have family living there. I don't post articles about Africa because I have no business with it.

Do you have family anywhere else? Why don't you post articles about those countries too? If all your family members moved/emigrated elsewhere, would you suddenly start posting articles about all those other countries they moved to? I think people in general give a shit about a country for a few more reasons than just because 'they have family there'.

Mr.Lum
08-27-2004, 03:49 PM
Do you have family anywhere else? Why don't you post articles about those countries too? If all your family members moved/emigrated elsewhere, would you suddenly start posting articles about all those other countries they moved to?

If what went on there affected them than yes. I have relatives in Algeria and France but I am not very familiar with them and the happenings there really don't effect me or anyone I know well. If my family moved ot NZ or Australia I would post thigns about the happenings there (which I do) which effects them. I know my family in Fiji better than the ones elsewhere than besides the US and much of what goes down here doesn't have a big effect and it's posted about a lot.

Kuchana
08-27-2004, 04:14 PM
I know why they do it, and I feel it is stupid and pointless. Pledging to the flag of any country in my view is foolish as well because all it means is that the leaders of that country can make you do whatever they like. "It's your country" my ass. Venezuala could just as soon be my country as well.

And your reasoning is? How can you think it's stupid or pointless? Do you feel any alliegance at least to a particular country? I don't see my alliegance as benefiting the leaders to make me do whatever they desire. Isn't that a little far-fetched?

So I suppose you don't support the Olympics either, regardless of its purpose?

To be able to compete in the Olympics would be a great opportunity I think; not only in being able to showcase your talents but to represent your country and engage in events with others as well; all in the name of good will. It's an invigorating thought to savor.

Mr.Lum
08-27-2004, 04:26 PM
Do you feel any alliegance at least to a particular country?

No.

I don't see my alliegance as benefiting the leaders to make me do whatever they desire. Isn't that a little far-fetched?


The flag is a sybol of the government, a symbol of the leaders. You pledge aligence to their flag and recite their little ditty before you go to class and then they want to wage a war and they draft you and you do the same thing before you go off to kill people. And it's all fine and dandy because it's "For the good of the nation" no matter the acctual motives are. Why should I feel alliegence to any country? I'm just letting myself be used by some government elite for whatever he likes. I should have no alliegence to any state, just myself, my family and my God (though not in that order). I don't see why I should be loyal to a country as I can go to almost any other counrty and live there. I should be loyal because I was born here?

So I suppose you don't support the Olympics, regardless of its purpose?
I see no point in the Olympics, no. It's just an opprotunity for people to say "their" country is superior to another and get their minds off of the real world. That's the only reason I play rugby, to get my mind off other things. That's the point of sports.

To be able to compete in the Olympics would be a great opportunity I think; not only in being able to showcase your talents but to represent your country and engage in events with others as well; all in the name of good will. It's an invigorating thought to savor.


Nothing is done in the name of good will. That's nonsense. The world is just fucked up that they need to occupy people's minds with something else.

Napoleon Chynamite
08-27-2004, 04:28 PM
And I thought I was cynical.....

applehead
08-27-2004, 04:31 PM
The flag is a sybol of the government, a symbol of the leaders. You pledge aligence to their flag and recite their little ditty before you go to class and then they want to wage a war and they draft you and you do the same thing before you go off to kill people. And it's all fine and dandy because it's "For the good of the nation" no matter the acctual motives are. Why should I feel alliegence to any country? I'm just letting myself be used by some government elite for whatever he likes. I should have no alliegence to any state, just myself, my family and my God (though not in that order). I don't see why I should be loyal to a country as I can go to almost any other counrty and live there. I should be loyal because I was born here?
i suppose that is your prerogative.
but that's kind of selfish don't you think.
you live in that particular country. you make use of
it's resources and pay taxes and also benefit from the
taxes.

I see no point in the Olympics, no. It's just an opprotunity for people to say "their" country is superior to another and get their minds off of the real world. That's the only reason I play rugby, to get my mind off other things. That's the point of sports.
again. i see this as another selfish view of the olympics.
although i don't doubt that some people see it as
an opportunity to show off, most people don't see it that way
and it's rather unfortunate when they do.

And I thought I was cynical.....

hahahahah. mr lum is very cynical. :wink:
maybe he needs a hug.

Mr.Lum
08-27-2004, 04:39 PM
i suppose that is your prerogative.
but that's kind of selfish don't you think.
you live in that particular country. you make use of
it's resources and pay taxes and also benefit from the
taxes.



I could do that elsewhere. Everyone is selfish. That's a big part of "American" culture. People were no made to be locked in and brainwashed by states. I don't think people are nice and do things for other people, that's "unAmerican". You look out for yourself and if you rise or fall it's on you. It'd be nice if it weren't liek that but thats how it is.

again. i see this as another selfish view of the olympics.
although i don't doubt that some people see it as
an opportunity to show off, most people don't see it that way
and it's rather unfortunate when they do.



That's what it is. It's an opprotunity to show off talent. Then, when you win, you can say you are better than some other country. It helps the world's governments build up nationalism and support "look how great we are!" and keep people from thinking about their mistakes. It's a propganda show. I just do not buy it.

A.R.A.M.
08-27-2004, 09:06 PM
The flag is a sybol of the government, a symbol of the leaders. You pledge aligence to their flag and recite their little ditty before you go to class and then they want to wage a war and they draft you and you do the same thing before you go off to kill people. And it's all fine and dandy because it's "For the good of the nation" no matter the acctual motives are. Why should I feel alliegence to any country? I'm just letting myself be used by some government elite for whatever he likes. I should have no alliegence to any state, just myself, my family and my God (though not in that order). I don't see why I should be loyal to a country as I can go to almost any other counrty and live there. I should be loyal because I was born here?

Mr. Lum has a point: the state as an institution can be seen as a tool used by elites to more thoroughly dominate the masses. It allows elites to better extract revenue and labor from the people to support their lifestyles and goals.

Mr.Lum
08-27-2004, 09:52 PM
Exactly. And I refuse to bow down to them.

kuilong
08-27-2004, 10:04 PM
Exactly. And I refuse to bow down to them.

How enlightened and independent you are! I'm glad someone sees that patriotism is a fool's game. Would that the unwashed masses have your stunning insight.

AngryABCGirl
08-28-2004, 01:22 AM
Damn, I just sit at the TV and look at every competitor and root for whoever has the most spirit or whoever looks like they should win or whatever, I rooted for the crazy neon-dyed blond Greek with the crazy pink sunglasses the other day in hurdling just cause she seemed to be the most into it. In sports, honestly, it's really the althlete representing themselves and their glory more often than not, and I'm gonna cheer for that.

On the other hand, that article is kind of disturbing, but I kinda expect it from Amerikkka. America beats Kwan anyone? People aren't into cheering for their "people" unless it really is their people I guess.

BaiginLong
08-28-2004, 04:14 PM
i don't think that people are rooting against the team because of it's color but because it was picked to be a popular team rather than a good team and the management's decision backfired
the thing is they picked star players rather than putting consideration into making a TEAM
there's a big difference between a group spotlight basking ballhogs and a coordiniated basketball team worthy of the Olympics this was a protest against the marketing driven management of Team USA and an attempt to bring Team USA back to the heart of sport
this team was a far cry from the days of Jordan's prime

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/040827

Q: Could you please write a rebuttal to Jason Whitlock's column on Page 2 this week? I never thought I'd read such unfounded crap by a Page 2 columnist. He called you and every other white person a racist for cheering against the U.S. hoops team (because, of course, there were no African-Americans who filled out the Page 2 poll asking whether you are cheering against the U.S., right?), ignoring the fact any fan of the NBA and basketball in general would want the U.S. team to lose so that Stern and company chose an actual team for the next Olympics ... and make it so we don't have to watch Marion chucking up airballs, or hear Carmelo bitch about his lack of PT.
--Jay Detsky, Toronto, Ontario


SG: Wait, you're telling me that you didn't expect that column from someone this week? I'm surprised it didn't happen sooner; you had an all-black team taking heat for three solid weeks before someone finally played the race card. Geez, Ralph Wiley would have written that column before the Nightmare Team even arrived in Athens.


I thought it was a good column, actually. Whitlock took a controversial position, argued it and made a solid case. That's what a columnist is supposed to do. My biggest problem was how he played the "Shut up and support your country" card, which is fine and all, except this is how we ended up spending 13 years in Vietnam. He also ignored the bigger picture, something I tackled nearly a month ago -- how USA Basketball wasted yet another chance to build the best possible team from scratch, choosing to slap together an All-Star team strictly for marketing purposes. This resentment towards the Nightmare Team wasn't a black/white thing; this was about an unimaginative style of basketball that fans don't like watching. They had a chance to change this -- for the better -- with the 2004 USA team. And they didn't. That's why we're ticked off.


Am I rooting against them? Yes. I want them to lose. It's for a greater good. If they win the gold medal, we'll be back here in four years with another All-Star team. And besides, the Olympics aren't about following your country, they're about following sports. Five years from now, I won't remember how many medals the United States won, but I'll remember watching that Greek hurdler standing on the podium -- her eyes filled with tears, her body quivering, the gold medal pressed to her chest -- as the entire stadium belted out Greece's national anthem. Now that was a moment.

Best of all, she was white.


Just kidding. I couldn't resist.


(Quit cringing, I was just kidding. Really.)

younggiftedandblack
08-28-2004, 05:31 PM
And besides, the Olympics aren't about following your country, they're about following sports. Five years from now, I won't remember how many medals the United States won, but I'll remember watching that Greek hurdler standing on the podium -- her eyes filled with tears, her body quivering, the gold medal pressed to her chest -- as the entire stadium belted out Greece's national anthem. Now that was a moment.

This is the only part that I disagree with. I don't care what people say the Olympics ARE and have always been about what country comes out on top. It's always been political and nationalistic (is that a word??) If that's not the case then take the nationalism aspect of the games and just have the best of the best compete.

Napoleon Chynamite
08-28-2004, 09:32 PM
This is the only part that I disagree with. I don't care what people say the Olympics ARE and have always been about what country comes out on top. It's always been political and nationalistic (is that a word??) If that's not the case then take the nationalism aspect of the games and just have the best of the best compete.

I don't think that's what they are SUPPOSED to be about though. Just because something is a certain way doesn't mean it should be or was originally intended to be that way.

Mr.Lum
08-28-2004, 10:21 PM
I don't think that's what they are SUPPOSED to be about though. Just because something is a certain way doesn't mean it should be or was originally intended to be that way.
That is what they are about. It's for nationalism. It's not to see what atheletes are the best otherwist as youngandgifted said, there wouldn't be any nations attached to it. I think the games have multiple purposes but the primary ones I think are nationalistic.

bluemonq
08-29-2004, 07:06 PM
"Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel."
- Samuel Johnson

i just root for the underdogs usually. it's nice to have someone believe in you.

Kuchana
08-30-2004, 03:03 PM
I don't believe it's because of racism (from what I can see)...unless we're talking about a certain part of America. I think everyone is rooting against team USA because they sucked....taking home the bronze medal....:(

Exactly. America in general was expressing disgust at the team for not having their best represented and not having the heart to play. I think bringing racism is going a little too far.

Mr.Lum
08-30-2004, 03:05 PM
I also think the team was performing poorly. Why root for a loser?

mr. x
08-30-2004, 03:22 PM
I think yeah its a fairweather mentality, remember the episode of the simpsons where homer's like "yeah i believe in them no matter what"
"they're losing..."
"those bums!"

i mean i spose race could be a factor like for john mcwhiteman out in whitebreadston county cuz they resent the hip hop version of the american dream but yeah nobody was hating the old school dream team back when they were owning

VV o n g B a
08-30-2004, 03:26 PM
I also think the team was performing poorly. Why root for a loser? some ppl like rooting for the loser if they are an underdog. not everybody, but certainly some. i think most ppl got tired of the dream team b/c the players got arrogant and didn't respect the competition that was out there.