Anti-Japanese Protest in China

[seanp]

Has anyone heard of the new incident when a japanese teacher and three japanese exchange students put on sexually suggestive costumes danced wildly while shouting "this is you chinese; you dirty chinese" in japanese in Xi Bei University?

I don't have the articles but here are some pictures of the protest:

http://pure-essence.net/stuff/antijapanese/

[Tao]

someone translate for me

[John0101]

Being "anti-japanese" isn't going to help anything, it's just going to reinforce differences between the two peoples. I think Japan really need to rethink how its interconnection with China is thought in it's schools.

[yangbahn50]

japan is one of the most racist nation in East Asia. They won't offer Korean, Chinese, Vietnamese and Taiwanese students who ARE Japanese citizens any scholarship.

The *** ass governments are also drafting laws that will discriminate many foreign workers. I know a Pakistani computer programmer who was fired from his job after he injured his elbow. He was offered NO compensation for his injuries.

Hope the earthquakes in Japan serve as "batchi" and a reminder of their past heinous attrocious behaviors.

[Made in China]

Japan wont even apologize to Korea or China for there World War Two War Crimes. Not even a single dollar for compensation or even a simple "sorry" for the 35 Million Lives the Japanese Imperial Army raped and/or Murdered.

[Made in China]

November 14, 2003

Chinese university students march in Xian during an anti-Japanese rally, sparked by a skit put on by Japanese students.

Here is a link:
http://www.csmonitor.com/2003/1114/p01s04-woap.html

This is a very interesting story. Please read it if you have the chance, its something that all asians should have knowledge of.

If you guys knew the horror and atrocities that Japan did during WW2, you would have gladly lend a hand in the protest or the beating up of the Japanese Exchange students.

Most Japanese Textbooks have little more than 2 or 3 pages on WW2, and its war against China. But in China, everyone and every child knows of this, because entire generations of families have been wiped out, and daughters, fathers, or aunts have been raped or buried alive by Japanese Forces.

[Ogumo]

Before I respond any further MIC. Do you agree or support with the violent beating of those japanese people in that university?

[kimpossible]

Before this goes any further, let's keep in mind that as far as we know MIC is 14. And Made In China, please read our forum posting guidelines. I've provided a copy below.

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[BeTheReds]

from the article

The little-reported drama began on Oct. 30 at Northwest University when the exchange students, in a fraternity-style joke, wore red bras over T-shirts and a cup over their crotches while dancing to hip-hop music.

I don't see how that has anything to do with WW2. I also don't see why all the chinese people chose THAT to react to. It isn't an attack on China even.

[golden_buns]

I also feel disturbed when I read about what happenned during that time, and I'm not very pleased when some ultra right wing politician in Japan claims that what happenned was justifiable. But beating up some exchange students won't do any good and it's probably going to flame more hatred on the other side.

I think that there are things that should be left in the past, somehow this feels like when some african-americans place all blames for their burdens at whites for what their ancestors did. The people who did that wrong doing are long gone and the new generation who haven't done anything are getting blamed for all that shit.

[Ogumo]

from the article



I don't see how that has anything to do with WW2. I also don't see why all the chinese people chose THAT to react to. It isn't an attack on China even.

It was a overreaction. They assumed because japanese were involved it must have been a racist attack to china.

[SynRG]

It was a overreaction. They assumed because japanese were involved it must have been a racist attack to china.

I agree. I read about this when it happened, it sounds to me like the Japanese exchange students were just being obnoxious exchange students. I didn't see what if anything the skit had to do with WWII.

[Ogumo]

Exactly. But what really upset the chinese people in the class was the way they were dressed. I remember reading also that someone had on the back "look" and "china". This was not worthy of such brutal attack. I am curious if the chinese have investigated this seriously.

[SynRG]

Exactly. But what really upset the chinese people in the class was the way they were dressed. I remember reading also that someone had on the back "look" and "china". This was not worthy of such brutal attack. I am curious if the chinese have investigated this seriously.

Well at least the local police are protected the Japanese students that didn't get beat up. I can't believe they beat up a girl. That's seriously just wrong.

The power of rumor and gossip in Mainland China is terrifying. The story that's being told to angry protestors is probably alot worse than what actually happened. The only people who will ever know the truth are the people who were there.

Also, Mainland Chinese people are particularly mad at the Japanese right now because of that incident (I think it was down south) where a large japanese tour group in China had an orgy with local prostitutes on the anniversity of the day the Japanese invaded Manchuria. That was a little tasteless and harsh, IMO. But from what I have heard this has nothing to do with that at all. These students are just being scapegoated.

[SunWuKong]

threads have been merged.

[SunWuKong]

well, can't say i'm surprised this happened, what with the way Japan handles WW2 atrocities. and as far as education is concerned, i'm not so much bothered by the fact that the government refuses to teach their young more about Japanese WW2 atrocities, as i am bothered by the fact that young Japanese today are probably very unaware of what the Japanese military did.

[Emperor_Mike]

I think this is simply appalling. Insensitivity on one side and overreaction and violence on the other do not provide solutions to problems. Then again, I hope this is an isolated incident and therefore won't have any major ramifications on inter-governmental relations between Tokyo and Beijing, which is the most important thing anyway.

[Ogumo]

Well at least the local police are protected the Japanese students that didn't get beat up. I can't believe they beat up a girl. That's seriously just wrong.

The power of rumor and gossip in Mainland China is terrifying. The story that's being told to angry protestors is probably alot worse than what actually happened. The only people who will ever know the truth are the people who were there.

Also, Mainland Chinese people are particularly mad at the Japanese right now because of that incident (I think it was down south) where a large japanese tour group in China had an orgy with local prostitutes on the anniversity of the day the Japanese invaded Manchuria. That was a little tasteless and harsh, IMO. But from what I have heard this has nothing to do with that at all. These students are just being scapegoated.

Gossip and rumor having having so much grip on people in china? Feh I am not even chinese and I realized that. They believe these japanese were being racist to chinese because they wanted to believe it. I am sure no one asked for details in what happened. When they broke into those rooms they wanted japanese blood. Did you hear how they were screaming "kill, kill, kill"? Disgraceful. But you are right about these people being scapegoat for the previous orgy that was in china. If they were just mean to the japanese that were living there. Fine. But when you violently punch and attack two girls (and another?) when you are upset with their race you must ask who the real racist is here. I just cannot believe this behavior, it has upset me. But atleast chinese authorities are doing something to protect them. But I am farely sure that this has not received proper cover into the chinese media.

[Made in China]

whatever....

[Made in China]

Okay, Japanese look down towards Koreans and Chinese. I have some Japanese Friends.

The mainland Chinese are very dislikeful of the Japanese since they found mustard gas (WMD) in China that was left by retreating Japanese forces in 1945. 1 died and more than 50 injured.

Can you imagine that you were the son of a women that got brutally RAPED and bayoneted by a Japanese solider and That Japanese Soldier was your Father, and he is back in Japan sipping on some Japanese tea smiling.....

[kimpossible]

But regarding THIS incident what exactly did the Japanese students do that was disrespectful of Chinese? The only the article talked about was the students wearing underwear in a skit. There must have been more to it than that. No one is denying historical Japanese army atrocities or current racism/nationalism, we're questioning the details of the incident you brought to our attention.

[Made in China]

The little-reported drama began on Oct. 30 at Northwest University when the exchange students, in a fraternity-style joke, wore red bras over T-shirts and a cup over their crotches while dancing to hip-hop music. At this point the facts become blurry, but offense was taken.
..................."The Skit Incident Proves the Effect of Anti-Japanese Education,"blared Shincho Weekly, a popular Tokyo magazine with more than a million circulation. "This overreaction [is due] to the consistent anti-Japanese education in China since the end of World War II," the article quoted a Chinese journalist as saying.
So China teachs there youngs about Japanese War Crimes. This creates a bad reputation for the Japanese, and the Chinese will be disgusted and hate the Japanese.

..........All these factors were present, but the one cause that did not make headlines or talk shows in Japan was the issue that Chinese students themselves consistently described as the No. 1 reason for unhappiness: Japanese unwillingness to own up to the past. Many Chinese believe that Japanese do not see the war as wrong, but as a mistake - a distinction quite different in their moral calculus.

[Made in China]

And dont forget, Prime Minister Junichiro Koizumi will visit Tokyo's Yasukuni Shrine, which holds the ashes of soldiers designated as war criminals, and military leaders that was hung for crimes against humanity.

[Made in China]

http://www.japantoday.com/e/?content=news&cat=1&id=279254

He raped a women, and then killed her. I can never go onto foreign land and starting raping people.

[kimpossible]

At this point the facts become blurry, but offense was taken.

Be nice if some of those facts were unblurred to understand the offense taken.

[Proud_Jook_Sing]

http://www.japantoday.com/e/?content=news&cat=1&id=279254

He raped a women, and then killed her. I can never go onto foreign land and starting raping people.
Chill out man. You're not going to accomplish anything here bashing fellow Asians.

I think the incident no matter what the cause does show that despite closer ties, trade, etc. that there will always be underlying tensions between Japan and China unless an effort is made to address them openly. I am afraid that it is true, many many Chinese alive today lost one or more relatives from Japanese aggression during WW2 (myself included) and it will hardly be forgotten. It was Bosnia-Herzegovina x 1000.

Perhaps less suspicion and more interaction between China and Japan will lead to addressing the issue. There have been lots of articles written about this. I think it is just going to fester for at least another generation. The tension will remain until there is greater trust and friendship. Which is why we have YW :D

[jutau]

Those exchange students were "stupid" to even think such an act is humorous in any way. It's apalling to know that the only way humans know how to react to most situations is through physical violence. That goes for any culture/ethnicity. Humans supposedly one of the most intelligent creatures on this blue marble yet their actions bring them straight down to being the most dangerous and destructive.
Why does the mocking of another amuse the mockers?
What kind of pathetic satisfaction can they possible get out of it.
What kind of satisfaction can someone get out of beating another?

this event sickens me.

[SynRG]

Okay, Japanese look down towards Koreans and Chinese. I have some Japanese Friends.

The mainland Chinese are very dislikeful of the Japanese since they found mustard gas (WMD) in China that was left by retreating Japanese forces in 1945. 1 died and more than 50 injured.

Can you imagine that you were the son of a women that got brutally RAPED and bayoneted by a Japanese solider and That Japanese Soldier was your Father, and he is back in Japan sipping on some Japanese tea smiling.....

...and what do any of these have to do with beating up Japanese college girls? Particularly ones that made the effort to go all the way to Xi'an China to study when they could have just stayed in Japan.

If you really feel strongly about what the Japanese did during WWII, and aren't just jumping on "hey lets hate the Japanese" bandwagon, then I think you should direct your anger towards the Japanese government, not innocent students.

[Made in China]

So.....Who is Japanese and who is Chinese here? I am Chinese, from Hong Kong. Japan took over Hong Kong. My great grand father was almost killed by the Japanese. He was a refugee and fled to Hong Kong for safety before Japanese Occupation.

I am only trying to explain what the Japanese Imperial Army did. Can I not explain to my fellow american-asians, the facts about the Crimes Against Humanity Japan did.

In American text books, does it say a Single word about the Rape of Nanking? But it blabs about the Jewish Holocaust, what about the Chinese Holocaust?

That isnt right .

I am not angery at the "students" but I am furiously mad at the Japanese Government. They couldnt apologize for there actions, and still think that they are the victor after they surrendered to the Allies. I am not try to cause trouble, I am just expressing my thoughs thats all.

[kimpossible]

I am only trying to explain what the Japanese Imperial Army did. Can I not explain to my fellow american-asians, the facts about the Crimes Against Humanity Japan did.


Most of us already know, MIC :)

[Ogumo]

...and what do any of these have to do with beating up Japanese college girls? Particularly ones that made the effort to go all the way to Xi'an China to study when they could have just stayed in Japan.

If you really feel strongly about what the Japanese did during WWII, and aren't just jumping on "hey lets hate the Japanese" bandwagon, then I think you should direct your anger towards the Japanese government, not innocent students.

You beat me to it.

[Ogumo]

So.....Who is Japanese and who is Chinese here? I am Chinese, from Hong Kong. Japan took over Hong Kong. My great grand father was almost killed by the Japanese. He was a refugee and fled to Hong Kong for safety before Japanese Occupation.

I am only trying to explain what the Japanese Imperial Army did. Can I not explain to my fellow american-asians, the facts about the Crimes Against Humanity Japan did.

In American text books, does it say a Single word about the Rape of Nanking? But it blabs about the Jewish Holocaust, what about the Chinese Holocaust?

That isnt right .

I am not angery at the "students" but I am furiously mad at the Japanese Government. They couldnt apologize for there actions, and still think that they are the victor after they surrendered to the Allies. I am not try to cause trouble, I am just expressing my thoughs thats all.

MIC I am not a patient person. But since you hate the japanese government SOOOO much. Why did you not start a thread about how japan does not acknowledge it's crimes insted of talking about how japanese were attacked at that chinese university? That would have made more sense.

[kimpossible]

MIC I am not a patient person. But since you hate the japanese government SOOOO much. Why did you not start a thread about how japan does not acknowledge it's crimes insted of talking about how japanese were attacked at that chinese university? That would have made more sense.

I think this is a good idea MIC. No one is asking you to not feel angry about Japanese war crimes, but out of respect for modern day Japanese citizens, and the posters here, can you please separate the actions of the government from students? A good place to start a post about Japanese war crimes would be in the Rant Room.

[amietron]

Cut the kid some slack. He's only 14.

[SunWuKong]

ok, there's a difference between supporting what the Chinese students did to the Japanese students/people in Xi An, and educating people on YW about atrocities that were committed by the Japanese military. those Japanese kids are innocent of those WW2 crimes.

[Made in China]

Woah! What Japanese Student? what areyou guys talking about?

[Made in China]

Okay, Let me expalin. Anti-Japanesel protest right? Most primaily because of Chinese proproganda, some examples of what is pasted down from generation to generation about the Japanese since WW2

"Japanese, are bad people, they raped thousands and kiilled millions more, they think we are lesser beings than they are."

This is the way the mainland China peeps feel, and I cant blame them. They lived the horrors of WW2, but Americans were 8,000 miles away from the battle, so how can You guys talk about something your never seen first hand before?

Mainland Chinese develop a "extreme dislike" of the Japanese, before they SEEN there aunts being slaughtered. and with this crazy act and skit put on by the Japanese, the Chinese's anger and rage against this nationality group boils up and this rare outburst as it is written in the article is primarily because Japan's War Crimes.

Dont think that this war crimes are just low priority things. Many Chinese died....

does this clear up the issue?

[Made in China]

Have anyone BEEN to Mainland China? I have been there for 2 months over the summer, and I know about there first hand that a single word about Japan War Crimes can cause break downs and crying and hatred.

One 84 year old man could barely talk after I mentioned about this topic. He was crying and had very swollen eyes with anger. He said that his sister and best friend died during those 10 years of war.

Chinese Government isnt too happy about this issue neither.

The thing that gets me angry and the mainland Chinese angry is that Japanese Government never once apologize for there actions or gave compensation to there victim's family members to this DAY.

not even a single "sorry"

[SunWuKong]

Woah! What Japanese Student? what areyou guys talking about?

read the article you linked:

An ill wind rapidly gusted into a major storm in Chinese student Internet groups and in Xian, where about 50 Chinese, backed by a thousand angry onlookers, entered a foreigners' dormitory the next day, knocked on doors asking for student nationality, then beat up two Japanese, one a female. On Nov. 1, several thousand Chinese flooded the main avenue of the city, challenging local police over their protection of 42 Japanese students who were removed to a hotel; Japanese restaurants were trashed, and an apology demanded for the skit.

those two Japanese students and those Japanese restaurants were innocent of WW2 atrocities.

[SunWuKong]

Okay, Let me expalin. Anti-Japanesel protest right? Most primaily because of Chinese proproganda, some examples of what is pasted down from generation to generation about the Japanese since WW2

"Japanese, are bad people, they raped thousands and kiilled millions more, they think we are lesser beings than they are."

This is the way the mainland China peeps feel, and I cant blame them. They lived the horrors of WW2, but Americans were 8,000 miles away from the battle, so how can You guys talk about something your never seen first hand before?

Mainland Chinese develop a "extreme dislike" of the Japanese, before they SEEN there aunts being slaughtered. and with this crazy act and skit put on by the Japanese, the Chinese's anger and rage against this nationality group boils up and this rare outburst as it is written in the article is primarily because Japan's War Crimes.

Dont think that this war crimes are just low priority things. Many Chinese died....

does this clear up the issue?

well, for one thing, i question this "extreme dislike" you claim they have. i'm certain that many people are like this, however, Japanese pop culture and commodities also sell well in mainland.

and once again, nobody is excusing the atrocities that the Japanese military committed. but there's a difference between holding the Japanese government responsible and terrorising modern day Japanese individuals.

[SunWuKong]

Have anyone BEEN to Mainland China? I have been there for 2 months over the summer, and I know about there first hand that a single word about Japan War Crimes can cause break downs and crying and hatred.

One 84 year old man could barely talk after I mentioned about this topic. He was crying and had very swollen eyes with anger. He said that his sister and best friend died during those 10 years of war.

Chinese Government isnt too happy about this issue neither.

The thing that gets me angry and the mainland Chinese angry is that Japanese Government never once apologize for there actions or gave compensation to there victim's family members to this DAY.

not even a single "sorry"

yes, i have been to mainland China, but only in Guangdong. however, i have never spoken to people there about WW2. most of what i hear of WW2 have been told to me by my grandparents. my grandfather doesn't cry about it. he just hates Japanese people. well, actually he has mellowed out quite a bit in recent years. now he just blames it on the tragedy of war itself, sort of like how my grandmother has always felt.

another thing is, i have friends who are from mainland, and their parents talk more about the terrible experience they had during the Cultural Revolution than anything else.

[Made in China]

ohoh, ok. In the article, it said the primarily reason why the Japanese got beat up was because that Mainland Chinese dont particulary LIKE Japanese.

It was probably that dancing in underwear is majorly offensive to them.

You have to understand the dislikement and the relationship and political differences between the Chinese and Japanese to understand how this protest got started.

Many anti-Japanese protest in Korea, Vietnam, China, philipines and everywhere.

-------------

[SunWuKong]

ohoh, ok. In the article, it said the primarily reason why the Japanese got beat up was because that Mainland Chinese dont particulary LIKE Japanese.

It was probably that dancing in underwear is majorly offensive to them.

You have to understand the dislikement and the relationship and political differences between the Chinese and Japanese to understand how this protest got started.

Many anti-Japanese protest in Korea, Vietnam, China, philipines and everywhere.

-------------

well yes, like i said before, it doesn't surprise me what happened. but you have to understand that the resentment people feel is no justification for it happening. it is wrong that those Japanese individuals were victimised like that. they had nothing to do with WW2. just like you and i have nothing to do with the terrible things that Mao Zedong did.

[AngryABCGirl]

well yes, like i said before, it doesn't surprise me what happened. but you have to understand that the resentment people feel is no justification for it happening. it is wrong that those Japanese individuals were victimised like that. they had nothing to do with WW2. just like you and i have nothing to do with the terrible things that Mao Zedong did.


While I definitely understand the resentment and harbor some of toward what the Japanese did during WW2, I can't condone the beating of random Japanese people on the street for something that happened before they were born. It's the equvilent of a me going to out and beating up a white guy in Sacramento for their cruelty toward Chinese workers in the early 20th century.

[Proud_Jook_Sing]

So.....Who is Japanese and who is Chinese here? I am Chinese, from Hong Kong. Japan took over Hong Kong.

I am not try to cause trouble, I am just expressing my thoughts thats all.
Well unfortunately the way you are expressing your thoughts is indeed causing trouble here.

This is an Asian and friends of Asians community here. Look at the posters. The majority of the posters here are Chinese and trying to tell you to chill out. And the Japanese posters are trying to cut you slack because your comments are just offensive.

But 14 or not, you got to get control of your anger because it is unproductive and is trying to split our Asian community. I think most people here are well aware of what happened in China during WW2 (and yes American textbooks do mention it).

Chinese have long memories. Have faith things will work out eventually. If Japan is not ready to address it, let it go because it might not happen in your lifetime. Do you really want to be angry for the rest of your life? Are you going to treat Japanese as individuals or stereotype them?

14 is not too young to make some adult decisions about your life. Be above it. Be better than the mob who attacked those Japanese students.

[Tao]

Well unfortunately the way you are expressing your thoughts is indeed causing trouble here.

This is an Asian and friends of Asians community here. Look at the posters. The majority of the posters here are Chinese and trying to tell you to chill out. And the Japanese posters are trying to cut you slack because your comments are just offensive.

But 14 or not, you got to get control of your anger because it is unproductive and is trying to split our Asian community. I think most people here are well aware of what happened in China during WW2 (and yes American textbooks do mention it).

Chinese have long memories. Have faith things will work out eventually. If Japan is not ready to address it, let it go because it might not happen in your lifetime. Do you really want to be angry for the rest of your life? Are you going to treat Japanese as individuals or stereotype them?

14 is not too young to make some adult decisions about your life. Be above it. Be better than the mob who attacked those Japanese students.
good post man

yeah MIC, there are a couple of threads already on this topic, including one which addressed the issue of whether or not the atomic bomb should have been dropped on japan during WW2. Check out that thread, it's very interesting, and several of the members have voiced their opinions on the matter there, so there's no need to start another one.

As for your anger I do understand how you feel, because I used to feel the same way. But you have to understand that the majority of japanese these days aren't super nationalists. They exist, but not to the extent that you'd think. The issue of the war crimes is big dividing issue in pan-asian unity and cohesiveness, and will continue to be. However, what you personally can do is to inform people who don't know (japanese or not) about such events that occured in a civil and respectful manner. What you shouldn't do however is start complaining and moaning about how unfair it is that the japanese deny this and deny that, and don't teach thier children about it or whatever. Because if you do that then you'll just be spreading more hate around. Those who aren't aware of their government's past shouldn't be punished....i mean it's not their fault they don't know right? They should instead be informed. People, no matter what race or nationailty, will be sympathetic to what you say if you do it in the right way.

[Made in China]

Japanaese posters?! I am pissed at Japan Gov. not Japanese Posters! Weere not even takling about the Japanese students, I dont know why your guys are talking about them.

We Asian community can't "united" when such basic important issues are ignored.

Do any one of you guys learn of the Japan's warcrimes? If so, they give me some information.
I am not talking about any Japanese students, what are you guys getting mad about?

[Proud_Jook_Sing]

We Asian community can't "united" when such basic important issues are ignored.
They are not being ignored. This is simply not the time and place to discuss them. Japan is not ready so let it go.

Seems a much better route is to make friends with individual Japanese and Japanese-Americans. When Chinese-Japanese friendship is strong enough, Japan will be ready. And when Japan is ready it will be little little steps and gestures that is both politically and culturally appropriate. Backing them into a corner will accomplish nothing.

[SunWuKong]

Japanaese posters?! I am pissed at Japan Gov. not Japanese Posters! Weere not even takling about the Japanese students, I dont know why your guys are talking about them.

We Asian community can't "united" when such basic important issues are ignored.

Do any one of you guys learn of the Japan's warcrimes? If so, they give me some information.
I am not talking about any Japanese students, what are you guys getting mad about?


all i'm stating is that the violence against the Japanese students/people in China is not justified, because those people are innocent.

[frcegrl]

The faggot ass governments are also drafting laws that will discriminate many foreign workers. I know a Pakistani computer programmer who was fired from his job after he injured his elbow. He was offered NO compensation for his injuries.

off the topic but as we all sit here and judge others for their ignorance and racism, we don't see how ignorant we all are as well? i resent the use of "faggot" in this thread.

[deez nuts]

someone translate for me


it basically tells people to protest the incident and calls japanese people "zhi ben zhu" japanese pigs and telling them to "guen dang" to get out.

moving to rant.

edit: and try and keep it civil, jesus christ. i can't believe i just said that.

anyways, i know it's a sensitive and volatile topic, but think before you post. there are japanese members on this board that are held in high regard here.

[Made in China]

I agree that those Japanese students shouldnt have been beaten up.

there are japanese members on this board that are held in high regard here.what is that suppose to mean in high regard?

[kimpossible]

I agree that those Japanese students shouldnt have been beaten up.

what is that suppose to mean in high regard?

Though you don't realize it, a couple of the people defending you based on your age, and reasoning that you might be at the beginning of understanding these issues, are Japanese or part Japanese.

[deez nuts]

what is that suppose to mean in high regard?


they're yakuza

[mr. x]

they're yakuza

so that's what the whole mafia thing is about

nobody's asked me to kill anyone though, what gives? im stuck doing kasia's laundry

[ChinaLama]

so that's what the whole mafia thing is about

nobody's asked me to kill anyone though, what gives? im stuck doing kasia's laundry

someone's gotta do the dirty work and then someone else has to do the dirtier work. :-( sorry about that, x. The "laundry" is actually the clothes of our hits.

[mr. x]

someone's gotta do the dirty work and then someone else has to do the dirtier work. :-( sorry about that, x. The "laundry" is actually the clothes of our hits.

eww, i thought it was that time of month

:beerchug:

[yangbahn50]

The reason for all the anti-Japanese sentiment amongst her Asian neighbors is due to the fact they the Japanes government does not want to apoligize to Korea, China, Vietnam, Philippines...etc.

Many sex slaves from Korea to Taiwan are dying by the numbers these days. Only a few are still living, only to have Japanese court "clowns" rule against the plaintiffs. I wonder what Jaapanese law schools teach their students.

In addition, many people from China, Korea, Vietnam Cambodia were forced to work for evil Japanese conglomerates such as Sumitomo and Mitsubishi (which is why I think their cars suck!). The victims suffered from serious diseases that caused their skin to peel...and they slowly died in pain.

Japanese army also "cannabalized" Koreans, Chinese, Philippines....the males conscripted to fight for the Japanese fay-fairy army. That is soooo disgusting. Somebody brought up in another Asian-American forum that Japanese army raped a girl....and then ate her! WTF!

So...I do understand why the Chinese wants the "Japanese pigs" to get their a-- out of China. No offense....but although these students had nothing to do with their country's past.....their still a national of Japan representing their country.

[Ogumo]

No offense....but although these students had nothing to do with their country's past.....their still a national of Japan representing their country.

Fine. With that way of thought. Those chinese brutally attacked them were representing china and all the people in china. Anyway you try to say it. Those japanese girls did not deserve what they got.

[yoMAMA]

http://www.aceldama.com/~tomr/media/misc/hello-kitty.gif

Why can't we get along?

:heart:

[Proud_Jook_Sing]

MIC and YB, you are overlooking Japanese as individuals. Many individual Japanese do feel and express regret over what happened during WW2 and of their government's stance.

Let it go.

[SunWuKong]

MIC and YB, you are overlooking Japanese as individuals. Many individual Japanese do feel and express regret over what happened during WW2 and of their government's stance.

Let it go.


not sure what you specifically mean by "let it go". i think we should always remember the WW2 atrocities. my grandfather saw everybody around him starve to death during the Japanese occupation, and i sure as hell am going to tell my future children this.

but should we go around hating Japanese people? no. if there is any anger, it should be directed toward militarism and imperialism.

[Proud_Jook_Sing]

not sure what you specifically mean by "let it go". i think we should always remember the WW2 atrocities. my grandfather saw everybody around him starve to death during the Japanese occupation, and i sure as hell am going to tell my future children this.

but should we go around hating Japanese people? no. if there is any anger, it should be directed toward militarism and imperialism.
My previous posts mentioned that we will never forget. "Let it go" was basically referring to the same sentiment you stated above and in my other posts.

[Ogumo]

I agree... never forget what has happened. But do not stereotype and persecute every japanese person come to meet...When you stereotype all of us...arent you doing the same thing that you don't like americans doing to you? Think before you act...

[Blue dice]

From my experiences most Japanese people become very quiet and try to change the subject when the topic of WW2 or any of the atrocities are mentioned. I think quite a few know what actually occurred but there's still a degree of uneasiness in discussing it. What's hilariously ironic these days is that a lot of white people consider Japanese the darlings of the eastern hemisphere. I've seen big fat white pimply asian fetishist nerds try to defend/justify what the Japanese did in ww2. Then there's the hard right conservatives who say that since the Japanese are America's friends and China isn't they don't need to make any apologies or own up to the past.

On the otherhand, I don't blame all Japanese people but I realize Japanese society is rather complacent towards owning up to its past misdeeds. You have movies like Grave of the Fireflies which only accentuates Japanese suffering and it's all very self righteous when their nation were the ones looking to conquer/enslave people.

[Made in China]

what about the Killing Competitions? Two Japanese killed 300 Chinese EACH!!! The Largest Serial Killer EVER killed 48 in the US! This is more than 5 times that!

Its the same thing for the Jews. HEY! Lets defend the Nazi Germans for putting them in the oven!

Its the same thing for the chinese, koreans, philipinos, etc. Lets defend the Japanese for the biggest massacre in human history!

The Japanese were no better than the Nazi Germans.

[Ogumo]

Prove that japanese people killed 300 people each. I want some proof.

[Made in China]

Answer this:

If you thought that September 11th was "horrible"

The Rape of Nanking of 100 times more "horrible" It was the largest human massacre in human history.

saying "let it go" is just stubborn because it shows that you don't care for the 35 million lives that were lost.

You give a damn if 3000 AMERICAN lives were gone eh?
but if 35,000,000,000 ASIAN lives were gone, just say:

"Let it Go"

[ChinaLama]

Helloooooo radiobum. how YOU doin', my aussie brother?

[Made in China]

Sure, heres a proof:.

http://www.centurychina.com/wiihist/njmassac/killcomp.htm

another link.

http://www.centurychina.com/wiihist/njmassac/killgame.htm

heres is quote:
Japanese's killings were so cruel, savage, their ways of killing are beyond human imagination. They took killing people as a game.
This made me puke once!

For instance, once, Japanese invaders tied up more than one thousand refugees from several places in a square, and made them stand in rows. Some of them wore long robes, some wore suits, some were women, some were children, all bare-feeted. Japanese first sprayed gasoline on their body, and then shot them with machine guns, a big fire set off whenever a person was shot. Dying refugees being shot and burnt, their body shivered in pain, it was a field of flickering flames. Japanese invaders laughed wildly, took great pleasure in it.

[Ogumo]

While you are trying to prove that two japanese soldiers killed 300 chinese people each prove that 35,000,000,000 died in nanking.

[Ogumo]

Helloooooo radiobum. how YOU doin', my aussie brother?


I assure you that he is NOT radiobum.

[Ogumo]

Sure, heres a proof:.

http://www.centurychina.com/wiihist/njmassac/killcomp.htm

another link.

http://www.centurychina.com/wiihist/njmassac/killgame.htm

heres is quote:

This made me puke once!


No no no. Don't give me a site named chinacentury. Find me proof from another site. Preferably by a non chinese.

[ChinaLama]

Answer this:

If you thought that September 11th was "horrible"

The Rape of Nanking of 100 times more "horrible" It was the largest human massacre in human history.

saying "let it go" is just stubborn because it shows that you don't care for the 35 million lives that were lost.

You give a damn if 3000 AMERICAN lives were gone eh?
but if 35,000,000,000 ASIAN lives were gone, just say:

"Let it Go"

I think your stats are valid, but I think what PJS was trying to say wasn't, "Let go of the remembrance of Japanese war atrocities." I think he was trying to say, "Don't make yourself hate every Japanese person for what was done by some Japanese people."

Ogumo-- MIC was saying, 35 mil Asians died under the Japanese war atrocities, not 35 million died in Nanking alone.

[Napoleon Chynamite]

No no no. Don't give me a site named chinacentury. Find me proof from another site. Preferably by a non chinese.

Despite MadeinChina's very annoying demeanor, are you doubting the scope of his statistics?

[Ogumo]

I see. Not that this is good information but that is more believeable.

[Ogumo]

Despite MadeinChina's very annoying demeanor, are you doubting the scope of his statistics?

The part when he says two japanese people killed 600 hundred chinese together? Yes I doubt this is true.

[ChinaLama]

The part when he says two japanese people killed 600 hundred chinese together? Yes I doubt this is true.

that's really not that hard, I think. Just round up a group of people in a public square and use machine guns.

[Made in China]

No no no. Don't give me a site named chinacentury. Find me proof from another site. Preferably by a non chinese.
preferably non chinese? What is that suppose to mean?

of course, Japanese arent going to brag about how Japan murdered millions.

If you want more proof, I can give it to you.
http://www.centurychina.com/wiihist/njmassac/killcity.htm

HERES THE MOTHERLOAD:
http://www.centurychina.com/wiihist/njmassac/japaccou.htm

I feel sad, The Japanese say that only 6,000 were killed,
However, then Jap. foreign ministor Hirota Koki told the truth. In a document sent by Hirota Koki to the Japanese Embassy in Washington in January 17, 1938, he stated "based upon investigation, over 300,000 Chinese killed".

I told you this massacres are unimaginable.

[Ogumo]

that's really not that hard, I think. Just round up a group of people in a public square and use machine guns.

Yes it is possible that way. But they were having some type of killing contest they were probably wagering for something. I dont think they would be useing machine guns against the civilians in a contest and I doubt that they would waste explosives.... Probably the rifles or the pistols would be a more realistic choice here. And killing that many people with smaller weapons would take alot of ammunition. I am not saying it could not happen. I am saying I doubt this act happened.

[Made in China]

that's really not that hard, I think. Just round up a group of people in a public square and use machine guns.
no, not machine guns. It was said that they used Japanese Samarai swords and be-headed the victims. Or clubbed them to death.

Heres a Korean Site if you dont prefer Chinese.
Last Queen of Korea was raped.
http://www.kimsoft.com/2002/jp-rape.htm

I don't see how you guys can say:

"let it go"

to something this tragic, Do you think that the Jews should let go that 6 million Jews died?:eek:

[Ogumo]

preferably non chinese? What is that suppose to mean?

of course, Japanese arent going to brag about how Japan murdered millions.

If you want more proof, I can give it to you.
http://www.centurychina.com/wiihist/njmassac/killcity.htm

HERES THE MOTHERLOAD:
http://www.centurychina.com/wiihist/njmassac/japaccou.htm

I feel sad, The Japanese say that only 6,000 were killed,
However, then Jap. foreign ministor Hirota Koki told the truth. In a document sent by Hirota Koki to the Japanese Embassy in Washington in January 17, 1938, he stated "based upon investigation, over 300,000 Chinese killed".

I told you this massacres are unimaginable.

What I mean by non chinese is I would prefer the iformation be non biased by someone that would want to exaggerate about this "killing contest". Look find me a article that is not on this chinacentury site and I probably would believe. Something like that should be written in a number of places...but I do agree that massacre was very unimaginable.

[Made in China]

I doubt I can find a Japanese site about this, but, Let me check.

Allied POW survived World War II at a 2% rate in Nazi camps, but POW held by the Japanese died at more than a 37% rate .

This is a good debate, I hope that Ogumo don't take it as I am "anti-Japanese" I have Japanese friend.

[Ogumo]

no, not machine guns. It was said that they used Japanese Samarai swords and be-headed the victims. Or clubbed them to death.

Heres a Korean Site if you dont prefer Chinese.
Last Queen of Korea was raped.
http://www.kimsoft.com/2002/jp-rape.htm

I don't see how you guys can say:

"let it go"

to something this tragic, Do you think that the Jews should let go that 6 million Jews died?:eek:

Alright MIC let me explaine something about a japanese sword. Japanese swords were very well built. But most of the soldiers had two swords. One that was family handed down and one manufactured sword. The one that was handed down would NEVER be used like that. Because it would get damaged or broken. The manufactured one was lesser quality but still better than any other sword around. This sword could not kill three hundred people as you say. The sword would break or dull before it killed 60-80 people. I think that where ever you got that information that person exaggerated it.

[Ogumo]

Kid you will not find one in japanese about that. It doesnt have to be japanese. It could be written by a american or european. But I dont think that happened so may only be able to find it on that one site of yours.

[Made in China]

oops, not samarai sword then, probably a other sword.
http://vikingphoenix.com/public/JapanIncorporated/1895-1945/behead.jpg

http://www.centurychina.com/wiihist/behead-us-pilot.jpg

GASP! Your signature, Live by the Sword, Die by the Sword! jk jk. I am gonna rest in for the nite.

bye!

[Ogumo]

That is a japanese sword the man has in his hand. Also if a japanese sword could not kill 300 people with out breaking no other sword could. Japanese swords were the best built swords in the world. Those two pictures are real yes but that story about those two guys killing 300 each with swords is not. You cant believe everything you read online. No matter how much you want to. I don't deny that millions were wrongly slaughtered and tortured by the japanese army. But that story that you read on that site is not true.

[SunWuKong]

The part when he says two japanese people killed 600 hundred chinese together? Yes I doubt this is true.

actually i've read about this, too. it was a killing competition.
pretty sick.

[SunWuKong]

That is a japanese sword the man has in his hand. Also if a japanese sword could not kill 300 people with out breaking no other sword could. Japanese swords were the best built swords in the world. Those two pictures are real yes but that story about those two guys killing 300 each with swords is not. You cant believe everything you read online. No matter how much you want to. I don't deny that millions were wrongly slaughtered and tortured by the japanese army. But that story that you read on that site is not true.


ahh... doesn't that just mean that if they broke one sword, they got another one?

[Proud_Jook_Sing]

MIC, Ogumo, your arguing is pointless.

You do understand that war dead estimates are in fact ESTIMATES! They are statistical deductions based on a criteria of information that the estimator uses which may or may not be agreed upon by other estimators. Furthermore, the war dead includes those who die from starvation and disease. No one counted bodies. And I recall old estimates (which were much much higher) failed to account for displacement and counted them as dead.

Furthermore, arguing over the scope of the casualties is ridiculous especially to the rather offensive argument over the mechanics of swordplay vs. bullets, etc. Do you see how rather stupid and disrespectful it has become? Every war has atrocities commited on either side, who cares if it was 300 by 1 person, every 1 is a tragedy. So what if MIC is right or Ogumo is right about it?

Here, I found links to estimates of war dead by country. Guess what, no matter what number they came up with the sheer enormity of the tragedy is what matters.

Now both of you, "LET IT GO!" Move on to making the world better or get married and have some kids. We all agree that no one should or will forget the horrible cost of WW2, it was a global human tragedy.

MIC, if you don't like LET IT GO, how about MOVE ON.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_World_War_II_casualties_by_country
http://www.nationmaster.com/encyclopedia/List-of-World-War-II-casualties-by-country
Same source I believe.

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0004619.html
Soldiers only

http://ww2bodycount.netfirms.com/

http://www.skalman.nu/worldwar2/stupade.htm

[Ogumo]

ahh... doesn't that just mean that if they broke one sword, they got another one?

Only important soldiers were allowed to carry swords. So not everybody was carrying one. Out of 100 only 5 probably were carrying swords. So they could not have gotten another one in china. Where would they have gotten it from? They wont borrow the sword from another person.

[Ogumo]

MIC, Ogumo, your arguing is pointless.
[/url]

Agreed. I already know that casualties are just a estimation. I am just tired of MIC exaggerating things. I wasnt even planning on posting in the thread again until he said about the "katana (sword) killing contest". Either way I am done here.

[SunWuKong]

ok, i did some searching. i got this from two different sites, so i'm sure you can find it in other sites, too. one site is in HK, the other is in Missouri.

On December 7, 1937, the Japan advertiser, an American-owned and edited English-language daily paper in Tokyo, published the following item:

SUB-LIEUTENANTS IN RACE
TO FELL 100 CHINESE
RUNNING CLOSE CONTEST
Sub-lieutenant Toshiaki Mukai and Sub-lieutenant Takeshi Noda, both of the Katagiri unit at Kuyung, in a friendly contest to see which of them will first fell 100 Chinese in individual sword combat before the Japanese forces completely occupy Nanking, are well in the final phase of their race, running almost neck to neck. On Sunday when their unit was fighting outside Kuyung, the "score", according to the Asahi, was: Sub-lieutenant Mukai, 89, and Sub-lieutenant Noda, 78.
On December 14, 1937, the same paper published the following additional report:

CONTEST TO KILL FIRST 100 CHINESE
WITH SWORD EXTENDED WHEN BOTH
FIGHTERS EXCEED MARK
The winner of the competition between Sub-lieutenant Toshiaki Mukai and Sub-lieutenant Iwao Noda to see who would be the first to kill 100 Chinese with his Yamato sword has not been decided, the Nichi Nichi reports from the slopes of Purple Mountain, outside Nanking. Mukai has a score of 106 and his rival has dispatched 105 men, but the two contestants have found it impossible to determine which passed the 100 mark first. Instead of settling it with a discussion, they are going to extend the goal by 50.
Mukai's blade was slightly damaged in the competition. He explained that this was the result of cutting a Chinese in half, helmet and all. The contest was "fun", he declared, and he thought it a good thing that both men had gone over the 100 mark without knowing that the other had done so.

Early Saturday morning, when the Nichi Nichi man interviewed the Sub-lieutenant at a point overlooking Dr. Sun Yat-sen's tomb, another Japanese unit set fire to the slopes of Purple Mountain in an attempt to drive out the Chinese troops. The action also smoked out Sub-lieutenant Mukai and his unit, and the men stood idly by while bullets passed over head.

"Not a shot hits me while I am holding this sword on my shoulder", he explained confidently.

http://www.arts.cuhk.edu.hk/NanjingMassacre/NM5.gif

http://www.arts.cuhk.edu.hk/NanjingMassacre/NMHT.html

http://journalism.missouri.edu/~jschool/nanking/Tribunals/nanjing_02.htm#bottom

[Ogumo]

I appologize for my previous disagreement. I just didnt think something like was possible...

[SunWuKong]

here are two pretty good sites with info on the atrocities that the Japanese military committed in China. i especially like one section in one of them, explaining why we need to remember these atrocities.

http://people.bu.edu/wwildman/WeirdWildWeb/courses/theo1/projects/2001_chen/forgotten_holocaust.htm

http://www.geocities.com/jingpoo/forgotten.htm

Why Remember?

The constant exposure of Germany’s Nazi regime is now recognized as a major obstacle to the revival of Nazism in Germany. The Germans are aware of the unspeakable acts of their former leaders. This is not so in Japan. The present generation has little knowledge of the crimes committed by their forefathers. In 1977 Japan’s Education Ministry, in a basic history of Japan, reduced several hundred pages in length to six pages, taken up by photographs of Hiroshima’s ruins, U.S. bombing of Japan, tally of Japan’s war dead, with no mention in the text of the casualties of the other side. The following year Class A war criminals were enshrined as “martyr” at Yasukuni Shrine, Japan most revered Shinto temple, which is dedicated to Japan’s war dead. The high priests justified their action because the war criminals had “devoted their lives to the emperor and to Japan”. Ultrapatriotic organizations called the enshrinement “proper” because Japan had no alternative but to fight, and the war was a “sacred mission”. In 1982 the textbook controversy became full blown. The Japanese Ministry of Education called the invasion of China as an “advance”, and that the Rape of Nanking was attributed to the resistance of the Chinese Army.

The reaction of the Japanese officials to the protests of their fellow Asians was an echo of the position taken by the Japanese defense at the International Military Tribunal for the Far East (IMTFE), also known as the Tokyo War Crimes Tribunal. The Japanese government agency explained that it would be a distortion of fact to change “advance” into an invasion. Children would lose respect for their forefathers because they did a bad thing. Other critics argued that Japan’s allies, Germany‘s Hitler and Italy’s Mussolini, during the World War II had not use the word aggression when they advanced into other countries. Thus no aggression ever took place.

The world knows that China has been a victim of disastrous wars with Japan. China has been lenient with Japan. China has not demanded Blood Money Compensation from Japan as the Jews had from Germany. For many years some Japanese have not drawn lessons from their defeat. They would not take the defeat lying down. They have not given up their wishful thinking of reviving their old dream of ruling Asia. It is this handful of Japanese who still beautify the evil aspects of the militarists, and refuse by every means to take responsibility for the aggression that we have to be careful of. Harsh reality tell us that history cannot be ignored, nor should they be distorted. We should not let history repeat itself. We should take our stand to defend the truth and dignity of history.

Why remember ?

The victims have died and the world has remained indifferent. Elie Wiesel in his theological reflection says that whether we want it or not the Holocaust affected all subsequent events.

“If there is a lesson to be found …. It is for the world to learn, not for us…The world should learn its lessons on its own level for its own good, namely: when people do things of this nature to Jews, tomorrow they will do them to themselves. This perhaps, may be our mission to the world: we are to save it from self destruction”.

Why remember ?

It is understandable that a great nation does not want to be reminded of the dark side in its history. Whitney R Harris, a member of the Allied prosecution at Nuremburg said:

“This is as it should be, provided that in shunning the evil of yesterday we do not forget the wrongs to which it led—and having forgotten them believe them never to have happened”.

Why remember ?

Peace and development are the common wish shared by most peoples. The causes of war still exist. Various wars are still raging in many parts of the world. Human beings are still killing human beings. The nuclear war capability and biological warfare made wars crueler. We should educate people through history lessons and wake millions up to oppose wars of aggression and to distinguish its source. This is our mission.

Why remember ?

There are those who know what the word humanity means. Ms Minnie Vautrin, an American missionary, was one of the unsung heroes. In the dark days of the rape of Nanking, she showed love and courage, risking her own life, to protect Chinese women from being molested by the invading Japanese soldiers. She turned Ginling Women College (known also as Ginling University) into a shelter especially for women and children. The grateful refugees and their families addressed her as the “Living Goddess” or the “Goddess of Mercy”. Her life was written into a biography: “American Goddess at the Rape of Nanking - The Courage of Minnie Vautrin” by Hua-Ling Hu (Southern Illinois University Press, Carbondale and Edwardsville), 2000. Her life represented “the brightest example of humanity, love, and goodness” (United Daily, April 8, 1997). Emma Lyon, her niece, told the author that: “Aunt Minnie deeply love the Chinese people all her life. She regarded China as her home”. Her words moved me to tears.

Why remember ?

Senator Paul Simon of Illinois wrote:

‘The book gives us an insight into one’s life, one period of our history, and into what takes place regularly during a war. Throughout the centuries, men who have been trained to kill as a patriotic duty have found no barriers of conscience to raping and plundering. The eyewitness accounts—one witness the author quotes called it “hell on earth”---are graphic reminders of the need for peace as well as for growth in sensitivity to human rights.

Contrary to the “wisdom” of some, humanity can make progress. …..People with ideals who are wiling to work hard for those ideals, like Minnie Vautrin, can change the course of history’.

Why remember ?

The Most Reverend Desmond M Tutu, Anglican Archbishop of Cape Town, 1984 Nobel Peace Prize Laureate, in the Forward of The Rape Of Nanking: An Undeniable History In Photograph, by James Yin and Shi Young, commented that:

‘to sweep under the carpet the atrocities which occurred in Nanking in 1937-38 and turn a blind eye to the truth is at best a gross service to future generations, and at worst to be criminally negligent and irresponsible. A record such as this book is an essential part of our history. However terrible, we must not be sheltered from the evils of our past. If we attempt to forget and try to believe that human nature is good all of the time we will bitterly regret our amnesia, for our past will come to haunt us. We know that while created inherently good, any one of us can fall to depths of evil we might never believe possible. It is part of the way we are and why it is so necessary to constantly be alert to our failings’.

[SunWuKong]

I appologize for my previous disagreement. I just didnt think something like was possible...


don't worry about it, man.

well, on a technicality, it probably wasn't 300.
but i guess the sick thing about those two wasn't the number of people the killed, but the fact that they had a killing contest in the first place.

[SunWuKong]

to counter the opinion that some may have that Japanese people today don't know anything about the atrocities, well, arguably that may be true of young people, and keep in mind that most young people don't care about history in the first place, there are actually Japanese scholars on the Nanjing Massacre that pretty much agree with China's position, and some of them actually served in the war.

[Ogumo]

I agree.

[Made in China]

2nd Lieutenants Mukai and Noda, killed 105 and 106 Chinese people, respectively. This contest must have been the culmination of a previous rivalry for Mukai himself had killed 89 Chinese prior to the contest, while Noda murdered 78. Their immediate superior, Capt. Tanaka Gunkichi, had even single-handedly killed 300 Chinese. Such a savage act is beyond the human imagination... (several Japanese news paper reported this "competition", The subtitle of the news reads: "The add-time of two Lieutenants". ) http://www.centurychina.com/wiihist/njmassac/nmphoto/japnbody.gif
Japanese commanders used "killing competition" as a way to boost morale. They organized visiting and news reporters to appraise the "winner". One of killing competitions at ZiJin mount was reported by news papers all over the world.

well, probably not ALL were be-headed with sword, but most where bayoneted or used chemical biological WMD's on them.

[ModernLogic]

to counter the opinion that some may have that Japanese people today don't know anything about the atrocities, well, arguably that may be true of young people, and keep in mind that most young people don't care about history in the first place, there are actually Japanese scholars on the Nanjing Massacre that pretty much agree with China's position, and some of them actually served in the war.

By "agree with China's position" do you mean they admit the war was wrong? Or do they agree on the statistics? (ie. 300,000 Nanjing, 20-30 million overall).

[Made in China]

Would you guys want to visit the Kumontang Captital of Nanking? What if there are.......ghost ?

not even the German or British army have.......300,000 people. Can you imagine almost Three Hundred Thousand ghost in one city?

[SunWuKong]

By "agree with China's position" do you mean they admit the war was wrong? Or do they agree on the statistics? (ie. 300,000 Nanjing, 20-30 million overall).

they admit the war was wrong, they disagreed with the Japanese government glossing over the atrocities in Japanese text books, they don't agree with Japanese government's numbers, etc etc.

i mean, Japan is probably the only country in the world that downplays those atrocities (others may simply ignore it), so it's just illogical to think that there's nobody in Japan that disagree with the Japanese government's position.

[Blue dice]

they admit the war was wrong, they disagreed with the Japanese government glossing over the atrocities in Japanese text books, they don't agree with Japanese government's numbers, etc etc.

There was a Japanese journalist that did an expose on the whole Nanking thing back in the 90's but I forgot what his name is though. He predated Iris Chang's book about the Nanking massacre but his opinions never reached a worldwide audience until after Iris's book.


i mean, Japan is probably the only country in the world that downplays those atrocities (others may simply ignore it), so it's just illogical to think that there's nobody in Japan that disagree with the Japanese government's position.
It's pretty evil if you ask me. If you know your country did it and you purposely cover it up then who's to say you won't plan to do it again? The Japanese are very nationalistic people with a interesting sense of culture. They aren't what I would call tolerant of foreigners though and that's where I see how the same thing could happen with modern Japan. Maybe the country is more "mature" but there have been calls by the west to re-arm Japan to counterpoint China which is just a hilariously bad thing to do unless you want WW 3.

[SunWuKong]

There was a Japanese journalist that did an expose on the whole Nanking thing back in the 90's but I forgot what his name is though. He predated Iris Chang's book about the Nanking massacre but his opinions never reached a worldwide audience until after Iris's book.

pre-dated Iris Chang maybe in terms of the amount of international attention, but Chinese people have always known about the Nanjing Massacre and the disagreement between China and Japan on what exactly happened has always been a sore point between them.

[SunWuKong]

ok, let's take a step back here and remember that it was the Japanese military that did these things, and that modern day Japanese individuals have nothing to do with it. evidence has shown that some of the generals even did things without authorisation from the Japanese government.

it's very important to clearly draw a line of difference between Japanese individuals today and the Japanese military in the past. otherwise, you're just perpetuating unnecessary hatred.

remembrance is not resentment.

[Made in China]

Mainland Chinese don't like Japanese as whole. Hey, Who killed your father?......some Japanese guy. Hey, Who raped your mother?......some Japanese guy. Hey, who burned your house, be-headed your baby, and invade your country?.......some Japanese guy(S).

Mainland Chinese was invaded by Japanese people. It is normal that they should in theory have a extreme dislikement of the Japanese since the Japanese invaded them.

Hey, If you were in the shoes of the family victims, I can guarantee that you will not be saying what your saying.

I can guarantee that....

[Made in China]

If you knew how much dead cadavers and corpes of 35,000,000,000 people, "dislikement" of a particular race is barely a topic to bring up.

To summarize it, Japanese kill 35,000,000,000 Chinese, The Chinese Don't like the Japanese.

Its NORMAL HUMAN BEHAVOR.

You steal my car, I dont like you
You kill my wife, I dont like you
You burn my house, I dont like you
You kill invade a nation, I dont like you
You kill my brother, I dont like you
You kill 35,000,000,000 of my People, I dont like you.

If the Chinese can sustain a massacre of 35,000,000,000 people,and NOT BE MAD about it. The Chinese are the most Friendly, most generous people in the entire universe.

[ChinaLama]

Mainland Chinese don't like Japanese as whole. Hey, Who killed your father?......some Japanese guy. Hey, Who raped your mother?......some Japanese guy. Hey, who burned your house, be-headed your baby, and invade your country?.......some Japanese guy(S).


actually, a lot of Mainland Chinese could also answer-- other Chinese, from the KMT or CCP. :mad:

[kimpossible]

To summarize it, Japanese kill 35,000,000,000 Chinese, The Chinese Don't like the Japanese.




Uh... isn't that 35 billion?

100,000
1,000,000
35,000,000,000

[ChinaLama]

hey the dude has a genius IQ. How can we dispute him?

[Tao]

Uh... isn't that 35 billion?

100,000
1,000,000
35,000,000,000
oh, so that's why i can't retrace my family tree

[ChinaLama]

oh, so that's why i can't retrace my family tree


no that's because your ancestors disowned you after they find out YW turned their innocent Tao into a pervert. a virgin pervert but it's only a matter of time.

[Ogumo]

hey the dude has a genius IQ. How can we dispute him?

I see he has told you of his astonishing mind hahaha.

[Ogumo]

oh, so that's why i can't retrace my family tree

You are the first person that I have encountered that can joke about such a terrible event.

[ChinaLama]

You are the first person that I have encountered that can joke about such a terrible event.

wow. i thought tao's situation was just like mine: poor peoiple dont keep huge ancestry lists. Or at least not poor people w/ "modern" kids. ;)

Hey, Tao, sorry for the untoward joke if you can't trace your ancestry because of war.

[SunWuKong]

Mainland Chinese don't like Japanese as whole. Hey, Who killed your father?......some Japanese guy. Hey, Who raped your mother?......some Japanese guy. Hey, who burned your house, be-headed your baby, and invade your country?.......some Japanese guy(S).

Mainland Chinese was invaded by Japanese people. It is normal that they should in theory have a extreme dislikement of the Japanese since the Japanese invaded them.

Hey, If you were in the shoes of the family victims, I can guarantee that you will not be saying what your saying.

I can guarantee that....

so are you going to go "disliking" any random Japanese person, even if s/he is too young to have even been in WW2? modern-day Japanese individuals have to do with the atrocities that the Japanese military committed in WW2.

there is a difference between remembering the atrocities committed by the Japanese military and "disliking" Japanese individuals that have nothing to do with WW2.

hey you know what? 30 million people starved to death in the Great Leap and thousands, perhaps hundreds of thousands of people died in the Cultural Revolution. that was caused by the CCP - are you going to go "disliking" Chinese individuals now?


anyway, we've had enough "discussion" about Japanese atrocities for the time being. i'm sure the topic will arise again, but for now, give it a rest.